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Thread: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Oh and yes he should obviously come off the bench, me bringing up his 2009 season is in no way, shape, or form an endorsement for him to start or even play more than 20 minutes a game.

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Roy, Paul, Lance and David West are all better than Granger. They are so good they are making George Hill get heat around here. We have great players, not just good. This is not the JOb era when Granger is compared to Josh McRoberts, Troy Murphy and Mike Dunleavy. I can assure you that David West would look like a stud with that group too.

    Edit: Seriously, one can argue that Lance isn't as good because he's not matured yet. But who would get paid more on the open market? Paul or Danny? Roy or Danny? DWest or Danny? DWest used to give us fits and easily matched Danny in those games as a Hornet.
    You mean the David West who had CP3 at point guard and Tyson Chandler at center? I mean as long as we're talking about 5 man lineups.

    I mean I always think it is easier to play with good players on my team than with bad players.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    No, danny Granger only had good numbers because he had such bad teammates. Forget Chris Paul making the game easier on David West. And having to play against the likes of Troy Murphy in the post while Danny got doubled.

    I don't know why danny even commanded any defensive pressure. He cant dribble or pass. The guy just needs to stand with his hands up and danny is useless.

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Two players' stats both from their fourth season in the NBA

    Player A
    25.8 PPG 5.1 RPG 2.7 APG 1.4 BPG 1.0 SPG 44.7% FG 40.4% 3PT 87.8% FT 36.2 MPG
    Player B
    23.8 PPG 5.8 RPG 3.6 APG .3 BPG 2.0 SPG 46.1% FG 40.6% 3PT 85.8% FT 37.1 MPG

    Player A is Danny Granger.
    Player B is Paul George.

    Look, I'm really not trying to turn this into a debate between the two of them because at this point Paul is the superior player by a good margin, but this comment that Danny was just a "chucker" is a bit silly. His year 4 season was every bit as impressive statistically as what Paul is doing.

    You know what the difference was and is? Do any of you remember our most used 5 man lineup that year? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Here I'll remind you

    TJ Ford
    Marquis Daniels
    Danny Granger
    Troy Murphy
    Rasho Nesterovic

    compare that to

    George Hill
    Lance Stephenson
    Paul George
    David West
    Roy Hibbert

    So yeah 2009 Danny Granger was a fantastic player, no he was not the defender Paul is, but dude was more than just a chucker. Just because he got hurt and also aged doesn't mean we should forget what he was able to do just so we can have a nice narrative. Because remember we have no idea what the future holds for Paul yet.
    Paul's season this year is far more impressive. Granger racked up numbers on bad teams over the years. Just because he did that, does not mean those numbers weren't very much inflated especially in a JOb style offense.
    Heck, Troy Murphy went from averaging 14.6 to 3.6ppg...right after leaving Indy. It's a known fact when players move to better teams their numbers almost always drop dramatically. The same would be true for Danny so Paul's numbers are unbelievable.

    In fact, there were times when Marquis Daniels seemed to be our best player at times. Also, what about the time when people thought Mike Dunleavy should have an all-star nod because he was pretty darn close to as good as Granger? These things did happen and while Granger became a bit better later, the difference isn't that great. I vividly recall games when DWest seemed like the better player and in fact he is.

    Edit: don't take my word for it. Mark Boyle said Lance is more talented didn't he? I think Mark knows a bit about the team.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Oh and yes he should obviously come off the bench, me bringing up his 2009 season is in no way, shape, or form an endorsement for him to start or even play more than 20 minutes a game.
    He said it himself that he was a chucker not sure why you guys are getting upset it is the true, him saying it should put an stop to the overreaction at the words "chucker" and "Danny" on the same sentence(at least I hope).

