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Thread: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

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    Default Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    The kid has stepped up and had a solid season starting in what is really his first season getting significant meaningful minutes. There is no doubt Lance has the talent. Larry Bird does not give out the kind of high praise very often he did for Lance.

    With the reports of the Pacers considering say an Eric Bledsoe who may or may not be really available... but just using it as an example that we realize a point gaurd may be a position we have to address.

    Realize Lance is only 22 ... 23 .. ?? he has progressed this season enough to imho consider him as a most improved player of the year candidiate. at least worthy of mention ... maybe not in mainstream espn but here on PD Lance is the most improved player on the team ... without consider obviously Paul.

    I guess what im getting at is LaNce Stephenson the point guard of the future for the blue and gold. i brought this up in the gamethread recently.. i know he not ready yet.. but i believe Lance could be on a track to become the point gaurd this team has not had since a young Tinsley or savvy veteran Mark Jackson.

    Bird really believe in Lance and i know many kinda scoffed at that notion. There are things Lance just does naturally. I truly do not see Lance at the point gaurd position as a disadvantaage in say maybe next season or the one after.

    in fact the team already seems to be playing with idea already. Coach Vogel let Lance dictate the pace of the game tonight in certain times specifically the 3rd qtr i believe. i know Stepehenson is not ready for that yet esp playoffs.

    but he really just has a feel for the game . he is still way too out of control to trust exclusively at pg. but he would be a force at that position because he can gaurd it. he can gaurd d williams, or rose, westbrook

    Bird may have left the Pacers a diamond in the rough at a position he over the years seemed to miss on.. one of the few criticisms i can find of his tenure here.

    Stepenson could become a really good point guard in this league if he works hard. potentially one of the best. the potential is there and point gaurd may be his natural position.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
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    The kid has stepped up and had a solid season starting in what is really his first season getting significant meaningful minutes. There is no doubt Lance has the talent. Larry Bird does not give out the kind of high praise very often he did for Lance.
    I don't think I ever heard him give out anything but high praise for our players. He never put down guys, but if he wasn't letting them go or trading them he was playing up their strengths as much as possible. How many draft picks did Bird "see a little of himself" in? He proved to be a good evaluator of talent overall, but he was dishing out compliments left and right

    I think Vogel gives more freedom when he's having a good game. When he's on, he tends to do smart things with the ball. When he's having an off day, he tends to force things too much. If he can get more consistent to the point where he is careful and productive with the ball on a nightly basis, then you can start to play with him running the offense more. But I think to this point he has shown that he can find guys, not that he can run an offense. Even when he's controlling the ball, it's West and Hill dictating the offense.

    Which means he may be perfectly suited to a sixth man role where he can be playing 30 mins a night and initiating the offense about 20 of those. But he still plays better as a SG I think.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    The problem is there is Paul George, who IMO is one of the leading MIP candidates. Maybe next year, if he improves further.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Considering expectations for him as of training camp to where he is right now, you'd think he'd be a serious contender for this award, actually. But they tend to give it to people who start at about where he is right now and who then go on to be near or at all-star level, don't they?

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Since Lance is a 2nd round pick....can any Team make him one of those back-loaded contract offers like what Lin and Asik got when he becomes a Free Agent?

    As a 2nd round pick....does he become a UFA or RFA?
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by MAStamper View Post
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    Considering expectations for him as of training camp to where he is right now, you'd think he'd be a serious contender for this award, actually. But they tend to give it to people who start at about where he is right now and who then go on to be near or at all-star level, don't they?
    I've been in some brutal arguments over the years about it, but I still say Stephenson is our "Jordan," and Paul George is our "Pippen." And if you really know anything about those Bulls teams it was that Pippen was a better all around player than Jordan. He was the best all around player I have ever seen. But Jordan was so good at what he did do better that he was the best to ever play the game from his position and arguably any.

    PG has that all around game and reminds me of Pippen so much. Lance has that flash and flair like Jordan and is the deadliest slasher to ever put on Pacers uniform. His game reminds me of Jordan's, they just took much different paths. Lance will never be a 30 ppg scorer, but if you know anything about Lance it is that he is unselfish and humbled from that journey. Lance and PG both are two of the best players in the world talent wise and I see no reason they can't eventually live up to that with the way they are developing. If they keep getting better the sky is the limit.

