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Thread: Slow your roll

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I don't get this. People have been crowning the Knicks as contenders on this very board for 2 months and they have accomplished less than we have.

    My point is that regular season, albeit important, does not mean you will be equally as successful in the playoffs. Look at the Spurs the last two years, the Mavericks when GSW's beat them, Timberwolves with Garnett, and a few Hawks teams.

    These teams were thought of to be contenders, but when the playoffs hit 4 other teams were more competitive than they were. Call it choking, call it not having the super star, call it whatever you want. The reality is we won't know if this team is legit unless they can prove that what they are doing can be done in the playoffs where elite teams turn it up.

    I think they are every bit as good as the Bulls of two years ago. And if Paul George played for Chicago, LA, New York, Boston, or any team outside of the MidWest he would have been getting sooooo much press that the ASG would be the a certainty.

    I understand their defense is the best we may have ever seen. And I think that it will continue. But no way can I say with certainty that they will compete with elite teams in a 7 game series. And no I don't think they upped their play against Miami. If they did, they would have been in the ECFs.

    Sure I am being negative. But I do think we ride a little too high too easily. And we ride way too low too fast. It is January. I fully expected this team to be here at the start of the season. We shall see if they are playoff tested.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    You expected them be 8 games over .500 and 2 games out of first in the East without Danny?

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    Sure I am being negative. But I do think we ride a little too high too easily. And we ride way too low too fast.
    That is a fair point but the team is riding high.

    So as fans, we should simply enjoy the ride.

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  7. #29
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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    You expected them be 8 games over .500 and 2 games out of first in the East without Danny?
    Reading that makes my eye twitch. If we hadn't seen direct evidence that it was possible, I'd have firmly and calmly told you it was impossible.
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  8. #30

    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Couple thoughts here:

    1) Like others have said, why should we anticipate every other good team to jump a level in the playoffs? Why wouldn't the Pacers as well? Indiana counts as a team too, right? And it isn't just wishful thinking, either. Roy Hibbert's numbers will rebound with his health. David West and George Hill are playing well below their standards right now. Danny Freaking Granger hasn't logged a minute. In fact, the only starter that is even putting up an average (in relation to their own individual standards) effort is Paul George. Let that sink in. It isn't as if the Pacers are playing out of their minds right now, posting numbers way above their average. Improved playoff performance is a statistical expectation for 80% of our starting lineup.

    2) Who is overreacting? What is overreacting? Does anyone expect the Pacers to cruise to a title? Make the Finals no problem? I don't think so. If you were a fan of the Heat, Celtics, Bulls, Knicks, Clippers, Spurs, Grizzles, or Thunder; would you be "too high" if you thought your team could get to the Finals? I think we would all agree that the answer is no. But 75% (or more) of those fans are wrong. What if you asked them "Could your team win a title in the next 6 years?" and they said "We could", would they be "too high"? Because, by definition, at least 25% of them are wrong. Most likely, 50-70% (ish) will be wrong.

    I could go on forever, but the point is this: Pacers fans have an inferiority complex. Being labeled "elite" or "a contender" doesn't mean that the team is a failure if they lose in the second round. It happens every year. There are simply too many teams. But the Pacers COULD be a team that reaches the ECF or the Finals. That isn't a pipe dream. That's where we are at.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
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    For as much pessimism that posters post within game threads, post game threads, etc (myself included) I think a lil optimism around here can be a tad warranted.

    I don't see too many overboard "homer" type posts that are predicting anything CRAZY. Just a bunch of people that are excited to see the team play at a higher level than we saw the first month and a half of the season.

    Just my opinion though.
    Note that I'm responding just to you because I like you as a poster, I'm not looking for the "others" to respond to this and make this thread about me again.

    Regarding your comments on the highlighted part I disagree with your comments, if you look at Seth's posts lately the guy is comparing the Pacers players to Malone, Stockton and just yesterday was talking about not only winning the championship but is already talking about a repeat, so yeah some people are going overboard.

  10. #32
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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by mattie View Post
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    I think they can beat OKC or Miami in the playoffs.

