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  1. #851
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    No I read everything, I understand what you are saying, and I am saying your eyes are tricking you. You are the one that isn't reading what I said or you would have noticed I said this, "On similar plays with similar blocking". Yes I bring up stats cause that stats are backing up what I see with my eyes.

    Here is what is going on, we have a decent RB in Richardson who is not being used to his full capability. He has power, but he doesn't have the speed and vision to make that power work in non-short yardage situations out of a jumbo line-up. As we saw in the second half of the Seahawks game, when we started opening things up. As we moved away from the power formations, ran some draw plays, Richardson started to get runs of 4 or 5 yards instead of 1 or 2.
    Then you are agreeing that TRich isn't the problem. Which is exactly what I'm saying --- our line isn't giving him opportunities. Whether that's missed assignments, poor execution, incorrect formations and playcalling --- it's mostly not his fault. Which is exactly my point. The line has got to open opportunities. And if they are trying a certain style/formation and it's not working, then the line needs to either 1) get better at it, or 2) they need to change the formations. But there's a lot of people screaming that TRich was a waste and he's mediocre, and my entire point is, it's not him, it's the line. No matter what formations they line up for... they have to execute. Or he has nowhere to go. You can't line up in a formation, have a line fark the execution badly, and then blame the running back for not getting any yards.

    But this myth of "similar blocking" is just that. The blocking hasn't been similar. I can't imagine any running back having much success with the way our line is playing right now.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 10-21-2013 at 03:06 PM.
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    An eccentric is a jerk with money.
    eccentric

    ónoun

    a person who has an unusual, peculiar, or odd personality, set of beliefs, or behavior pattern.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Then you are agreeing that TRich isn't the problem. Which is exactly what I'm saying --- our line isn't giving him opportunities. Whether that's missed assignments, poor execution, incorrect formations and playcalling --- it's mostly not his fault. Which is exactly my point. The line has got to open opportunities. And if they are trying a certain style/formation and it's not working, then the line needs to either 1) get better at it, or 2) they need to change the formations. But there's a lot of people screaming that TRich was a waste and he's mediocre, and my entire point is, it's not him, it's the line. No matter what formations they line up for... they have to execute. Or he has nowhere to go. You can't line up in a formation, have a line fark the execution badly, and then blame the running back for not getting any yards.

    But this myth of "similar blocking" is just that. The blocking hasn't been similar. I can't imagine any running back having much success with the way our line is playing right now.
    Yes, and no.

    Completely different running style put aside Richardson is like Addai. His biggest strengths are not his running ability, but his pass blocking and receiving. He is good in short yardage as he has power, and can push the pile. He has a nice cut so in a more spread offense he would be better, but he doesn't have the speed or vision you want. Where Ballard and Bradshaw would explode into a hole to pick up yardage, Richardson kind of lumbers. He doesn't hit the hole as hard as you would like, if he sees the hole. In a power running offense the holes are not going to be big, so if your RB doesn't hit them hard and fast they will disappear quickly, and it makes the OL look worse than they are. So no it isn't a myth, just appears so because he isn't exploiting what is there like our injured RBs did.

  4. #854

    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Then you are agreeing that TRich isn't the problem. Which is exactly what I'm saying --- our line isn't giving him opportunities. Whether that's missed assignments, poor execution, incorrect formations and playcalling --- it's mostly not his fault. Which is exactly my point. The line has got to open opportunities. And if they are trying a certain style/formation and it's not working, then the line needs to either 1) get better at it, or 2) they need to change the formations. But there's a lot of people screaming that TRich was a waste and he's mediocre, and my entire point is, it's not him, it's the line. No matter what formations they line up for... they have to execute. Or he has nowhere to go. You can't line up in a formation, have a line fark the execution badly, and then blame the running back for not getting any yards.

    But this myth of "similar blocking" is just that. The blocking hasn't been similar. I can't imagine any running back having much success with the way our line is playing right now.
    i agree the blocking has not been great but, i swear, he goes down with the first tackler pretty much every time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
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    eccentric

    ónoun

    a person who has an unusual, peculiar, or odd personality, set of beliefs, or behavior pattern.
    WTF ?? You just don't get it - do you ??