    Will Stephenson ever be as good as Jordan? No. Not even trying to say that. It's just that his game reminds me of Jordan's game when he gets going. They are pretty much the same size and length. And Lance is an excellent ball handler, passer and creator, and is an unstoppable freight train when he gets going. If they were half as good as Jordan and Pippen that would be like what 3 rings?

    Now flame on.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    Since Lance is a 2nd round pick....can any Team make him one of those back-loaded contract offers like what Lin and Asik got when he becomes a Free Agent?

    As a 2nd round pick....does he become a UFA or RFA?
    We better be working on a contract extension right now. There is no way he should be paid $930,000 on a 1 year deal next year. I'd like to see him him making 4-5 million per for 4-5 years. But that's wishful thinking. If we got him for that it would be a great deal.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    Since Lance is a 2nd round pick....can any Team make him one of those back-loaded contract offers like what Lin and Asik got when he becomes a Free Agent?
    No, because he'll be a 4th year player by the time his current contract is up. He'll be eligible for anything up to the max.

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    As a 2nd round pick....does he become a UFA or RFA?
    The more important point is that he'll be a 4th year player after '13-14 season. So he'll be a UFA. If we had given him a 3 year deal (instead of 4), he'd be a RFA after the 3rd year (this season). Need to ask someone like count55, if the Pacers DON'T pick up Lance's '13-14 team option, does he become a RFA this offseason?

    Btw, I don't think Lance is eligible for a rookie extension, since he was a 2nd rounder.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Frank has some nice quotes about Lance in this Curt Cavin article from the Star.
    http://www.indystar.com/article/2013...is-value-team-

    “He’s not a guy who’s just filling in for somebody; he’s a big reason for our success this year on both ends of the basketball floor.

    “He’s an in-your-face defender who’s improving with his discipline. He’s a beast in the open court offensively. He’s just a freight train, so we want him being extremely aggressive. When he’s at his best, we’re awful tough to beat.”

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by Midcoasted View Post
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    I've been in some brutal arguments over the years about it, but I still say Stephenson is our "Jordan," and Paul George is our "Pippen." And if you really know anything about those Bulls teams it was that Pippen was a better all around player than Jordan. He was the best all around player I have ever seen. But Jordan was so good at what he did do better that he was the best to ever play the game from his position and arguably any.

    PG has that all around game and reminds me of Pippen so much. Lance has that flash and flair like Jordan and is the deadliest slasher to ever put on Pacers uniform. His game reminds me of Jordan's, they just took much different paths. Lance will never be a 30 ppg scorer, but if you know anything about Lance it is that he is unselfish and humbled from that journey. Lance and PG both are two of the best players in the world talent wise and I see no reason they can't eventually live up to that with the way they are developing. If they keep getting better the sky is the limit.

    Will Stephenson ever be as good as Jordan? No. Not even trying to say that. It's just that his game reminds me of Jordan's game when he gets going. They are pretty much the same size and length. And Lance is an excellent ball handler, passer and creator, and is an unstoppable freight train when he gets going. If they were half as good as Jordan and Pippen that would be like what 3 rings?

    Now flame on.
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    MIP is usually given to players that make the leap from role player/starter to solid starter/all-star. Lance's leap was from bench warming to becoming a role player... He is not even the MIP of this team, let alone the entire NBA...
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by yoadknux View Post
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    Lance's leap was from bench warming to becoming a role player... He is not even the MIP of this team, let alone the entire NBA...
    I think that you could argue this just a bit...I think that PG's game is solid, and he has improved tremendously, but let's not forget his play during the playoffs last year....He stepped up many games to the level he is continuously playing at now....

    Lance, on the other hand, was playing in the summer league just trying to convince the Pacers to pick up his option for this year....He moved not only from bench fodder, but from the cutting block, to one of our starters....