    That's a bold prediction, but if you have a team that can defend against anyone, and win the battle of the boards you only have to worry about having just enough offense. Once Granger comes back this is a team that starts two legitimate big time scorers followed up by solid options in Hill and West. Once everyone is back and healthy, Indiana can beat anyone. I really do believe that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Foul on Smits View Post
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    Paul George is the leading scorer and best defensive player on the best defensive team who's missing one of there top players coming into the season. Sounds like a MVP contender to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Future View Post
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    But this year seems like it is the best opportunity for the Pacers to have a big playoff push and enter the NBA Finals with the injury of D-Rose and the lack of size and physicality of the Miami Heat.
    These are a few. I have no problem with these predictions and expectations. The thing that I hate is the let down is so severe that we can't have some balance in reactions. Its got to be we are the worst and blow it up, or we are the best and we can beat the Heat and Thunder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I can agree with you. IN the playoffs you cannot overcome injuries. In the regular season effort, teamwork can get you by, but the playoffs you need your best players.
    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    I have an expectation that without Danny at all this season we are a 5-8 seed that has a 35% chance of making it into the second round.

    If Danny is limited even in the playoffs I say we are a 4-8 seed and a 65% chance of making it into the playoffs.

    If Danny averages what he did last year going into the playoffs then I say we have a 65% chance of going into the ECF.

    So if we make it into the ECFs I will be thrilled. I expect us to win the division, home court advantage in the opening round. And at the least make it a competitive 2nd round series.
    I did not expect Paul to make a jump like this. No I didn't. But I didn't expect us to stank it up either. I think Uncle Buck's quote is still spot on. The playoffs are a different monster altogether.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    So someone saying we can beat OKC or Miami is overreaction? You are saying there is a 0% chance that occurs? I mean I don't think it's likely, but I think we could.

    You are frustrated by these comments, fine, whatever.

    Well I am frustrated from reading every comment that NYC was without Melo, or that Miami was apparently coasting on Tuesday according to at least one person. We get more excuses for the Knicks and the Heat than we get for the Pacers around here. Danny Granger has been marginalized to such a point on this baord that now it is like, well maybe he shouldn't even play that much when I read some of these posts. There's always an excuse when we beat a good team. Always someone saying, whoa, don't get too excited there buddy. Look we are all perfectly aware that only one team gets the trophy at the end, but you know it's getting a little tiresome to only read excuses for everyone else we play.

    Hell yes the Knicks not having Melo meant something to them, just like not having Granger has meant something to us. Just like Hill being under the weather or before that hurt for the past two weeks has impacted us.

    Seriously, I'm sick of the excuses for everyone we beat. You put your team on the floor and you either lose or you win. If NYK doesn't want to be so impacted by losing Melo they are more than welcome to trade him for 3 bench dudes I guess to give them added depth.
    Last edited by Trader Joe; 01-11-2013 at 04:54 PM.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    You expected them be 8 games over .500 and 2 games out of first in the East without Danny?
    Especially considering that just a month ago, the Pacers were sitting at 10-11. That's a plus-nine swing in 15 games.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by FlavaDave View Post
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    : Pacers fans have an inferiority complex. Being labeled "elite" or "a contender" doesn't mean that the team is a failure if they lose in the second round. It happens every year. There are simply too many teams. But the Pacers COULD be a team that reaches the ECF or the Finals. That isn't a pipe dream. That's where we are at.
    This is my point tbh. I agree that they could be there. I also stated that the playoffs are different. And no not every good teams turn it up a notch. Only the great ones do. And we won't know if we are that unless we do it. Boston has proven they can, the Heat, the Griz a few years ago, Mavs did two years ago, the Thunder, and even the Bulls a couple of years ago to an extent.

    Man vnzla agrees with me I think I need to stop while I am behind.

  16. #36

    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Oh, and finally:

    We are fans, not players. If we are too excited about the team, it isn't like we will relax and cause the Pacers to lose. Dreaming of a title, having hope, being excited about the future, enjoying the games... That's the point, right? This is fun, right?

    If your manhood or self esteem is attached to the success of the team, you are doing it wrong. If expecting a deep playoff run and having the Pacers fail to deliver makes you feel bad about yourself or something, that's not good. Not saying that this is true of any specific person, but I have seen plenty of it.

    That is the attitude that drives people to comment on ESPN.com articles and say things like "if u thi nk the indiana lamers r better than Da Bulls, u are a biggest moron ever. grow up" Bad fans tie their self worth into the quality of the team, especially in relation to that team's expectations. It isn't good.

