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Thread: Post of the Night:

  1. #1
    George Hill Apologist mattie's Avatar
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    Default Post of the Night:

    http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthre...=1#post1724345

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    Hill is going to make you guys eat your words.

    Preach.

    Note - He made this comment well before George Hill hit the dagger that put the Pellies to sleep...
    Find me on the internets @mattiecolin

    Read it and weep:

    When George Hill is above 15% usage we won 73.5% of games. Below 15% usage we won 61.9%

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  3. #2

    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    I know you have been on PD for awhile, shouldn't you expect those kind of reactions.

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    Formerly PacerFanInAZ Cactus Jax's Avatar
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    It's the beginning of a new season, and really the first season since Bird coached teams where there was Title aspirations before the season started. Last season was more of a surprise during the playoffs, and 03/04 was also a bit of a surprise considering the team had lost Brad Miller.

    Didn't make my point lol, people are going to freak out when the team isn't dominating all the time hehe.

    Oh and I forgot the season that shall not be named: 04/05, there definently were title aspirations there.
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

    ----------------- Reggie Miller

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    The game thread was absolutley horrid though. I checked out before the 1st quarter had even ended because the doom and gloom was too much to take. I hope the posters mostly responsible aren't normal game thread frequenters this season because it looked like they were looking for any excuse to get upset and push an agenda about their particular player. I'd have to think that Lance performing so well last night didn't help Hill's case.

    In particular I'm never worried about Hill because he is quite routinely our 2nd or 3rd best performer of the night, regardless of who our star(s) were that night.

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  8. #5
    George Hill Apologist mattie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Exactly, it's an agenda. Hill is at least in the top half of point guards in the league at the most loaded position. He's among the top 5 defenders at his position. He's damn good. But he will NEVER be appreciated in Indiana because people want a "true PG" (whatever the **** that means).

    The irony, is a true PG would never work as we have a ball dominate star that needs the ball in his hands. Like Wade, like Harden, like Kobe, like James, you don't need Chris Paul to play with these guys.

    Anyone notice how Kobe relegated Nash to an average PG at best??

    Quote Originally Posted by aamcguy View Post
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    The game thread was absolutley horrid though. I checked out before the 1st quarter had even ended because the doom and gloom was too much to take. I hope the posters mostly responsible aren't normal game thread frequenters this season because it looked like they were looking for any excuse to get upset and push an agenda about their particular player. I'd have to think that Lance performing so well last night didn't help Hill's case.

    In particular I'm never worried about Hill because he is quite routinely our 2nd or 3rd best performer of the night, regardless of who our star(s) were that night.
    The agenda is to make Lance the starting point now- which is unnecessary, because if you have a distributing two who likes the ball in his hand, he'll play well with someone like Hill who doesn't always need. Hill and Lance play very well together since they cover eachothers strengths and weaknesses.

    Lance isn't quick enough to bring the ball up the court, or does he have the dribbling skills. He can make boneheaded decisions that can stall the offense at times. However, he has great court vision and can really make some nice plays.

    Hill always makes the right decision, never turns the ball over and is absolutely fantastic late in games when the defense turns up and Lance's erratic ball handling can spell disaster...

    Lance full time at point would be a disaster... but Lance playing the 2 with plenty of chances to create within the offense? Well tonight the backcourt had 35 points and 8 assists. Pretty damn good.
    Find me on the internets @mattiecolin

    Read it and weep:

    When George Hill is above 15% usage we won 73.5% of games. Below 15% usage we won 61.9%

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by aamcguy View Post
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    The game thread was absolutley horrid though. I checked out before the 1st quarter had even ended because the doom and gloom was too much to take. I hope the posters mostly responsible aren't normal game thread frequenters this season because it looked like they were looking for any excuse to get upset and push an agenda about their particular player. I'd have to think that Lance performing so well last night didn't help Hill's case.

    In particular I'm never worried about Hill because he is quite routinely our 2nd or 3rd best performer of the night, regardless of who our star(s) were that night.
    This is what I do. Over the course of the season if I notice a certain poster is always overly negative, always overreacting to the littlest things I put them on my ignore list. Once the season is over I empty my ignore list, except for a select few. Just have to be careful not to over do it. Ignore people too quickly and it becomes a ghost town. If it wasn't for that I probably would have abandoned PD Game Threads last year.
    Last edited by Eleazar; 10-31-2013 at 12:35 PM.