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
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    Realize Lance is only 22 ... 23 .. ?? he has progressed this season enough to imho consider him as a most improved player of the year candidiate. at least worthy of mention ... maybe not in mainstream espn but here on PD Lance is the most improved player on the team ... without consider obviously Paul.
    Let me quote again what i stated originally. Some of you comment before reading. I stated Lance is the MIP on this team with the exception of Paul George. To be blunt about it... Lance may have taken a greater stride then Paul when all things are taken into consideration. Paul was already a starter and has been, has been given meaningful minutes in the playoffs etc.

    Lance got very little if any playing time last year that was meaningful and this season he has stepped into a starting role and is very instrumental in our teams success. There is alot of improvement he has made in his game.

    Coach Vogel stated it best that when Lance plays "disciplined" he is a very good player and we are a tough team to beat.

    This is not a MIP player debate between Paul and Lance. I believe both have improved tremendously each in their own way. This thread was more about just Lance and the improvment he has made and can he be considered as the potential point gaurd of the future for this Franchise.

    I still do not see George Hill as a true point gaurd at all. Although, he is one helluva player. Lance has the natural ability to play point gaurd and as i said previously, he can gaurd, Rondo, Westbrook, DWill, Rose type players.

    I do not trust him at exclusievely point gaurd yet. But i woulda never bet my assets on Paul becoming an all-star this year either. However, with the development of Stephenson into a fringe starter/6th man role and as he continues to develop i wonder if he is more suited to SG or Point.

    I am really started to believe in Lance as a true point gaurd for this team maybe next season or the one thereafter. If you watched i believe the 3rd qtr of the game last night you would see that Coach Vogel let Lance push the ball up the court and the team seemed to respond very well.

    As crazy as it may seem right now.. Bird is going to end up being right on the money regarding Lance.

    * to the poster who said Bird praised all his players. your missing the point. Bird did not go on to say a 2nd round draft pick is the best player on his team numerous times. in fact, i only remember him saying this about Lance. Bird praising a kid drafted in the 2nd round and unproven is somewhat out of character for Legend. to be as clear as possible, im pretty sure Bird was saying Lance is the most talented player on the team, and that included Paul George.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by ejwallace View Post
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    I think that you could argue this just a bit...I think that PG's game is solid, and he has improved tremendously, but let's not forget his play during the playoffs last year....He stepped up many games to the level he is continuously playing at now....

    Lance, on the other hand, was playing in the summer league just trying to convince the Pacers to pick up his option for this year....He moved not only from bench fodder, but from the cutting block, to one of our starters....
    I agree. I also think that if Granger gets traded before next season, that Lance will have an even better year next year and be in the running for MIP.

    As much as I love PG, I think it's a toss up between him and Jrue Holiday. If the 6th man award takes record into account, I could see PG get the nod. If not, then Jrue Holiday all the way.
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    I don't feel that Lance is anymore of a true PG than a D.Rose, Russell Westbrook type.

    I honestly think that given the system that the Pacers run, we don't need to designate a "PG" or a "SG" when we have Lance and Hill in the backcourt. We just have two guards who skills mesh very well together.

    Both guys handle the ball pretty well (something Hill has improved at tremendously) and both guys shoot the ball well (something Lance has improved at tremendously) As I stated within the game thread however, Lance has shown that he is much more comfortable with the ball in his hands, creating/orchestrating within the offense, whereas Hill is more comfortable spotting up, finishing, and making smart post entry passes. I believe that Hill is the perfect steady, low-risk, low turnover type of guard to play with an aggressive/attacking guard like Lance. When Lance gets out of hand, he can give the ball to Hill who will slow things down again.

    The more experience that Lance receives the more he'll understand when to "dance" and get the ball going up the floor, and when to back it out and run a play. And once this happens I do believe that he'll be the Pacers "PG". He passes too well and makes too many things happen--naturally, for him NOT to be.

