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Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

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  • #16
    Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

    I just looked at the stats for the playoffs.

    Lance averaged 7.6 rpg
    West averaged the same.
    The highest RPG Danny had in the playoffs was 5.6

    Danny's TRB%* (Total Rebound Percentage) was 8.6% in the 11-12 playoffs
    Lance's TRB%* was 12.6% this playoffs better than any starter not named Roy Hibbert

    Get this!!!! Lance's DRB% (Defensive Rebound Percentage) was 21.8%. Meaning out all the time that he was on the floor he grab nearly 22% of the defensive rebounds better than any player on the court over scrub minutes (Pendergraph 22.2% in 71 minutes)

    In the 10-11 playoffs Danny put up 12.9% DRB%.

    Lance had a better DRB% rate than Durant (21.1), Iguolada (20.9), Kawhi Leonard (20.1), Lebron James/Josh Smith (19.7), and Paul George (18.1) in the playoffs. It was better than Al Horford, Christ Bosh, Zach Randolph, and March Gasol.

    Of players who logged more than 100 minutes in the playoffs only Reggie Evans, Kevin Garnett, Pau Gasol, Dwight Howard, Andrew Bogut, Kenneth Faried, Larry Sanders, Omer Asik, Tim Duncan, Boozer, and Lamar Odom had a higher rate.

    No other wing in the NBA playoffs had as high of a DRB% who logged over a 100 minutes. Lance did something pretty amazing last year. In fact if I had more time I would be willing to bet that very few other starting SGs who logged over 100 minutes in a playoff would eclipse that rate in the history of our organization.

    So yes...Lance should be a better rebounder than Danny heading into this season after the playoffs he just put up.

    *TRB% -- Total Rebound Percentage; an estimate of the percentage of available rebounds a player grabbed while he was on the floor.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

      Originally posted by Pacergeek View Post
      This article did not convince me at all that Granger should be starting. The writer assumes that Stephenson from 2012-2013 will be the same player in 2013-2014. Overall, this hack piece conveniently left out all of the positive things Stephenson does

      I agree.

      If this piece isn't a perfect example of someone putting the cart before the horse, then I don't know what is. First, we need to find out if Granger can even still play consistent heavy minutes on a team that should at the very least be playing until the end of May. Then we can worry about who starts. This writer barely mentions the important part of this whole puzzle, Granger's health, but instead rattles off a bunch of stats from 2011-12 or earlier. We all know that Granger was good a couple of years ago, but that says nothing as to his effectiveness in the coming season.

      Also, as you say, Stephenson's growth is also crucial to this. Many here act as if 2012-13 Stephenson is the exact Stephenson that we will get next year. But last year was the first season that he got heavy minutes. In a practical sense, it was basically his rookie year. To put it in perspective, PG has two full years of extra playing time on his resume, despite being the same age as Born Ready. I'm sure that Lance has used his season of experience as a foundation to improve his game this summer, as opposed to previous years where he had no experience at all to build on. That should make a world of difference in his development. Plus, now Larry Legend the mentor is back in the fold and can give him help in person everyday, as opposed to just talking to him on the phone. And then there's the fact that he is only 23 years old and hasn't even touched his physical prime yet. Basically everything is in his favor to continue to get better next season.

      I just love the idea of PG and Lance continuing to grow and play side by side. It worked out pretty damn well last year. These are a couple of athletic freaks with sky high potential. I hope they play the next decade together.
      Last edited by Sollozzo; 09-10-2013, 03:14 PM.

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      • #18
        Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

        I can't wait to start the season, have Vogel announce Danny is the starter, and watch people melt down over it.
        Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

          Originally posted by Since86 View Post
          I can't wait to start the season, have Vogel announce Danny is the starter, and watch people melt down over it.
          And there won't be a comparable melt down if Lance keeps his job? There are clearly biased people in both corner, but I don't think that one is any more prone to a melt down than the other.

          Regardless, the debate over who starts will be child's play compared to next summer when we are forced to choose between keeping Lance or Danny. That will polarize the forum.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

            Originally posted by Since86 View Post
            I can't wait to start the season, have Vogel announce Danny is the starter, and watch people melt down over it.
            There won't be a meltdown, per se, just a confident assertion that the only reason Danny is starting is because he makes more money and is being showcased for a trade and had a temper tantrum when asked to come off the bench.
            BillS

            A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
            Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

              Originally posted by BillS View Post
              There won't be a meltdown, per se, just a confident assertion that the only reason Danny is starting is because he makes more money and is being showcased for a trade and had a temper tantrum when asked to come off the bench.
              Which will all go away if Danny proves on the court that he deserves the job.

              Either way, the proof will be in the pudding. We thankfully have a great coach who will do what is best for the team. I will trust in the decision that Vogel makes.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                Regardless, the debate over who starts will be child's play compared to next summer when we are forced to choose between keeping Lance or Danny. That will polarize the forum.
                It's about finishing, and there will be a divide if both are healthy and one or the other is not finishing in the playoffs. I know I will be watching closely.
                "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                  Originally posted by Major Cold View Post
                  I just looked at the stats for the playoffs.

                  Lance averaged 7.6 rpg
                  West averaged the same.
                  The highest RPG Danny had in the playoffs was 5.6

                  Danny's TRB%* (Total Rebound Percentage) was 8.6% in the 11-12 playoffs
                  Lance's TRB%* was 12.6% this playoffs better than any starter not named Roy Hibbert

                  Get this!!!! Lance's DRB% (Defensive Rebound Percentage) was 21.8%. Meaning out all the time that he was on the floor he grab nearly 22% of the defensive rebounds better than any player on the court over scrub minutes (Pendergraph 22.2% in 71 minutes)

                  In the 10-11 playoffs Danny put up 12.9% DRB%.

