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Thread: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

  1. #901
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Preseason doesn't matter record wise but preseason is a good tool that teams use to evaluate their players and fill their rosters, Sloan and Butler look like trash in preseason and the Pacers don't sign them.

    I also remember the Pacers cutting players they drafted because of their preseason showing, so yeah preseason is not as worthless as some think.

    In Danny's case preseason was used for him to get in shape and yes he looked slow and rusty not a surprise there but is the true, that is also the only example we have of DG after surgery there is not really a way to sugar coat it.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    You're kidding - right ??

    Where are those 30 going to come from ?? OK - I'll give him OJs 12 (if he can handle it). The other 18 are coming from where ?? From whom ?? And lastly - why ?? Who doesn't deserve the minutes they're getting now ??
    Do you think that PG24 and Lance would be playing 34 to 36 mpg if the bench wasn't "average" as it is now?

    IMHO....both PG24 and Lance are averaging 35 and 37 mpg ( respectively ) because the Wing Rotation of OJ/Solo/Copeland isn't doing as good as it should be. This DOES NOT MEAN that PG24 and Lance doesn't deserve the minutes that they are getting now....it means that I think that they play more ( or less ) because OJ/Solo/Copeland are a "hit or miss" ( but mostly "miss"....hence the whole "Bench still isn't good enough" thread ).

    If Granger is able to simply "hold his own" and pretty much do a much better job of being the 1st Wing off the bench than OJ/Solo/Copeland, than I fully expect for him to take some minutes from both Lance and PG24. Granger can average 26 mpg and both PG24 / Lance can still average 33 mpg. To be fair, I do not expect that this will happen.....but if Granger is able to do a VERY GOOD job and produce on the offensive and defensive end as a borderline Starter / 6th Man....then I don't see why PG24 and Lance can't reduce their average # of minutes to 31 mpg and increase Granger's to 30 mpg.

    As to the question about who doesn't deserve the minutes that he is getting now, over the course of the game ( and I'm not referring on a regular basis ), I can argue that "Bad Lance" ( not "Good Lance" ) doesn't deserve any minutes that he's getting. This means that if Vogel sees that Lance ( or even PG24....yes, highly unlikely ) is playing erratically, inconsistently and overall not very well when he is on the floor ( in other words, we start seeing "Bad Lance" ); then Vogel will have the option to pull Lance in favor of another Wing Player ( whether it be OJ/Solo/Copeland/Granger ). Right now; I can see arguments that OJ/Solo/Copeland aren't great alternatives to "Bad Lance".... but if Granger is able to come in and do better than "Bad Lance", then I have no problem with pulling "Bad Lance" in favor of Granger. To be clear, this is a situation by situation basis...not a common occurance.

    Assuming that he is healthy ( seriously, I hate that we have to add that cavaet ), I fully expect that Granger will likely average 20 to 24 mpg and can see ( if he is doing well enough ) ramping that up to 26 mpg on average. This is not because he's WAY BETTER than PG24 and Lance and that PG24 and Lance and that he "by default" deserve the minutes......but because there is a necessity to reduce the average # of minutes that PG24 and Lance are playing over the course of the season.
    Last edited by CableKC; 12-11-2013 at 04:16 PM.
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  4. #903
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    For the record I've done a 180 from being okay with not having Danny available. I had thought he was a luxury, but a combination of OJ's poor play and the need for wing scoring has changed my mind. You still have a good shot without him, but he really could provide exactly the one piece they are missing now.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    There needs to a video montage on his return, and a scene of all the Starters standing up on their chairs saying "Oh Captain my Captain!"
    If you remember how that poem ends.........well, let's hope for a different outcome.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Any word on practice today?

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Scott Agness ‏@ScottAgness 4m
    Pacers had the day off today but Granger went through a workout in an effort to get his wind up. It was a "good workout," a witness said.



    Sounds like great news to me. But then again nobody pissed in my cornflakes this morning.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Scott Agness ‏@ScottAgness 4m
    Pacers had the day off today but Granger went through a workout in an effort to get his wind up. It was a "good workout," a witness said.



    Thanks for the report, but, seriously, why is this a ? Danny said he needed to get his conditioning up. He even said he'd be practicing when the rest of the team had time off so that he could get in condition. Not one person here has said he was in game shape. All anyone was saying was that he was in good enough condition to start going into games, not that he was ready for significant minutes.

    I just don't understand the idea that somehow lots of people have been contradicting what was in Agness' tweet. Saying he needs to get in better condition is not the same as saying he'd be panting after climbing a flight of stairs. What is it with the all or nothings around here?
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Thanks for the report, but, seriously, why is this a ? Danny said he needed to get his conditioning up. He even said he'd be practicing when the rest of the team had time off so that he could get in condition. Not one person here has said he was in game shape. All anyone was saying was that he was in good enough condition to start going into games, not that he was ready for significant minutes.