    IDK if that means he'll become better than PG, but it certainly will be interesting to watch as they grow and mature.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee



    Black shoes or not, to put Lance Stephenson into any discussion indicating that he is somehow ACTUALLY like Jordan (unless he has an affinity for Gatorade and Nike) is unfathomable.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    well i believe Lance can become the future PG this team has been missing since Mark Jackson. With that said... i see no reason to make a big splash at the trade deadline to find a point. We already have him.. he just needs another season or two to prove he can be trusted at the point.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Lance doesnt have nearly the stats to garner any awards. He has improved, yes. But he wont even be in the discussion come voting time.

    My girlfriend and I had 6th row seats last night and watching Lance that close you see things you can't always catch on tv. His intensity is almost unreal. He also has a lot of fun out there. It was pretty cool seeing his facial expressions on defense.
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by SMosley21 View Post
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    Lance doesnt have nearly the stats to garner any awards. He has improved, yes. But he wont even be in the discussion come voting time.

    My girlfriend and I had 6th row seats last night and watching Lance that close you see things you can't always catch on tv. His intensity is almost unreal. He also has a lot of fun out there. It was pretty cool seeing his facial expressions on defense.
    i completely agree. as ive said in the original post. im not expecting him to be an MIP candidate but here on PD some of us know whats up. ESPN and other sites will not get around to Lance improving for another season or two. im just saying that Lance could easily compete with Paul for the MIP nominee on this team. considering where both started at coming into this league.

    point of this post was really more about Lance becoming the future starting point gaurd for this team. apologize for the misleading title somewhat.

    great point on Lance's intensity. he has alot of playground dawg in him.. thats not necessarily a bad thing. he still needs to mature on the court.. but i love the nastiness he brings. he doesnt back down.

    if he can continue Birds words of advice.. to play hard, make ohthers better, and let the game come to him he is going to be a very good player for a long time.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by SMosley21 View Post
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    My girlfriend and I had 6th row seats last night and watching Lance that close you see things you can't always catch on tv. His intensity is almost unreal. He also has a lot of fun out there. It was pretty cool seeing his facial expressions on defense.
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Hopefully he continues to improve to the point where he can be our starting PG. Hill has been VERY solid for us since he's been here, but it's clear that Lance has more potential whereas you know what you're going to get with Hill. Lance is rapidly becoming a really good all around player. His defensive improvements alone warrant him being a most improved player (for the pacers, not the nba). Keep in mind despite it is his 3rd year, he has only really played a little over half a season. I'd consider this Lances 2nd year since he never really played at all his rookie year. Of all the things regarding Lance, my favorite thing is his intensity and desire to win. He was a "me first" player all through high school and college, and even coming in here. It really is amazing how much he has matured and is putting the team first. Lance!

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by luis3ep View Post
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    Keep in mind despite it is his 3rd year, he has only really played a little over half a season. I'd consider this Lances 2nd year since he never really played at all his rookie year.
    would be interesting to see the minutes difference b/t Paul and Lance from last season. Then to compare them this go around i bet they are much closer than last years minutes played.

    it will be interesting to see if Coach Vogel continues to let Lance push the ball. im sure he will be on a very short leash.

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by ejwallace View Post
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    He moved not only from bench fodder, but from the cutting block, to one of our starters....
    I think Pacers Digest had him on the cutting block. I don't believe the Pacers ever did, in any shape or fashion.
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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by Brad8888 View Post
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    Black shoes or not, to put Lance Stephenson into any discussion indicating that he is somehow ACTUALLY like Jordan (unless he has an affinity for Gatorade and Nike) is unfathomable.
    True. Jordan is not like Lance in terms of incredible court vision.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: Lance Stephenson Most Improved Player nominee

    Quote Originally Posted by SMosley21 View Post
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    Lance doesnt have nearly the stats to garner any awards. He has improved, yes. But he wont even be in the discussion come voting time.

    My girlfriend and I had 6th row seats last night and watching Lance that close you see things you can't always catch on tv. His intensity is almost unreal. He also has a lot of fun out there. It was pretty cool seeing his facial expressions on defense.
    Totally agree I was right behind the bench last night and Lance cares and has great intensity. I love guys like that, guys like Charlie V who laugh after getting posteriezed? Not so much.

    He slapped the bench in frustration last night because made a mistake. It kind of gets him going and I like it, I think every team needs at least one guy like that.

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