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    He said it himself that he was a chucker not sure why you guys are getting upset it is the true, him saying it should put an stop to the overreaction at the words "chucker" and "Danny" on the same sentence(at least I hope).
    Show me the quote where he said chucker. Not broussards words.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Just because a player is more talented does not mean his better. Larry Bird has said Lance has been the most talented player on the roster since he was drafted. Is Lance our best player? Nope. Not even close

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    Just because a player is more talented does not mean his better. Larry Bird has said Lance has been the most talented player on the roster since he was drafted. Is Lance our best player? Nope. Not even close
    Agreed on that point. It's all a matter of meeting one's potential. Danny maximized his potential as a Pacer. You really have to respect him and his work ethic. I'm glad he's coming back. But you could even see it his last full season. Even surrounded by young, albeit talented, players his numbers dropped significantly. He's not a 20ppg scorer on an above .500 team. He's a very good player who could start on a championship team but he's at best #3 on that team. He's Batman on JOb's team. Robin on a .500 team. ...and the Joker on a champion.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Agreed on that point. It's all a matter of meeting one's potential. Danny maximized his potential as a Pacer. You really have to respect him and his work ethic. I'm glad he's coming back. But you could even see it his last full season. Even surrounded by young, albeit talented, players his numbers dropped significantly. He's not a 20ppg scorer on an above .500 team. He's a very good player who could start on a championship team but he's at best #3 on that team. He's Batman on JOb's team. Robin on a .500 team. ...and the Joker on a champion.
    that is really funny lol

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    You're right it is much harder to put up good stats surrounded by George Hill, Lance Stephenson, David West, and Roy Hibbert. I'm just going to see myself out because I really don't feel like arguing about two of my all time favorite Pacers who both happened to be fantastic players but in two completely different situations. If you can't see how the situations are completely different than I am not going to be able to convince you of it.

    Also, yes Danny is the joker on a champion. Good job, great analogy really in depth stuff.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    The local news in Fort Wayne just said he was playing Friday. I sure hope he can stay healthy.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Good God....both sides have been arguing the same old points for the last year. Until he actually steps on the court and does something and shakes off whatever rust he has......none of us know how well or poorly he's going to do until he levels off and plays at whatever level ( whether it be 75% of his pre-2009 form or a complete shell of his former self ).

    Can we re-visit this Granger discussion in a month? I fully expect for him to have A LOT of rust on Granger that he will need to shake off for the next couple of weeks. If he still looks no better than Butler/OJ/Solo/Copeland by mid-January....then I am willing to concede that he's just a huge Expiring contract and be ultimately disappointed.
    Last edited by CableKC; 12-20-2013 at 01:20 AM.
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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Two players' stats both from their fourth season in the NBA

    Player A
    25.8 PPG 5.1 RPG 2.7 APG 1.4 BPG 1.0 SPG 44.7% FG 40.4% 3PT 87.8% FT 36.2 MPG
    Player B
    23.8 PPG 5.8 RPG 3.6 APG .3 BPG 2.0 SPG 46.1% FG 40.6% 3PT 85.8% FT 37.1 MPG

    Player A is Danny Granger.
    Player B is Paul George.
    As a guy who really likes both players, I'm kinda shocked that Danny's assist numbers are as close to PG's as they are. Danny had 2.7 APG, Paul had 3.6 APG?

    Who the heck was Danny passing to?
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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    As a guy who really likes both players, I'm kinda shocked that Danny's assist numbers are as close to PG's as they are. Danny had 2.7 APG, Paul had 3.6 APG?

    Who the heck was Danny passing to?
    How soon we forget Quisy for Threesy.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Seems most here have truly forgotten just how good Danny Granger was. Dunno if thats because they werent really following that close back then or just have selective memory but either way its pretty sad. In the first 15 or 20 games this year Paul played on a similar level as Danny did his best season. We will see if Paul can maintain such throughout the season, but hes definitely hit a rougher patch the last few games, albeit against some pretty stiff competition. Danny was an allstar on a bad team, something we all know is not the easiest thing to do as guys from the better teams are most often given the nods. He was just that good. How good will he be coming back, who knows for certain, but seems most are resigned to thinking what most of the league is hoping-he will be nothing like his former self. Otherwise, its gonna be borderline unfair to the other teams if he comes back and is anything resembling his former self.

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    So are you saying that he was a chucker? I'll be waiting for the answer
    For those capable of understanding the difference, his JOB (sic) was to be a chucker, so he acted as one. For those who see the world as all or nothing, since he CAN and COULD do things other than just chuck up shots, no, he himself is not a chucker no matter what he might or might not have said.

