"Like them or not, Bill Belichick and Tom Brady are among the best who’ve ever lived, and any refusal to acknowledge that is the product of jealousy or rank ignorance." Bob Kravitz
I keep hearing that preseason doesn't matter. I don't disagree with that at all. But I do hope our guys are trying to win...or better, get value by testing different approaches. Are we just out there letting other teams win? Just jackin' around?
In any event, this isn't magical. Either our tests are failing or effort is pretty bad.
I would not say preseason doesn't matter. I would say that a team's won loss record doesn't matter. And I would say preseason is less important for the really good teams that have the same coach and most of their key payers returning from the year before.
and I would strongly say that the most important portion of October is the first week which is the training camp portion
These two games have been deflating or at least underwhelming for me, but I'm not going to read too much into them. I mean if they had come out and kicked serious *** both of these games, I wouldn't suddenly change my expectations for the better, so I'm not going to do the opposite.
If they play like this the first two real games, that's different.
Also, are we really fouling this much more, or are the refs being pickier this preseason than they seemed to be last year?
If I had any concern from the first 2 games it would be that we were out rebounded and that shouldn't happen to this team. However the lineup experiments had a lot to do with that. I didn't see the 2cd. game but the team showed a lack of hussle for boards during the first game.
I have zero problem with people saying that pre-season doesn't mean very much as long as they are consistent about it. In other words we can't just blow over bad play by saying "oh it's just pre-season" but in the very next sentence say "but player X looked really good out there today". In other words it either matters or it doesn't, you can't cherry pick.
I'm sorry but after watching these two games I think I want to vomit. We are missing shots, lots and lots of rust so I can live with that. What I can't stand is the lack of energy and being out rebounded not to mention that we basically provided a concierge and a doorman for the Rockets to drive to the basket.
Again I know it's pre-season so there is no need to panic, but I'm not going to lie either, it' hasn't looked good or even remotely like Pacers/Vogel basketball.
Pacers not doing the 3 things that made them so effective last season.
1. Offensive Rebounding
2. Getting back on D to prevent easy passes over the top in transition.
3. Not helping the helper on D.
Could be a result of "its pre-season" so the guys aren't putting max effort into it. I think the starters are showing a lack of effort when compared to bench. That early deficit today was all on the starters.
I am encourage by Granger though, overall he had a decent game. BUt he is lacking anu sort of explosiveness in this leaping abilities.
Last edited by graphic-er; 10-11-2013 at 02:05 AM.
You can't get champagne from a garden hose.
I honestly think it could be as simple as having a young coach. I think he's proven that he's able to make good adjustments and develop a successful team system. But except for in the playoffs when they have lots of time to intensely study one opponent, any changes or new wrinkles introduced take a lot of time and fine-tuning to ultimately make a positive impact. He's a good teacher, but perhaps not yet a "quick" teacher.
I'm not worried. Barring injury issues, I think we'll be rolling by the start of the regular season or very shortly thereafter.
Lets see.... I was able to catch the first 5 mins of Q1 then had to leave for work.... ugh, hate 2nd shift.... anyway, I did get to see Paul commit 2 turnovers with his totally unacceptable ball handling and pick up a quick foul.... that was certainly refreshing.
Oh,,, and I almost forgot to mention the Granger steal and resulting one man break.... oh yeah right, I guess I forgot about that because after he got the ball he freakin lumbered down the floor like an old man with a bum knee and missed an uncontested layup. That was f'n sweet! ...not...
Keep in mind now that I ONLY got to witness the first 5 mins of the game.... after reading this thread I am assuming that I was fortunate to NOT have seen the rest of the crap fest.
Lets see.... 96 mins of Pacers basketball now and all I can tell ya is that the Bulls and the Rockets look pretty good.... ehhhhhhhh.... not diggin it folks, not diggin it at all.
Last edited by FireTheCoach; 10-11-2013 at 03:40 AM.
I was concerned by the starters' offense. (The subs terrible defense I can understand as they are new to the system.) Neither Danny nor Lance helped things. The problems started with PG trying to initiate the offense and doing quite poorly with several turnovers. Hill was not able to get any space or loosen the defense, which I found curious (until maybe pacersforever mentioned Beverly is a good defender?).
Hibbert was completely ineffective when he got the ball, but I guess you can count Howard as the reason there. DWest was the only one who showed up with some decent offense, but he had to get warmed up.
Either we will throw off the really bad rust or Houston is just a bad defensive matchup for us.
"I like our group of people," Ainge told USA Today. "I'm trying to teach them about basketball, and they're trying to teach me about analytics."
OJ might have been aggressive on offense, but the dude made some stupid plays. Which many on the team did. I really think it is about spacing and chemistry. And they are watching Danny too much. Roy is rushing in the post. Paul is trying to do too much. Lance is not being proactive enough.
One thing I did see. Roy can handle Howard on the block this year. How many offensive fouls did DH have?
Another thing. West is a beast and made Terrence Jones look like rag doll.
Hey folks me from Mongolia again.
First of all Pacers are playing much nearer to me in Asia, almost same time zone with Taiwan where i feels so comfortable to watch a game by chinese CCTV-5 channel.
But our two preseason games don't look good for any Pacers fans. But i tried to find a reason for our poor play and having one thought.
Please keep in mind that Pacers played leagues best defense last season, so they play like scoring 90 points and allowing their opposing team 85 pts and win many reg.season games like that.
In first couple preseason games i looked other similar DEFENSIVE style teams like Memphis also looks same with Pacers and losing first preseason games because for sure they are not playing their real game defense.
Conversely, offensive teams are shining in preseason games.
To me, a lack of energy in the pre-season is nothing to worry about. Energy is something that a good team like the Pacers should easily be able to turn on when the real season starts. These guys have an 82 game season in front of them and then a grueling playoff run, so they aren't going to go full steam in the pre-season. Vogel and these players have way too much pride to loaf through the games that really count, IMHO. Now if we have low energy when the real season starts, then I'll be very worried. But I think that this team has earned the benefit of the doubt. It's hard to work yourself up for these games after you were a game away from the Finals just a few months back. After playing Game 7 in Miami, I think they understand just how important it is to have home court. I think they would need it against Chicago too. Thus, I'm confident that this team will go pedal to the metal in the regular season so that they can give themselves the best possible chance of getting the Number 1 seed.
I'm a diehard fan of the Pacers and Colts, but I've always found the pre-season to be about as exciting as taking a nap, though I've had a little more interest this year because of Granger and Scola. I can't imagine how the vets who actually play the games feel.
I predict the idea that some were concerned after the first two preseason games will seem completely silly in just a few weeks.
I'll echo the others who were saying that, in the preseason, some of what is happening is significant, some of it (most of it?) is insignificant. That's not picking and choosing, it just is what it is. Kind of like summer league, actually.
David West on the other hand, as long as he stays healthy, I don't care how he looks good or bad. He'll be ready if he stays healthy
You only watched 5 minutes dude, your opinion is disqualified.
Quinn did say that its clear Danny hasn't got the spring in his step back yet and thats why they are trying to give him alot of extended minutes out there so that he can quickly get his game shape back.
You can't get champagne from a garden hose.