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  12. #7
    All Hail CJ Watson! Nuntius's Avatar
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    This is what I do. Over the course of the if I notice a certain poster is always overly negative, always overreacting to the littlest things I put them on my ignore list. Once the season is over I empty my ignore list, except for a select few. Just have to be careful not to over do it. Ignore people too quickly and it becomes a ghost town. If it wasn't for that I probably would have abandoned PD Game Threads last year.
    Am I the only one that I never ignore anyone and instead argue with all the debbie downers?
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
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    George Hill Apologist mattie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    Am I the only one that I never ignore anyone and instead argue with all the debbie downers?
    I don't ignore anyone really... As much as I get into with with Vnz, I actually love his posting lol I'm quite certain he doesn't feel the same about me, but that's ok =)
    Find me on the internets @mattiecolin

    Read it and weep:

    When George Hill is above 15% usage we won 73.5% of games. Below 15% usage we won 61.9%

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    I think a lot of people are taking the Hill comments out of context as well. I personally love Hill's game. Anyone who has seen me post on here for a while knows that I value defense and size more than almost anything else(well defense). Hill is a great defender and I like the fact that he has that veteran swagger that will get us points when others are struggling.

    That being said, Hill is paid way too much. This isn't me hating on him, this is just me recognizing the fact that his contract could be a huge problem in resigning Lance. Lance is far more important to the future of this team than Hill is. Lance, is probably better for the starting lineup over Hill as well as he is a better playmaker. Hill is a scoring guard who can play defense, but we have enough scoring with our starters, I want someone who can get the ball to them. Lance does a better job at that.

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by aamcguy View Post
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    The game thread was absolutley horrid though. I checked out before the 1st quarter had even ended because the doom and gloom was too much to take. I hope the posters mostly responsible aren't normal game thread frequenters this season because it looked like they were looking for any excuse to get upset and push an agenda about their particular player. I'd have to think that Lance performing so well last night didn't help Hill's case.

    In particular I'm never worried about Hill because he is quite routinely our 2nd or 3rd best performer of the night, regardless of who our star(s) were that night.
    Yeah, game threads become annoying when the team is not performing well. The worst part is that they don't even seem to have patience. They start to complain right off the gate even in the the first 5 minutes of the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by mattie View Post
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    Exactly, it's an agenda. Hill is at least in the top half of point guards in the league at the most loaded position. He's among the top 5 defenders at his position. He's damn good. But he will NEVER be appreciated in Indiana because people want a "true PG" (whatever the **** that means).

    The irony, is a true PG would never work as we have a ball dominate star that needs the ball in his hands. Like Wade, like Harden, like Kobe, like James, you don't need Chris Paul to play with these guys.
    It is an agenda indeed. It isn't that people have anything against Hill in particular. People just seem to be obsessed with "true PGs". People are dying so much to have a "true PG" that some are actually supporting that we're not going to win a title unless we get that "true PG". The most funny thing is that this kind of "true PG" has almost never led his team to a title (the exceptions are few). It's almost crazy if you think about it. We have a great fit for us and we try to "upgrade" it by craving for a worse fit that would change our style altogether.

    About Hill now. I guess that it depends on what you mean by top half. I would place Hill in the top 15 which would mean that he is an average starter. For our team he is a lot better than 15, of course, but in general that's where I'd place him. I had him ranked in the same range with Teague, Dragic and Conley but Conley differentiated himself in the playoffs and earned a place in the top 10.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

    Panopticon

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    CJ Watson - 20 points on 6/10 shooting!

    13/4/2014

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Awesome View Post
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    I think a lot of people are taking the Hill comments out of context as well. I personally love Hill's game. Anyone who has seen me post on here for a while knows that I value defense and size more than almost anything else(well defense). Hill is a great defender and I like the fact that he has that veteran swagger that will get us points when others are struggling.

    That being said, Hill is paid way too much. This isn't me hating on him, this is just me recognizing the fact that his contract could be a huge problem in resigning Lance. Lance is far more important to the future of this team than Hill is. Lance, is probably better for the starting lineup over Hill as well as he is a better playmaker. Hill is a scoring guard who can play defense, but we have enough scoring with our starters, I want someone who can get the ball to them. Lance does a better job at that.
    I don't get how you can say Hill is getting paid too much when Jarret Jack is earning 6.3 million as a bench player, and Hill is earning 8 million as a starter. I also would definitely argue that Hill is a better overall player than Jarret Jack.

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  22. #12
    All Hail CJ Watson! Nuntius's Avatar
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Awesome View Post
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    That being said, Hill is paid way too much. This isn't me hating on him, this is just me recognizing the fact that his contract could be a huge problem in resigning Lance.
    Hill's contract is very fair. He has an 8M per year contract. Jeff Teague signed a new contract this summer for exactly the same amount. Mike Conley signed a 9M per year in 2010 but he also proved to be a notch above Hill in the playoffs. Goran Dragic signed a 7.5M per year in the same summer as Hill.

    All it takes is one look around the league and you'll see that Hill's contract is reflective of his trade value. If you think that we shouldn't spent 8 millions on a PG when we have Lance and George, then that's an entirely different discussion. But Hill's contract is fair. We didn't overpay.

