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Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

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In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

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  • #61
    Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

    Originally posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
    You mean a dysfunctional Lakers team, that nobody thought played like they had earlier in the year. Oh and 5 games against the offensively inclined bucks totally makes up for the 13 playoff games against Pacers and Bucks.

    Are Pistons fans so disappointed by their current team that they have to go back and retroactively go back and add to their former glory.
    Are some Pacer fans so unaccustomed to success that they have to pretend this year's squad is one of the best defensive teams of all time?

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

      Originally posted by Deadshot View Post
      That seems to make what Indy is doing in this season seem a little more impressive then I think.
      The average team FG% for 03-04 was .439.
      The average for this season? .447.

      In 03-04, eight teams shot under .430, and only four teams shot over .450.
      This season, four teams shoot under .430, and a whopping 11 teams shoot over .450.

      In 03-04, only six teams shot a FG% higher than the current season's average, whereas, 20 of the league's 30 teams are shooting higher than 03-04's FG% average.

      Those Pistons were a great defensive team, sure, but no rational person (that excludes a few of you, sadly...) can deny that their defensive numbers are clearly inflated by the fact that 03-04 was arguably the low-point of modern NBA offense. They were a slow-paced, plodding, ugly team, playing in the era of hideous offense.

      My personal opinion is that those Pistons deserve about 80% of the credit for the defensive numbers they put up, while the other 20% is credited to terrible offense, league-wide. I'd put those numbers at about 90/10 for this current Pacers team.

      One of the best testaments to the Pacers' defensive dominance is to compare their top-ranked oFG% (.413) to the second-ranked oFG% (Warriors; .429), and see how it stacks up to past margins.

      Here are the top-ranked oFG%'s, and their margin over the second-ranked oFG's, since 1990:

      1. 1993 Knicks (3.0)
      2. 1998 Spurs (1.7)
      3T. 2013 Pacers (1.6)
      3T. 1995 Knicks (1.6)
      5. 2008 Celtics (1.4)
      6. 1990: Pistons (0.8)
      7T. 2003 Kings (0.7)
      7T. 1997 Knicks (0.7)
      7T. 1994 Knicks (0.7)
      10T. 2007 Rockets (0.6)
      10T. 2000 Lakers (0.6)
      12T. 2011 Bulls (0.4)
      12T. 1996 Heat (0.4)
      12T. 1991 Spurs (0.4)
      15T. 2006: Bulls (0.3)
      15T. 2004: Spurs (0.3)
      17T. 2012: Celtics (0.2)
      17T. 2001: Knicks (0.2)
      18T. 2010 Magic (0.1)
      18T. 2005 Bulls (0.1)
      18T. 2002 Lakers (0.1)
      18T. 1999 Spurs (0.1)
      18T. 1992 Spurs (0.1)
      23. 2009 Celtics (<0.1)

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

        I'm honestly not surprised, they have been playing some of the best defense i've ever seen.
        Turner and Young are THE FUTURE!

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        • #64
          Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

          People need to lay off Kstat, that Pistons team absolutely was one of the best ever defenses. I don't understand why people are trying to downplay their accomplishments.
          That'll do.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

            Originally posted by pig norton View Post
            People need to lay off Kstat, that Pistons team absolutely was one of the best ever defenses. I don't understand why people are trying to downplay their accomplishments.
            Agree with this. Kstat's right. That Pistons team was phenomenal.

            Shags is wrong, though, to insinuate that this Pacers' defense is not one of the best ever.
            This space for rent.

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

              I'd worked through the rankings of the Pistons playoff opponents and how they fared, but it seemed more like a pile on against KStat and I'm not really trying to tear that team down because once they added Sheed they were tough.

              But with some of the other discussions let me bring up one of the main findings. They did hold their opponents to lower than their normal FG%, but the Nets and Pacers were below average FG% teams and fundamentally that post-season FG% number was built on 7 games - the first game vs the Nets (in the 25% range) and the 6 games vs the Pacers. The Nets actually went over 41% for 4 of the games (as I recall from looking last night) and the Bucks/Lakers both shot in the "decent" low 40% for their series.

              But the Pacers...well they couldn't make a shot to save their life apart from one game and basically won at all on their own defense. This doesn't really dismiss the Pistons effort and has nothing to do with the sub-70 run (though league-wide the pace was much slower that year), but it does suggest factually that if you take out that Pacers series and only face teams with top 14 offenses DURING THE PLAYOFFS (where you'd expect to find quality teams) then the Pistons don't put up a number nearly as nasty as they did.