    I just don't understand the idea that somehow lots of people have been contradicting what was in Agness' tweet. Saying he needs to get in better condition is not the same as saying he'd be panting after climbing a flight of stairs. What is it with the all or nothings around here?
    I wonder what would be said if Danny didn't condition? That his knee is worse than the Pacers are telling us?

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Thanks for the report, but, seriously, why is this a ? Danny said he needed to get his conditioning up. He even said he'd be practicing when the rest of the team had time off so that he could get in condition. Not one person here has said he was in game shape. All anyone was saying was that he was in good enough condition to start going into games, not that he was ready for significant minutes.

    I just don't understand the idea that somehow lots of people have been contradicting what was in Agness' tweet. Saying he needs to get in better condition is not the same as saying he'd be panting after climbing a flight of stairs. What is it with the all or nothings around here?
    For all the Granger detractors...I'm going on record to say that I do not expect Granger to come out 100% from a health, conditioning and shooting perspective. I want to make it clear that I do not expect him to hit the ground running, I expect that there will be A LOT of rust and that it will take him at least a month to shake it all off and get back into the rhythm of the game.

    I say this because I would not be surprised one bit if we see more of these type of comments when we don't see Granger be the "Granger that we remember" the second that we see him hit the floor.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Preseason doesn't matter record wise but preseason is a good tool that teams use to evaluate their players and fill their rosters, Sloan and Butler look like trash in preseason and the Pacers don't sign them.

    I also remember the Pacers cutting players they drafted because of their preseason showing, so yeah preseason is not as worthless as some think.

    In Danny's case preseason was used for him to get in shape and yes he looked slow and rusty not a surprise there but is the true, that is also the only example we have of DG after surgery there is not really a way to sugar coat it.
    Danny looked good in his last preseason game.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Thanks for the report, but, seriously, why is this a ? Danny said he needed to get his conditioning up. He even said he'd be practicing when the rest of the team had time off so that he could get in condition. Not one person here has said he was in game shape. All anyone was saying was that he was in good enough condition to start going into games, not that he was ready for significant minutes.

    I just don't understand the idea that somehow lots of people have been contradicting what was in Agness' tweet. Saying he needs to get in better condition is not the same as saying he'd be panting after climbing a flight of stairs. What is it with the all or nothings around here?
    Exactly.

  20. #912

    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    For all the Granger detractors...I'm going on record to say that I do not expect Granger to come out 100% from a health, conditioning and shooting perspective. I want to make it clear that I do not expect him to hit the ground running, I expect that there will be A LOT of rust and that it will take him at least a month to shake it all off and get back into the rhythm of the game.

    I say this because I would not be surprised one bit if we see more of these type of comments when we don't see Granger be the "Granger that we remember" the second that we see him hit the floor.
    Pretty much, Westrbook, Rose, and Bryant all looked rusty when they came to play real NBA games.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    For all the Granger detractors...I'm going on record to say that I do not expect Granger to come out 100% from a health, conditioning and shooting perspective. I want to make it clear that I do not expect him to hit the ground running, I expect that there will be A LOT of rust and that it will take him at least a month to shake it all off and get back into the rhythm of the game.
    Well, I pretty much agree with you but I don't think he will get to the 100% level this year. Does that make me a detractor? I hope not. Was DWest 100% the year he came back? Was Michael Jordan the year he came back...not even having a knee injury?

    With that said, I don't think I'm a detractor. I am a Danny Granger fan. I just know there are several much better players on this roster now. We are 19-3. Maybe that's not enough proof? I appreciate Danny for what he has done and I hope he gets back on the court and gives us 15ppg. That would be fantastic. But he never was close to Paul George level. He will not be as valuable as Hibbert. I doubt he plays as well as DWest or Hill this year. And Lance Stephenson has a higher ceiling. I like all of these guys, but that's just how I see it.

    Edit: Just to put this in perspective. There is NO WAY we could beat the Heat without Roy Hibbert. That's just how valuable that man is to this team.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Well, I pretty much agree with you but I don't think he will get to the 100% level this year. Does that make me a detractor? I hope not. Was DWest 100% the year he came back? Was Michael Jordan the year he came back...not even having a knee injury?

    With that said, I don't think I'm a detractor. I am a Danny Granger fan. I just know there are several much better players on this roster now. We are 19-3. Maybe that's not enough proof? I appreciate Danny for what he has done and I hope he gets back on the court and gives us 15ppg. That would be fantastic. But he never was close to Paul George level. He will not be as valuable as Hibbert. I doubt he plays as well as DWest or Hill this year. And Lance Stephenson has a higher ceiling. I like all of these guys, but that's just how I see it.