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story...rs-last-season

    Just to put into perspective just how good Vontae Davis was in this game:

    Three best players of Week 7

    1. Vontae Davis, CB, Indianapolis Colts: +7.9
    This wasn't just the highest-graded performance of the week, this is the highest grade we've ever given a cornerback. On point from the first snap, Davis was determined not to let anything get by him, and it showed through in his stats. Eight times the ball was thrown into his coverage, and each time it was a win for him. He finished with two pass breakups and three tackles for short gains, and, on the remainder of the passes, he was in close enough coverage to prevent a completion. It doesn't get much better than that.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Sign him up to a new extension. No, it's not a knee jerk reaction. He has been really good from last season. Plus he loves facing Tom Brady...
    You **** up once, you lose two teeth

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by clownskull View Post
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    i agree the blocking has not been great but, i swear, he goes down with the first tackler pretty much every time.
    Richardson? Seriously? He's pretty much gang tackled every single time. The fumble he lost was a result of not just going down, and fighting for the extra yardage. I know this is from last season but it's still telling.

    Ravens say Trent Richardson is the hardest back to tackle in the NFL
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...le-in-the-nfl/
    Last edited by Since86; 10-23-2013 at 09:50 AM.
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Pulled this from Suave in another thread.

    A great running back, in general, is wasted on a mediocre offensive line.

    The takeaway:

    1) Richardson, who hasn't magically improved with the Colts, remains far from great. He's rushed for 228 yards on 75 carries for a 3.0 yards per carry.
    2) Indy's O-line is mediocre (they rank 14th in run-blocking, according to PFF).

    ProFootballFocus.com's Sam Monson has an explanation for Richardson's poor showing in Sunday night's win over the Broncos.

    "[Other than a lost fumble] Richardson was dealt the blocking equivalent of the Dead Man's Hand, meeting players in the backfield on seemingly every carry, and barely getting an opportunity all day to run the ball without having to make a cut in the backfield as the play had been blown to hell. Richardson forced five missed tackles, and gained 25 of his 37 yards after contact. That means that on 14 carries his blocking generated him just 12 yards before he was hit."

    Then Monson added, "The same [was] true for [Donald] Brown, who gained 12 of his 23 yards after contact."

    Which only reinforces what we wrote earlier: Great running backs typically don't overcome average offensive lines.
    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-...rth-1strounder
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos






  14. #861
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    A great running back, in general, is wasted on a mediocre offensive line.

    The takeaway:

    1) Richardson, who hasn't magically improved with the Colts, remains far from great. He's rushed for 228 yards on 75 carries for a 3.0 yards per carry.
    2) Indy's O-line is mediocre (they rank 14th in run-blocking, according to PFF).

    ProFootballFocus.com's Sam Monson has an explanation for Richardson's poor showing in Sunday night's win over the Broncos.

    "[Other than a lost fumble] Richardson was dealt the blocking equivalent of the Dead Man's Hand, meeting players in the backfield on seemingly every carry, and barely getting an opportunity all day to run the ball without having to make a cut in the backfield as the play had been blown to hell. Richardson forced five missed tackles, and gained 25 of his 37 yards after contact. That means that on 14 carries his blocking generated him just 12 yards before he was hit."

    Then Monson added, "The same [was] true for [Donald] Brown, who gained 12 of his 23 yards after contact."

    Which only reinforces what we wrote earlier: Great running backs typically don't overcome average offensive lines.
    Aaaaaaaand thank you.

    However, they missed some points.

    1) Our rushing attack is high because our QB adds ~30 yds and half a TD per game. And his runs are not designed, they are break-down plays (generally protection issues). In other words, those are basically potential passing yards converted to run yards. Luck is (once again) masking trouble areas. Take away those Luck run yards, and our rushing attack is ~21st in the league. In other words.... our QB and RB are combining for 8th in the league in SPITE of their o-line. This is WHY we need to get an o-line in place, so we can see what these guys can truly do.

    2) That article basically explains exactly what I've been saying, that TRich is getting undercut by his terrible lines. But where they go away from my belief is that once you establish a good run blocking o-line, it doesn't matter if your RB is bad or good. I disagree with that whole-heartedly. If we can establish this o-line, you'll see exactly the difference between TRich and Donald Brown. Once again.... people have got to start learning how to look at context and individual player skillsets. This is my biggest beef with talking sports with folks anymore. They get too wrapped up in appearances and stats and group-think, and don't know how to actually read and diagnose a situation. That article was on the right tract and they fudged the landing. That almost got it right.

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    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 10-23-2013 at 12:19 PM.
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    I agree. I am still very positive about Trent. He runs extremely hard and always makes the first guy miss or breaks the tackle. He still needs to learn the cut back lanes, but I think we will see him have at least 2 big games before this season is through.