              They were title caliber and one of the great defenses, but dwarfing what other great defenses did? No. Put them in the 2000 Finals and you don't see them keeping LA or Indy under 80 points. In my opinion obviously.

              Remember that this is why the Pacers made the Al for Jackson trade. Detroit was able to use Sheed/Ben/Prince on the frontline as length against any interior offense, and the Pacers found out quickly they only had one outside threat - Reggie. So they swapped low post Al for outside shooting Jackson, and right before the brawl it appeared to have worked. Stupid brawl helped ruin what could have been a fantastic 3-4 year rivalry on par with 90's Pacers/Knicks.




              Anyway to me it seems to be truth to say that the Pistons were an awesome defense and the currrent Pacers at full strength (but even without DG) are an elite defense. The days of a pace that supports regular sub-70 games is gone, but the Pacers are capable of knocking out several sub-80s games in a row in a season when that's abnormal.

              Comment


              • #67
                We were hurt... We were dysfunctional....we just couldn't make shots....yeah, I recall getting that a lot in 2004. From everybody.

                And yes, take out their best performances and the averages drop. That's stunning. I've never, ever heard that one before...

                It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

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                • #68
                  Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                  Originally posted by Kstat View Post

                  And yes, take out their best performances and the averages drop. That's stunning. I've never, ever heard that one before...
                  Yeah and if only we could add another 59 games we could actually have a decent comparison to other great defensive teams. They were simply a great defensive team over a 23 game stretch of a season (or however many games it was). Why so defensive?

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                  • #69
                    I'm not being defensive at all. I'm just pointing out they set more defensive records in 25 games than any other team did over 82.

                    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                    Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                    Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                    NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                      Originally posted by Kstat View Post
                      I'm not being defensive at all. I'm just pointing out they set more defensive records in 25 games than any other team did over 82.
                      I bet if you took the best 25 game stretch of some of those other elite teams they would put that Pistons mark to shame.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                        Originally posted by Kstat View Post
                        I'm not being defensive at all. I'm just pointing out they set more defensive records in 25 games than any other team did over 82.
                        But doing it over an 82 game season is what makes a defense truly great, fighting through fatigue and injury. As you said, Sheed got hurt and limited what they could do on defense. Do you think they put up the same insane numbers over 82 games?

                        Having said that, I think people here are underestimating that Pistons defense. If I needed to win a game, I'd take them over this year's Pacers defense.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
                          I bet if you took the best 25 game stretch of some of those other elite teams they would put that Pistons mark to shame.
                          Wow....you're really just guessing and throwing slop at the wall, huh?

                          That team held more teams under 70 points in their last 25 games than any other NBA team in history managed in 82...so I'm going to go out on a limb and say no.

                          At one point, they strung together five in a row. The old NBA record was two. They also hold the NBA record for 36 straight games keeping opponents under 100.

                          The bottom line is, even if you take the averages out of the equation, they strung together more dominating defensive performances in 25 games than any other team has ever cobbled together in 82.
                          Last edited by Kstat; 01-14-2013, 08:02 AM.

                          It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                          Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                          Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                          NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                            This is really just sad. If you need to pretend like that should go right on ahead. The rest of us over here in reality no otherwise. Btw in those 25 games you played a whopping 2 top 10 offenses

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                              I've often said two things.

                              The Pistons after they acquired Sheed were the best defensive team I have ever seen. But the rules were changed after that season and the Pistons style they played in 2004 would cause them to foul way too much to be effective.

                              However if that Pistons team were playing right now, they would still be a great defensive team, just different because of the rules - but still great. The best I have ever seen? I don't know that - would have to see how they adjusted to the new rules.
                              Last edited by Unclebuck; 01-14-2013, 12:30 PM.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: The Pacers have the 6th best FG% defense in NBA history

                                Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
                                I've often said two things.

                                The Pistons after they acquired Sheed were the best defensive team I have ever seen. But the rules were changed after that season and the Pistons style they played in 2004 would cause them to foul way too much to be effective.

                                However if that Pistons team were playing right now, they would still be a great defensive team, just different because of the rules - but still great. The best I have ever seen? I don't know that
                                About as true as it gets. I still remember when the Pistons were gifted Rasheed. I loved our team and had faith in them but immediately stated that Rasheed was the x-factor and "there went our championship".

                                In our Pacers history, two of my biggest regrets are the day the Pistons acquired Rasheed and the Pacers trading Antonio a year too early.

                                I believe both moves cost the Pacers a championship.

                                Comment

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