    Kind of a tangent, but I think of that every time I hear the "don't get too high" thing. Why not? It is fun, and if it doesn't work out, it is a huge bummer - but not a big deal. Time to dream about next year.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Note that I'm responding just to you because I like you as a poster, I'm not looking for the "others" to respond to this and make this thread about me again.

    Regarding your comments on the highlighted part I disagree with your comments, if you look at Seth's posts lately the guy is comparing the Pacers players to Malone, Stockton and just yesterday was talking about not only winning the championship but is already talking about a repeat, so yeah some people are going overboard.
    Aww I like you too

    I must've missed his post about stockton and Malone. Lol I'm sure it was good.

    Seth utilizes hyperbole and metaphoric comparisons more than anyone. I think It's just how he gets his points across. Maybe it can be viewed as homerish to some that don't agree with his views. But I'm sure he nor anyone else is saying "we're gonna sweep the heat", "we're gonna win multiple championships" etc. Thats what I think of when I say over the top. But I can see your point of view
    Last edited by Ace E.Anderson; 01-11-2013 at 05:03 PM.

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  20. #38
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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    So someone saying we can beat OKC or Miami is overreaction? You are saying there is a 0% chance that occurs? I mean I don't think it's likely, but I think we could.
    No what I am saying is that no regular season play can determine that. That I feel good that we could play better than last year in the playoffs, but I do not think I can say we should not base our playoff play on the last 15 games. The season is 82 games. Danny could come back, Hill could play steadier, West could hit his shots, Green could do what we thought he could, Paul George could get better, Roy could return back to his last years offensive form, and Tyler could hit his outside shot with regularity. Then will we say that this is a dynasty of that of the Lakers? I take what we have for when we have it. The bad start was just that a bad start. I was worried. But the reaction by a lot was embarrassing imo.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    I mean guys a lot of people sat and listened and sat and listened abotu how our schedule sucked as the tide started to turn, now in the past week we have downed, Memphis, Milwaukee, Miami, and New York, and so instead of the schedule now it is, no Melo, coasting Heat....Grizzlies let us win.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    JO placed 3rd in the MVP voting after he averaged 20pts 10rebs 2 asssits 1stl and 2.6blocks.

    PG continues putting up stat lines like he's been putting up, and the Pacers continue to be a top team in the NBA, why wouldn't PG get some consideration? He's not going to get it over LeBron or Durant, but just getting your name put into the mix is quite an accomplishment and something that I think we should kind of expect if PG is going to have the overall impact on a game like he does.

    Right around 20pts 8-9rebs 5-6 assists 2-3 steals while locking down the best offensive wing on the other side isn't anything to scoff at.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    No what I am saying is that no regular season play can determine that. That I feel good that we could play better than last year in the playoffs, but I do not think I can say we should not base our playoff play on the last 15 games. The season is 82 games. Danny could come back, Hill could play steadier, West could hit his shots, Green could do what we thought he could, Paul George could get better, Roy could return back to his last years offensive form, and Tyler could hit his outside shot with regularity. Then will we say that this is a dynasty of that of the Lakers? I take what we have for when we have it. The bad start was just that a bad start. I was worried. But the reaction by a lot was embarrassing imo.
    Well the ifs actually hurt us, because right now, if the season ended today, the Pacers are playing the best team basketball in the East. Don't know what that would mean in the playoffs, but it's true as of this very moment. You keep wanting to deal with the ifs.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I mean guys a lot of people sat and listened and sat and listened abotu how our schedule sucked as the tide started to turn, now in the past week we have downed, Memphis, Milwaukee, Miami, and New York, and so instead of the schedule now it is, no Melo, coasting Heat....Grizzlies let us win.
    I have never said this. I think this stretch is a great stretch for a growing team. Its one of the best by a team this year. There are always variables. But don't lump all contentions into being a troll. I simply stated that we should slow down on the championship talk. If the playoffs started in a week I would not care. If we beat the Heat last year and lost to Boston in game 7 last year, I would not care. But we are in January with a past that suggests we have to prove that we can turn it up in the playoffs. Other teams will play defense like us in the playoffs. How will we respond?