    The fumble came at a horrible time, but he was fighting for yardage and there are a lot of times the refs would have blown that play dead before the ball ever came loose. It's not like he was carrying the ball poorly like HIllman does for the Broncos every single week and he takes one hit and the ball pops out.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Listen, if we end up getting a good offensive line next year and he still can't perform well, fine, we'll call it a bad move. But all I see right now are no lanes for Trent to run through and DL in the backfield. It's not really fair to say he's playing poor when he's not given the opportunity to do what he does. We don't know if he's good or bad because there are too many variables. All I know is that he runs hard and rarely fumbles, is a great pass blocker (which we have seen evidence of), and is willing and eager to learn this offense. For me, right now, that's good enough with the crappy oline that we have currently.
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  19. #864
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    I will say this about Trent Richardson: He's been remarkably consistent during his time in the NFL.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Also, let's play a game: You guys throw out running backs that you think are crappy and I will give you reasons why they aren't, and the reason they appear to suck is actually hidden in the context.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Correction... our o-line has been consistent.
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Also, let's play a game: You guys throw out running backs that you think are crappy and I will give you reasons why they aren't, and the reason they appear to suck is actually hidden in the context.
    I think Vnzla hacked someone's account.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I think Vnzla hacked someone's account.
    I mean you guys have to see that if we were anything other than Colts fans, this would seem like a shitload of excuse making, right? Seriously, you can play this game with virtually every running back in the league. Throw out a name and I'll give you the defense.

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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Correction... our o-line has been consistent.
    As was Cleveland's.

  25. #870

    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...bonus-edition/

    The signs were there from the first play of the game. Trent Richardson took the handoff, aimed at Samson Satele’s left hip and then saw the wham block ahead of him blown up and the formidable bulk of DT Kevin Vickerson forcing his way across his path right at the point of attack. Richardson had taken only three steps and the play was already dead, forcing him to cut and improvise. As it happens he made an impressive jump-cut to his left around Vickerson and what was left of the pulling guard he just beat, scampering for 4 yards before being brought down by Rahim Moore the safety.

    This play looks completely unremarkable on the stat sheet, just a standard 4-yard run, leading people that look at those things to question if Richardson is really running with any purpose, or if he is just another back, capable of getting only what the line gives him and nothing more. Well in this instance he gained 4 yards more than the line gave him, because the line gave him nothing, forcing him to make it happen on his own. He may not have been able to break it open completely, but he wasn’t far from doing so (Moore only just took him down by the ankles as he burst toward daylight), and he turned a dead play into a positive one on first down.

    The truth about Richardson is that his career in the NFL is only 22 games old and features injuries and some truly ugly blocking. We really haven’t seen enough to accurately determine what he is or isn’t yet, but it’s certainly too early to be writing him off as a player that can’t get it done running the ball. After this game there was another round of people looking at the stats and the fact that he wasn’t able to get much going and blaming him for it, rather than taking a look at the blocking that was supposed to be opening up holes for him.

    Of his 14 carries, Richardson arrived at the intended point of attack to find it still viable just four times. That means that on 71.4% of his carries by the time he arrived at the hole he was supposed to hit it was already blown up! He was forced to make a cut in the backfield 10 times by defenders beating his blocking almost immediately, quickly enough that the average point at which he was forced to cut away from the intended point of attack was -2.1 yards. 2.1 yards deep in the backfield. Even counting the plays that weren’t destroyed before Richardson made it to the hole, the average point at which he was hit by a defender was just 0.8 yards down field.

    The point I’m making? Richardson could be the hybrid lovechild of Adrian Peterson and Barry Sanders and he would struggle behind the blocking he saw against the Broncos.

    There were occasions though when we saw flashes of what he is capable of. On one of the four occasions the hole didn’t collapse around him he was able to break off an 8-yard run up the middle. That may not sound like much, but it was a fantastic example of the skill set that Richardson brings to the table and why two teams have now spent a first-round pick in acquiring his services.

    When Richardson heads toward the line of scrimmage there appears to be a pretty sizeable hole opening up to the left of center, and you might wonder why he doesn’t just head straight for it, but he can see that on either side there are Denver defenders squeezing it closed. Instead of heading straight to the space and finding himself taken down by one of them, he pushes the run up behind his guard before breaking to the space at the last moment, ensuring that both defenders have the maximum amount of distance to cover to get to him.

    When he makes his first cut he burst through the closing gap like Will Smith exiting the mother ship in Independence Day as it slams shut behind him, only to find himself heading right for SS Duke Ihenacho who has read the play well and closed in to take him down for a minimal gain.