                  Lance had a better DRB% rate than Durant (21.1), Iguolada (20.9), Kawhi Leonard (20.1), Lebron James/Josh Smith (19.7), and Paul George (18.1) in the playoffs. It was better than Al Horford, Christ Bosh, Zach Randolph, and March Gasol.

                  Of players who logged more than 100 minutes in the playoffs only Reggie Evans, Kevin Garnett, Pau Gasol, Dwight Howard, Andrew Bogut, Kenneth Faried, Larry Sanders, Omer Asik, Tim Duncan, Boozer, and Lamar Odom had a higher rate.

                  No other wing in the NBA playoffs had as high of a DRB% who logged over a 100 minutes. Lance did something pretty amazing last year. In fact if I had more time I would be willing to bet that very few other starting SGs who logged over 100 minutes in a playoff would eclipse that rate in the history of our organization.

                  So yes...Lance should be a better rebounder than Danny heading into this season after the playoffs he just put up.

                  *TRB% -- Total Rebound Percentage; an estimate of the percentage of available rebounds a player grabbed while he was on the floor.
                  I do agree that Lance was a better defensive rebounder in the playoffs than Danny has really ever been. I think if Lance maintains the same role on the team he will continue to have an advantage there. But also keep in mind that in the playoffs Lance's man probably had a coach screaming at him to get back on defense and Lance winning a contested rebound was a much bigger problem for the opposition than Lance grabbing an uncontested rebound with his man at the half court line. I don't mean to devalue his rebounding, because many times he was ripping boards away from people. But in the Miami series he lost rebounds whenever LeBron made a serious to rebound on the offensive end.

                  However, I'm not convinced that Paul+Lance is a better rebounding duo than Paul+Danny. Remember we don't play in a vacuum. Danny now getting in there and boxing out a frontcourt player now means you have one of our bigs rebounding over a smaller guy or Paul George rebounding over a guard. And even though Lance is the far superior player in the open court once he pulls down the rebound, it means you can have one of Hill, Granger, or George running to an open spot on the other end as the shot comes down.

                  I think what will happen is that Granger will be healthy enough to be a dynamic player on offense, but he will lose some lateral quickness and Lance will be the clearly better defensive player. So basically Granger will be the wing in when we need offense and Stephenson will be our guy when we need defense or an additional ballhandler. We can play Granger when we have a need for length and Stephenson when we need quickness.
                  Last edited by aamcguy; 09-10-2013, 03:44 PM.
                  Time for a new sig.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                    Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                    Which will all go away if Danny proves on the court that he deserves the job.
                    Doubt it.
                    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                      Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                      And there won't be a comparable melt down if Lance keeps his job? There are clearly biased people in both corner, but I don't think that one is any more prone to a melt down than the other.

                      Regardless, the debate over who starts will be child's play compared to next summer when we are forced to choose between keeping Lance or Danny. That will polarize the forum.
                      I personally think that if Lance plays well enough to make us choose him over Granger, Lance will play the market hard and price himself out of Indiana.
                      Time for a new sig.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                        I think Lance needs to show he can rebound at that higher rate for an longer period of time than just through the playoffs. I know it's nice, but I'm not real sure it's sustainable. The guy doubled his rebounding from the regular season. If he regresses to 5-7 rebounds, the difference between him and Danny are negligible.
                        Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                          I can't wait for the season to come and I hope Danny is back better than ever and Lance makes an improvement jump like Paul George. That will rock my face off.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                            People are living in the past if they think Granger will be better than Lance this year. We will not see the same Danny Granger as we did pre-injury...ever again. Not just because of the knee but because he's moving out of his prime years. He is still a very good shooter. But defensively, folks, he's not going to be as good. ..and he wasn't that good pre-injury.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                              Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                              People are living in the past if they think Granger will be better than Lance this year. We will not see the same Danny Granger as we did pre-injury...ever again. Not just because of the knee but because he's moving out of his prime years. He is still a very good shooter. But defensively, folks, he's not going to be as good. ..and he wasn't that good pre-injury.
                              THe pre-injury Danny Granger absolutely carried this team 2 years ago in the playoffs. He set the tone, he was reason we gave the Heat such a tough run that year, until he got Lebron'd on that 3 pter. Honestly just look at how team imploded after he got injured before the half in Game 5 of that series.

                              I actually think that Danny will focus more on defense this year and just try to be an efficient shooter. You won't see him trying to get to the rim very much. I'm sure he knows where ever he lands after this season he is going to have to settle into being more of a role player, the 3rd option type guy.

                              I dunno if Lance starts over him or not, but they will probably get pretty equal minutes. Problem with Lance is that "Lance Giveth and Lance Taketh away" So for everything he does well in a game, he gives you some bone headed mistakes to go along with it.
                              You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Indy Cornrows: Granger an "Easy Choice" over Stephenson

                                Originally posted by graphic-er View Post
                                THe pre-injury Danny Granger absolutely carried this team 2 years ago in the playoffs. He set the tone, he was reason we gave the Heat such a tough run that year, until he got Lebron'd on that 3 pter.

                                Granger averaged 13 PPG on 37% shooting in that 2012 Heat series.

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