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    I have never said this. I think this stretch is a great stretch for a growing team. Its one of the best by a team this year. There are always variables. But don't lump all contentions into being a troll. I simply stated that we should slow down on the championship talk. If the playoffs started in a week I would not care. If we beat the Heat last year and lost to Boston in game 7 last year, I would not care. But we are in January with a past that suggests we have to prove that we can turn it up in the playoffs. Other teams will play defense like us in the playoffs. How will we respond?

    I didn't even use the word troll?

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I don't get this. People have been crowning the Knicks as contenders on this very board for 2 months and they have accomplished less than we have.
    It's funny because I'm usually the guy slowing the roll, but right now I'm behind the thing trying to push it faster. Cut the breaks, hit the top of the hill and f*** all cares to the wind.

    errr...w00t?



    I understand the sentiment but this isn't about this year or the last week as much as it's about the momentum building since Frank took over. They've faced bumps and come out stronger each time and this seems to be no exception.

    And if you want a roll slowed then maybe the 7 out of 8 games on the road might do it. If not then you better get ready for sonic boom caliber roll speeding because the backside of that road stretch is the "Danny returns, teams plays at home all of Feb" stretch that would appear to be NO2 for already speeding rolls.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Well the ifs actually hurt us, because right now, if the season ended today, the Pacers are playing the best team basketball in the East. Don't know what that would mean in the playoffs, but it's true as of this very moment. You keep wanting to deal with the ifs.
    This is my point. We don't know what this means in the playoffs, so why talk about it after a win. Am I the only one dealing with the ifs? Cause it seems like a lot of people are saying that IF we meet the Heat we will beat them? It seems that is what we all talk about. I am saying in the playoffs we will meet tougher defenses and more refined offenses. What will determine if we are a contender is matching their intensity in the playoffs and not in January.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    This is my point tbh. I agree that they could be there. I also stated that the playoffs are different. And no not every good teams turn it up a notch. Only the great ones do. And we won't know if we are that unless we do it. Boston has proven they can, the Heat, the Griz a few years ago, Mavs did two years ago, the Thunder, and even the Bulls a couple of years ago to an extent.

    Man vnzla agrees with me I think I need to stop while I am behind.
    I can agree with people once in a while

    Trust me I'm excited about the team, I went from thinking that this team was 8th or 7th seat to now probably top 4 and second round exit, I still don't believe that they are contenders, like Dece said there are too many IF's for this team, IF Danny is healthy, IF Roy can score over 10ppg again, IF West can play D and not look old, IF the bench can do anything, way too many IF's for a team that's supposed to contend.

    I can tell you that I would probably feel better about our chances if the Pacers had done a better job in the off season but so far nothing has tell me that is going to get better(the bench), yes Ian is the only bright spot but like I said before I need more good games from him before I jump on his wagon.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    And if you want a roll slowed then maybe the 7 out of 8 games on the road might do it. If not then you better get ready for sonic boom caliber roll speeding because the backside of that road stretch is the "Danny returns, teams plays at home all of Feb" stretch that would appear to be NO2 for already speeding rolls.
    Stop with that IF junk.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Someone has said if we meet the Heat, we WILL beat them? Or have they said could?

    Because guess who else said we could beat the Heat in the playoffs last night? Pretty much everyone in the TNT studio. In fact I think one of them called us the most likely team to beat the Heat? That doesn't mean will, it doesn't mean should, it doesn't even give us a greater than 50/50 chance.

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I can agree with people once in a while

    Trust me I'm excited about the team, I went from thinking that this team was 8th or 7th seat to now probably top 4 and second round exit, I still don't believe that they are contenders, like Dece said there are too many IF's for this team, IF Danny is healthy, IF Roy can score over 10ppg again, IF West can play D and not look old, IF the bench can do anything, way too many IF's for a team that's supposed to contend.

    I can tell you that I would probably feel better about our chances if the Pacers had done a better job in the off season but so far nothing has tell me that is going to get better(the bench), yes Ian is the only bright spot but like I said before I need more good games from him before I jump on his wagon.
    Ok we are throwing this word contender around a lot in here, do you view the Knicks as contenders? Anyone else in the East? Or is Miami your only Eastern contender?

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    Default Re: Slow your roll

    If we won the title, some folks here would complain that we aren't built to last.

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