    ANBonus01

    He then breaks out a move that most don’t believe he possesses in his arsenal, cutting off one leg he springs back to the inside away from the would-be tackler, lifting himself just high enough to leave Ihenacho grasping at air instead of what he was sure would be Richardson’s standing leg just moments ago.

    As nice as those first two moves were, Richardson now runs unavoidably into contact as one of his linemen has lost control of his block at the second level. Rather than looking for another finesse move to get away from the inevitable tackle, Richardson lowers his head and goes into full-on power-back mode, dragging a pair of Denver players for additional yardage.

    This was a gain of just 8 yards, but it represents everything that is good about Richardson’s running at the moment — good that exists in spite of the ugly statistics that he and the Colts are putting up on the ground.

    That run was a rarity in a game in which Richardson tallied just 37 yards on 14 carries. What he saw far more often was his way blocked by bodies, both blue and white, as soon as he was handed the ball. Far too often Richardson looked up to see situations like this:

    ANBonus3

    or this:

    ANBonus04



    That isn’t to say that Richardson is entirely blameless, or that he couldn’t have squeezed out a little more from the game. Every running back leaves something on the table at some stage in a game. Adrian Peterson will go through tape of a game in which he topped 200 yards and pick his play to pieces, pointing out cuts he could have made here, moves he could have broken out there, as if he’d been held without a significant gain all day. On Richardson’s fumble, for example, he was a little too quick to abandon the intended point of attack — perhaps simply used to bailing on it by that point in the game given what had happened to him so far — and instead of delaying a beat to let his blocking develop, elected to bounce it outside where he was gang-tackled and ultimately stripped of the football.

    There were plays too where he perhaps didn’t find the ideal spot to cut towards once the initial play had broken down. I’m not saying Richardson has been incredible or anything, but when the biggest issues come from not being able to fix other people’s mistakes, perhaps you need to think about those mistakes being made so consistently, rather than his inability to turn lead into gold.

    This is why separating a runner from his blocking is so difficult to do. On that play Richardson was a little too quick to bail on the play and try to bounce it outside, but was this because he didn’t see it? Was his clock simply reset by the caliber of the blocking on that day and he had become conditioned to having to try to make things happen on his own? Even on something we can identify as a mistake from Richardson we can’t accurately determine the cause of that mistake.

    The bottom line is the Colts have been an awful run blocking unit this season. People point to the numbers put up by Ahmad Bradshaw and Donald Brown behind the same line, but for a couple of reasons those comparisons aren’t necessarily fair. Firstly, the line hasn’t been the same all the way along. The Colts have been dealing with injuries and re-shuffling, and did so several times in the course of this game alone. Secondly, the sample size is so small that one half-decent run by any of the three runners instantly swings their average YPC wildly up or down. Bradshaw may have a much healthier looking average, but based on just 41 attempts.

    Lastly, those numbers don’t take into account the situations or formations in which the three are being used. Richardson is being used more than Brown in heavy sets, when teams are expecting the run, only magnifying the problems on the O-line.

    Where am I going with all of this?

    He may never live up to the draft picks that have already been spent on him, but it would be a mistake to write Trent Richardson off as just another guy running the football, a plodding power back with little else to his game. The Colts are giving him little to no chance at the moment, but the tape shows a guy who is making explosive moves with the ball in his hands. Only Marshawn Lynch has more than the 34 forced missed tackles Richardson has tallied this season, and there is no back in football with a significant number of carries who is making people miss at a better rate than Richardson. This is a guy who is doing his best to make things happen, but so far hasn’t been able to overcome the plays crashing down around him.

    If the Colts can’t improve their O-line it may never happen, but I don’t think we can pin the blame on Richardson right now, whatever the average yards per carry is.

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  27. #871

    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...bonus-edition/

    The signs were there from the first play of the game. Trent Richardson took the handoff, aimed at Samson Sateleís left hip and then saw the wham block ahead of him blown up and the formidable bulk of DT Kevin Vickerson forcing his way across his path right at the point of attack. Richardson had taken only three steps and the play was already dead, forcing him to cut and improvise. As it happens he made an impressive jump-cut to his left around Vickerson and what was left of the pulling guard he just beat, scampering for 4 yards before being brought down by Rahim Moore the safety.

