Wow dude. Your numbers for Granger are horribly wrong, you cannot just adjust down percentages by using percentages. To say he is shooting 33% using your math is horribly wrong. At 17 ppg Granger attempted 16 shots on average, he won't be getting as many shot attempts, playing 20 mpg, so if you say you get 75% Granger and he would actually only score 7 ppg 20 minutes a game while attempting 9 shots a game, which ends up with better percentages than OJ.
This is the classic case of bedazzling with ********.
Well, he shot 20% from 3 last year at less than 100%. Why in the world would you think he'd again be shooting 38% from 3 when he's 75% of his former self?
Come on. There is no bedazzling going on. Slow Granger down 75% and I'd be scoring on him.
Except all the lack of mobility in the world doesn't stop a standstill jumpshot from being a standstill jump shot. I just cannot actually believe that you think that a player being "at 75%" means literally everything is chopped down, especially from somebody who has made it a point to make sure people know he is educated.
And if its supposed to be some sort of commentary on how stats are overused it doesn't apply because the stats are dependent on a players performance, not the other way around. Even if he is overall less potent offensively than he was before, he will also be taking fewer shots and have less attention on him. So it is possible, and I would actually say probable, that he will be a less proficient scorer while posting more efficient numbers.
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Last edited by aamcguy; 11-14-2013 at 09:29 PM.
Time for a new sig.
First, are you saying Danny comes back worse than what he was in 5 games last year?
Second are you saying we should expect him to be 25% of his former self and should be out of the league?
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A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...
Also, even if his numbers are a little better given a small number of minutes. What about defense? Is he going to defend standing still too?
I guess the elephant in the room to me is even if Granger returns plays lights out. The knees are still an issue to me. At this point in his contract and the continued maturity of Lance, it makes Granger expendable in terms of a small market Franchise.
Can Granger be trusted. At this point I do have my concerns. Not overly concerned like some and declare it that Granger is done. With todays advancements in sports injuries anything is certainly possible. At that rate of a 80-100% Granger we cannot afford him. Don't get me wrong I prob still take EJ over Granger at this time, but both players have red flags. From a business perspective the Pacers brass has to take these things into consideration.
To be clear. I believe Granger will come back 80%+. However, purely from the best interests of the Pacers do we need Danny any longer. Our starting 5 is intact and solid. Pacers can certainly still upgrade the bench. Granger is a great player but not sure he is willing to accept not starting. A healthy DG with an expiring nets some assets. Not an issue now but this team will need a PF at some point to groom. Another wing or simply draft picks. Grangers salary is not manageable.
Simply comes down to do we ride Granger for the Gold or add to the bench/core/future and still go for Gold. Don't wanna see Granger walk with nothing in return. I feel that was a mistake with Hansbrough.
Feel like we could have an elite bench if we trade Danny. and only say that because I don't see Simon paying the Luxury even if we do win a championship.
We don't have the knicks payroll so these things are relevant.
my hunch is Granger is gone at the deadline and no matter what we get in return its gonna be sad to see Danny go.
* I would retract all this if Danny would accept the MLE salary. juust don't see it.
Pacers would still send him a championship ring. He is as part of this as any Pacer is.
Simply put, we cannot know the contract situation until the end of the year. Once we know how much Lance can demand and how much Danny can demand than we can make an accurate judgement as to if his contract is manageable or not. Danny's knee is most likely going to prevent him from maximizing his contract, so odds are you will be able to sign him for less than similar talents sign for.
We will get something by not trading him, cap space to sign someone. Trading a player just because you can't afford him next season is a terrible strategy, it doesn't really get you much usually. Granger isn't going to bring back young cheap talent with potential. All you are going to get is overpayed back-ups who make it impossible to re-sign Lance, and decrease your odds of winning a championship.
* to the other post below. im talking about the present as well as the next decade. sorry but were a small market franchise and financial matters is always present. I don't see how the pacers can afford him next year. I want more than one championship. With this roster its very possible. an elite bench is not easy to come by. you gotta give to receive.
Oh man, we've hit rock bottom here. There's no point in discussing this further, we've clarified our irreconcilable differences.
We can revisit this once Danny gets back. Until then, there's no amount of logic BnG is going to listen to. You guys are welcome to try and convince him, but at this point I figure we'll just have to let Danny do the convincing.
Last edited by Anthem; 11-14-2013 at 11:20 PM.
This space for rent.
Don't get me wrong, I want Granger on this team. I see the value, we got a chance at a ring. I believe we can win a ring in a variety a ways and this is a business. Consider the above if your Owner of the Pacers Franchise writing the checks. I think some on here forget this is just as much about $ as it is wins. If we were the knicks, lakers, Celtics, nets, heat this would be irrelevant.
just forward thinking what Birds options could be. I love our starting 5.
im with ya, don't think trades are easy. but who would of thought we could land JO for Hibbert and 10M exp in Nesto, or DC for Murphy, shed GG for a late 1st and our big plums in for Scola.
all the above is predicated on knowing we cannot afford an 80% Granger and other than lose him for nothing we can exchange it for solid depth off the bench and draft picks. You all cannot tell me losing Granger disrupts anything, he hasn't played in over a year.
I love DG33 as much as any pacer fan but who here would advise the Pacers to pay Granger 6M+ next season. I guess if this is similar to OKC trading away Harden than I am willing to eat crow.
Danny's gone, I have zero doubts. Short of him taking the minimum anyway. Which is probably more likely than him getting one last big deal at this point sadly.
My expectation is that he will not make it through 2013 before his knee gives him issues and they shut him down again. But of course he needs to get on the court for that to even happen.
Great. I'll file that away.
Just to be clear, though, 14-15ppg would make him the team's #2 scorer. Lance is averaging 14ppg, West and Hill are both under 12. That's not because they're not a threat, it's because the team is operating as a unit. I don't care about Danny's ppg nearly as much as his FG%.
This space for rent.
Some of you might remember Jim Jackson out of Ohio State. He had jumper's knee as well at just about the same age. He did stay in the league for another 5 years.