    Also, we will re-sign Lance. If Granger's expiring doesn't give us enough space to re-sign him then we will trade Copeland or Ian or we will just not pick up Scola's unguaranteed deal. But the point is that we will re-sign Lance.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

    Panopticon

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    CJ Watson - 20 points on 6/10 shooting!

    13/4/2014

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    Am I the only one that I never ignore anyone and instead argue with all the debbie downers?
    I don't ignore anyone. Probably not the best idea, but I refuse to live in an echo chamber.
    BillS

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    The main problem I have with Hill is his ball handling skills. Other teams pressure him bringing the ball up the court and he struggles. Then the Pacers offense has a very limited time to work their sets, and as a result, there are so many last second hoists/shot clock violations. Hill can certainly shoot though, but that's about his only skill set.

    Got to figure that out along with all the other TOs. We can beat bad teams and fringe playoff teams without our best efforts, but it won't work against the elite.

    This Pacers squad is too damn talented.
    Lance + Starting SG = Awesome

    Now really free Lance!

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    I think Lance can be as much a distributor as Pippen was. In fact I want to see a pick and switch move by Lance and George when there are smaller guards on Lance. I want Hill taking corner 3s and 3s from the top. He doesn't have to initiate the offense to start at the one. He needs to hit open jumpers and play hard nose defense on opposing point guards.

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I don't ignore anyone. Probably not the best idea, but I refuse to live in an echo chamber.
    Same here. Even Old Blu. I like the variety and the humor I find in some posts. It takes two to have an argument in case
    some of you have not figured that out yet. :-)
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by mattie View Post
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    Lance isn't quick enough to bring the ball up the court, or does he have the dribbling skills.
    Huh? Lance isn't quick and doesn't have dribbling skills?
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Huh? Lance isn't quick and doesn't have dribbling skills?
    Watch him against pressure. In the open court its okay because he has the space to run around people, but he runs into trouble when his man can run him into other players. He has good dribbling skills, but he also has a loose dribble. Conversely, Hill dribbles close to his body.

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I don't ignore anyone. Probably not the best idea, but I refuse to live in an echo chamber.
    You do realize you won't be living in an echo chamber if you only ignore a few/handful, right?

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by mattie View Post
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    Exactly, it's an agenda. Hill is at least in the top half of point guards in the league at the most loaded position. He's among the top 5 defenders at his position. He's damn good. But he will NEVER be appreciated in Indiana because people want a "true PG" (whatever the **** that means).
    Plenty of people appreciate Hill. I know I do.

    It's not an "In Indiana" thing. There are fans that like this in every franchise.
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  38. #21
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Count me as a George Hill fan. His calm demeanor and steady play are very much a net plus.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  39. #22

    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Love Hill. Was one of the few that felt like he'd live up to his contract, and he has, but it seems like he struggles to deliver the tight window passes. I think it's more him being extra careful with the ball than not being capable, but at times he does miss passes. I'd prefer we take our lumps with Paul and Lance initiating most of our offensive sets with the hope that one day their size, vision, and passing will make us a more dynamic offense. Hill's great off the ball anyway.

  40. #23
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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I don't ignore anyone. Probably not the best idea, but I refuse to live in an echo chamber.
    I remember when I used to think this way, I like the feature, I can ignore those that are always trying to disagree with me about anything for no reason



    (just watch one of those guys disagreeing with me about ignoring people as soon as I post this)

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    I love Hill. But excessively praising him for 1 good half is as foolish as condemning him for a bad one.

    He was terrible in the first half, and out of this world in the second. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

    I'm hoping his lights out second half will get him going, it had been a struggle for him up to that point.

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    Default Re: Post of the Night:

    My main problem with George Hill is when he goes through those stretches were he's almost invisible on the court, then he'll magically burst out of it and do what he did in the 2nd half last night. You can't pay a guy $8 million a year and have him disappear for stretches of games at a time. Game 1 he was nonexistent the entire game, last night this was his contribution...

    1st quarter
    11:37 - George Hill misses 26-foot three point jumper
    8:26 George Hill misses 28-foot three point jumper
    6:41 George Hill misses 28-foot three point jumper
    5:11 George Hill bad pass (Eric Gordon steals)
    5:09 George Hill personal foul (Eric Gordon draws the foul)
    4:31 David West makes driving layup (George Hill assists)

    2nd quarter
    7:56 George Hill enters the game for Orlando Johnson
    5:50 George Hill traveling
    5:22 George Hill makes free throw 1 of 2
    5:22 George Hill makes free throw 2 of 2

    4:18 George Hill makes 25-foot three point jumper (Lance Stephenson assists)
    0:34 George Hill personal foul (Jrue Holiday draws the foul)

    Then in the 3rd quarter he started to pick it up a bit. He goes through these stretches way too often for a guy who is supposed to be one of the cornerstones of the franchise.

    I like G.Hill and I don't particularly not want him on this team, I just want him to be more consistent.
    Grown Man Ball

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