    Edit: Just to put this in perspective. There is NO WAY we could beat the Heat without Roy Hibbert. That's just how valuable that man is to this team.
    I expect ( more hope ) that he will be 75% Granger for the rest of the season...cuz honestly, that's better than what OJ/Solo/Copeland can currently give. I fully expect that there will be some that will point to this expected uphill climb after his eventual return as proof positive that he's just not that good anymore. My whole point is that I expect that it will take time for him to get back to whatever his post-injury form will be.
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    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Right now Paul George averages just under 37 mpg, and Lance Stephenson averages 34.5, so let's say 35 for him.

    96 - 37 - 35 = 24 minutes. I'm satisfied with Danny playing that much when he's capable.
    i think it is safe guess that Danny will be getting minutes from both. Both Paul and Lance are playing more minutes than they really should because the drop between them and OJ/Solo is so much. Danny will give the Pacers another guy that can provide quality play. I expect the minutes to even out in a 3 wing rotation.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    I hope we don't lose sight of how important Lance has become at the end of games to get the offense moving in a healthy way without making a turnover. GHill showed us last night how much he struggles when a top defense like Miami really revs it up.

    While Granger is good and brings great assets, his perimeter and slashing game is more similar to GHill and PG than Lance. As I've written before, we don't need three hammers. We need a couple of hammers and a wrench.

    Well you can play Lance with Danny but here are some line ups I'd like to see....



    Scola
    Cope
    Roy
    Paul
    CJ


    Cope
    Paul
    Roy
    Danny
    CJ

    West
    Danny
    Roy
    Paul
    Lance

    West
    Cope
    Roy
    Danny
    Paul <-- This is like a Scottie Pippen thing where for short periods of time, he'd play PG/Point forward or the guy who brings the ball up.



    Keep in mind, these aren't lineups I wanna see to START the game. But lineups I'd like to see thrown out there during reg season to see which are effective and why. It's a mad scientist thing when you have a team so stacked with talent.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by immortality View Post
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    Pretty much, Westrbook, Rose, and Bryant all looked rusty when they came to play real NBA games.
    Not 0. That cat returned as if nothing had ever happened. Of course, he had the least severe injury and is still young.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
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    i think it is safe guess that Danny will be getting minutes from both. Both Paul and Lance are playing more minutes than they really should because the drop between them and OJ/Solo is so much. Danny will give the Pacers another guy that can provide quality play. I expect the minutes to even out in a 3 wing rotation.
    That's exactly what we need to see happen. Both PG and Lance need to give up a few minutes now but we don't have the right option to do that. I expect that to happen within a short time of Granger returning. If Granger can stay healthy over the long run I expect him to continue to improve to the point that he'll simply be the better option for heavy minutes then Lance. At that point I'd expect to see all 3 players get similar minutes with PG getting slightly more then Granger and Granger getting slightly more then Lance.

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  32. #919

    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Just go in on the tail end of this topic and started thinking about minutes played. Do we need PG to play 36+ minutes a game for the entire season? Lance? The grind that is the regular season is a weight that all teams pay a price for during the playoffs. The long minutes lead to nagging injuries that just get worse and/or cause guys to miss games. When Danny comes back and gets in shape, Frank will actually have a chance to rest a starter for a game (or more if needed) without losing the balance necessary for this team to keep their winning ways. Danny as a 4 would mean that neither Roy or Luis would have to play with a nagging sprain or strain. Danny as a wing means PG and Lance don't have too either.

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  34. #920
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Danny looked good in his last preseason game.

    Yes he did, he was moving very well with and without the ball. I don't think training camp and the heavy minutes Granger played during the preseason was a waste of time, it will help in his return. He's been out for several weeks but it's not really like he's been out for a year and a half and is just being released by his doctor from knee surgery this week.

  35. #921
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nba/1137/danny-granger


    Danny Granger (calf) has been declared out for Tuesday's game against the Heat, but is hoping to play Friday against the Bobcats.

    Dec 10 - 11:54 AM


    Source: Brian Windhorst on Twitter

  36. #922
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    2 days. Just 2 days.

  37. #923

    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    So what's the deal, did we ever find a Robin for Danny's Batman?

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-...cers-on-friday


    ✔ @SpearsNBAYahoo
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    Pacers forward Danny Granger says there is "a good chance" he makes his season debut on Friday.


    11:47 AM - 10 Dec 2013

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  41. #925
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    I'm not sure I see the point in sharing tweets from Tuesday morning?

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