    This play looks completely unremarkable on the stat sheet, just a standard 4-yard run, leading people that look at those things to question if Richardson is really running with any purpose, or if he is just another back, capable of getting only what the line gives him and nothing more. Well in this instance he gained 4 yards more than the line gave him, because the line gave him nothing, forcing him to make it happen on his own. He may not have been able to break it open completely, but he wasnít far from doing so (Moore only just took him down by the ankles as he burst toward daylight), and he turned a dead play into a positive one on first down.

    The truth about Richardson is that his career in the NFL is only 22 games old and features injuries and some truly ugly blocking. We really havenít seen enough to accurately determine what he is or isnít yet, but itís certainly too early to be writing him off as a player that canít get it done running the ball. After this game there was another round of people looking at the stats and the fact that he wasnít able to get much going and blaming him for it, rather than taking a look at the blocking that was supposed to be opening up holes for him.

    Of his 14 carries, Richardson arrived at the intended point of attack to find it still viable just four times. That means that on 71.4% of his carries by the time he arrived at the hole he was supposed to hit it was already blown up! He was forced to make a cut in the backfield 10 times by defenders beating his blocking almost immediately, quickly enough that the average point at which he was forced to cut away from the intended point of attack was -2.1 yards. 2.1 yards deep in the backfield. Even counting the plays that werenít destroyed before Richardson made it to the hole, the average point at which he was hit by a defender was just 0.8 yards down field.

    The point Iím making? Richardson could be the hybrid lovechild of Adrian Peterson and Barry Sanders and he would struggle behind the blocking he saw against the Broncos.

    There were occasions though when we saw flashes of what he is capable of. On one of the four occasions the hole didnít collapse around him he was able to break off an 8-yard run up the middle. That may not sound like much, but it was a fantastic example of the skill set that Richardson brings to the table and why two teams have now spent a first-round pick in acquiring his services.

    When Richardson heads toward the line of scrimmage there appears to be a pretty sizeable hole opening up to the left of center, and you might wonder why he doesnít just head straight for it, but he can see that on either side there are Denver defenders squeezing it closed. Instead of heading straight to the space and finding himself taken down by one of them, he pushes the run up behind his guard before breaking to the space at the last moment, ensuring that both defenders have the maximum amount of distance to cover to get to him.

    When he makes his first cut he burst through the closing gap like Will Smith exiting the mother ship in Independence Day as it slams shut behind him, only to find himself heading right for SS Duke Ihenacho who has read the play well and closed in to take him down for a minimal gain.

    ANBonus01

    He then breaks out a move that most donít believe he possesses in his arsenal, cutting off one leg he springs back to the inside away from the would-be tackler, lifting himself just high enough to leave Ihenacho grasping at air instead of what he was sure would be Richardsonís standing leg just moments ago.

    As nice as those first two moves were, Richardson now runs unavoidably into contact as one of his linemen has lost control of his block at the second level. Rather than looking for another finesse move to get away from the inevitable tackle, Richardson lowers his head and goes into full-on power-back mode, dragging a pair of Denver players for additional yardage.

    This was a gain of just 8 yards, but it represents everything that is good about Richardsonís running at the moment ó good that exists in spite of the ugly statistics that he and the Colts are putting up on the ground.

    That run was a rarity in a game in which Richardson tallied just 37 yards on 14 carries. What he saw far more often was his way blocked by bodies, both blue and white, as soon as he was handed the ball. Far too often Richardson looked up to see situations like this:

    ANBonus3

    or this:

    ANBonus04



    That isnít to say that Richardson is entirely blameless, or that he couldnít have squeezed out a little more from the game. Every running back leaves something on the table at some stage in a game. Adrian Peterson will go through tape of a game in which he topped 200 yards and pick his play to pieces, pointing out cuts he could have made here, moves he could have broken out there, as if heíd been held without a significant gain all day. On Richardsonís fumble, for example, he was a little too quick to abandon the intended point of attack ó perhaps simply used to bailing on it by that point in the game given what had happened to him so far ó and instead of delaying a beat to let his blocking develop, elected to bounce it outside where he was gang-tackled and ultimately stripped of the football.

    There were plays too where he perhaps didnít find the ideal spot to cut towards once the initial play had broken down. Iím not saying Richardson has been incredible or anything, but when the biggest issues come from not being able to fix other peopleís mistakes, perhaps you need to think about those mistakes being made so consistently, rather than his inability to turn lead into gold.

    This is why separating a runner from his blocking is so difficult to do. On that play Richardson was a little too quick to bail on the play and try to bounce it outside, but was this because he didnít see it? Was his clock simply reset by the caliber of the blocking on that day and he had become conditioned to having to try to make things happen on his own? Even on something we can identify as a mistake from Richardson we canít accurately determine the cause of that mistake.