    But, fine, the narrative has now moved to people implying that even in his prime Danny would have been a bench player at best on this team, which has gone beyond silly.

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    As a guy who really likes both players, I'm kinda shocked that Danny's assist numbers are as close to PG's as they are. Danny had 2.7 APG, Paul had 3.6 APG?

    Who the heck was Danny passing to?

    That 08-09 Pacer team was actually 5th in the NBA in scoring at 105.1 PPG. The problem is that we gave up 106.2 PPG.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/te...game/year/2009

    Ford, Muprhy, Daniels, and Jack all averaged double figures in addition to Granger. Dunleavy did too, but he only played a tiny amount of games because of injury.

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    For those capable of understanding the difference, his JOB (sic) was to be a chucker, so he acted as one. For those who see the world as all or nothing, since he CAN and COULD do things other than just chuck up shots, no, he himself is not a chucker no matter what he might or might not have said.
    So you are admitting that he was a chucker(wow) but then you are saying that he was forced to be a chucker under JOB, interesting take.

    Now the question is if he was forced to be a chucker under JOB how come he was still a chucker under Vogel?

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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    As a guy who really likes both players, I'm kinda shocked that Danny's assist numbers are as close to PG's as they are. Danny had 2.7 APG, Paul had 3.6 APG?

    Who the heck was Danny passing to?
    Obviously himself.
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    Default Re: BREAKING NEWS: DG has called himself a chucker

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    So you are admitting that he was a chucker(wow) but then you are saying that he was forced to be a chucker under JOB, interesting take.

    Now the question is if he was forced to be a chucker under JOB how come he was still a chucker under Vogel?
    I don't think that's any new revelation--JOB's offense gave Danny the perpetual green light, and he took a lot of ill-advised shots as a result.

    As for your second question, I think Danny just got so used to the role of being the only really dependable scorer on this team that he kept up the habit. The last time he was healthy, Roy was an inconsistent offensive option (and really, still is), PG obviously wasn't what he is now, Lance wasn't even dressing for games...I mean he still was the alpha dog and we still needed him to score. That's why his reintroduction to the lineup will be so interesting. He will be forced to play a supporting role as opposed to carrying the load. It's another reason I think coming off the bench will be better for him, in case he does revert back into chucker mode.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    What I hope to see from Danny is timely offense, better defense than OJ, rebound, mental toughness and some passion.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    I'm not going to trash Granger. He played very hard for the Pacers for a long time and was an entertaining player to watch on an otherwise cesspool of a team with a hideous coach. And then he was the best scorer on a Pacer team that won 63% of its games in the 11-12 season. His career has been clouded by some very bad luck in that he came of age with the likes of Murphy/Dunleavy/Ford/Tinsley/Daniels, and then he had to deal with a brutal injury at a relatively young age. He played hard for the Pacers for a long time and deserved better fortune.

    Now, I do think that the harsh realities of professional sports will make it virtually impossible to keep him beyond this season. But just because he isn't a top player for us anymore doesn't mean that I'm going to trash him and act like he didn't used to be really good. He was a damn solid player and I do think that his professionalism and leadership were instrumental for the young guys. Here's to hoping he can come back and carve out a nice role on this team and have a nice finish to his Pacer career. Lord knows we could use a legitimate wing off of the bench.

    Also, DG was a much needed classy personality for the Pacers after all of the unlikable a-holes we had in the mid 2000's.
    Last edited by Sollozzo; 12-20-2013 at 09:51 AM.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    If Danny does return to the floor tonight I won't be expecting a lot out of him. He's going to be beyond rusty and hopefully there won't be too much complaining.
    Last edited by Handoverfist; 12-20-2013 at 09:58 AM.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    Its hard for me to imagine that he can't at least provide us what pulp or Solo was giving us.... that isn't asking for much. Anything more than that is just gravy.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger 13-14 Discussion

    It sounds like we won't have any problem keeping Granger for vet minimum, since he's a chucker who never played defense or offense, was never more than a 6th man if he hadn't played for the worst team in the league and will be lucky to be able to play as well as the 15th guy on a championship team.
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