    The bottom line is the Colts have been an awful run blocking unit this season. People point to the numbers put up by Ahmad Bradshaw and Donald Brown behind the same line, but for a couple of reasons those comparisons arenít necessarily fair. Firstly, the line hasnít been the same all the way along. The Colts have been dealing with injuries and re-shuffling, and did so several times in the course of this game alone. Secondly, the sample size is so small that one half-decent run by any of the three runners instantly swings their average YPC wildly up or down. Bradshaw may have a much healthier looking average, but based on just 41 attempts.

    Lastly, those numbers donít take into account the situations or formations in which the three are being used. Richardson is being used more than Brown in heavy sets, when teams are expecting the run, only magnifying the problems on the O-line.

    Where am I going with all of this?

    He may never live up to the draft picks that have already been spent on him, but it would be a mistake to write Trent Richardson off as just another guy running the football, a plodding power back with little else to his game. The Colts are giving him little to no chance at the moment, but the tape shows a guy who is making explosive moves with the ball in his hands. Only Marshawn Lynch has more than the 34 forced missed tackles Richardson has tallied this season, and there is no back in football with a significant number of carries who is making people miss at a better rate than Richardson. This is a guy who is doing his best to make things happen, but so far hasnít been able to overcome the plays crashing down around him.

    If the Colts canít improve their O-line it may never happen, but I donít think we can pin the blame on Richardson right now, whatever the average yards per carry is.

  28. #872
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I mean you guys have to see that if we were anything other than Colts fans, this would seem like a shitload of excuse making, right? Seriously, you can play this game with virtually every running back in the league. Throw out a name and I'll give you the defense.
    Shitload? No, because it's the same reason over and over again. So instead of actually taking rational reasoning that is backed up by tangible numbers, you simply dismiss them and keep to your personal opinion, just like Vnzla.

    Could your made up scenarios be just excuses? Could be. Could they also be legimate reasons? Could be. I like to judge each one based on the validity of the arugment, as opposed to applying a generic "well that's a ******** excuse" wet blanket to every situation.
    Last edited by Since86; 10-23-2013 at 12:51 PM.
    ďJust because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.Ē ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  29. #873
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    I don't think anyone's said yeah Trent is doing amazing!

    All we're saying is there's clearly more at play here than just Trent. When he's got great holes in front of him every time and he's not getting met by a DL or LB in the hole every time, then we will really see.

    The guy was 8th in the NFL last year in yards after contact for RBs. That is actually a really good sign.

    The holes in our offensive line close up pretty quick, part of this is by design, part of it is our cut back approach. Donald Brown kind of skips point B (the cut back) and slams through Point A (the original hole) because of his speed. Trent doesn't have that speed, but he does break a lot of tackles.

    ďWE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKINGĒ- Frank Vogel
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  31. #874
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    I just loved seeing Edgerrin and Marvin in the box watching that game. Both of those two guys have had a great relationship with the Colt since leaving. Remember when Marvin announced the Coby Fleener pick in 2012? Our organization has done a great job of keeping these two guys close. For all of the ripping of Irsay, it seems as though he runs a great organization that treats its current and former players like family. I've rarely heard any of our former players ever say a negative thing about the franchise. There's a reason that most guys are sad when they leave. Irsay treats his players and coaches very very well. Just look at the genuine emotion in Pagano's eyes when he handed Irsay the game ball.

    Here's a cool video in which Marvin Harrison talks about the Luck-Fleener combo. It's rare to see 88 give an interview:

    http://news.yahoo.com/video/marvin-h...023000055.html

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  33. #875
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    Default Re: Colts-Broncos

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Shitload? No, because it's the same reason over and over again. So instead of actually taking rational reasoning that is backed up by tangible numbers, you simply dismiss them and keep to your personal opinion, just like Vnzla.

    Could your made up scenarios be just excuses? Could be. Could they also be legimate reasons? Could be. I like to judge each one based on the validity of the arugment, as opposed to applying a generic "well that's a ******** excuse" wet blanket to every situation.
    Tangible numbers? The tangible numbers are the biggest argument against Richardson. We can rehash his yards per carry and the fumble all day, but we will argue ourselves into the same circles we've already explored. I have my opinion, you guys have yours. I will reiterate one more time: It's not Trent Richardson I dislike so much as trading a first round pick to get him. Although I must say the ill-timed fumble ("but he was just trying to fight for extra yardage" is a load of crap and a prime example of excuse making) really pissed me off.

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