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Thread: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Good thing we have like 30ish more games to play.

    Losing sucks, but getting too upset over this one is silly.

    I was just mad Violet Palmer was a referee for the game. She is and always has been terrible. The flagrant on Lance was a complete joke.
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helmet View Post
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    Good thing we have like 30ish more games to play.

    Losing sucks, but getting too upset over this one is silly.

    I was just mad Violet Palmer was a referee for the game. She is and always has been terrible. The flagrant on Lance was a complete joke.
    Hold on, there's gonna be another lockout?

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by speakout4 View Post
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    We can't take comfort in they were a winning team when we beat them if they are not winning teams now.
    You shouldn't take comfort in general. You should strive to improve.

    But you also have to give credit where credit is due.
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    Hold on, there's gonna be another lockout?
    Dammit you know what I meant!
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Dece View Post
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    And once again, Philly without Jrue (not to mention Bynum) isn't a winning team, that's the team we beat. Dallas without Dirk isn't a winning team. That's the team we beat. I understand you can only beat the teams put before you, but stop running out these games as evidence we beat good teams, because it's anything but.
    I'm just trying to set the record straight in this whole "cannot beat good teams" storyline. It did happen, Dece. We beat those teams. They were over .500 at the time we beat them. You just cannot erase history.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    What are we going to do about DJ? My nerves just frazzle every time he comes on the floor. I believe he can play, but I sure can't prove it!

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    I'm just trying to set the record straight in this whole "cannot beat good teams" storyline. It did happen, Dece. We beat those teams. They were over .500 at the time we beat them. You just cannot erase history.
    Philly played without Jrue 4 games. They went 0-4 and lost by an average of double digits. They are not a good team without Jrue no matter how you want to frame it.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Philly with Jrue: 14-12. Fringe good team hoping to get better when Bynum gets back (sounds a lot like us with Granger!)

    Philly without Jrue: 0-4, average a 12 point loss. This is the team we beat. (by 10)

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Dece View Post
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    Philly played without Jrue 4 games. They went 0-4 and lost by an average of double digits. They are not a good team without Jrue no matter how you want to frame it.
    Did I say that they were a good team without him?

    No. I just said that they had a winning record. Because they did.

    Isn't it all about records in the whole over .500 talk? 'Cause if it wasn't all about records and it was about actual strength (including injuries) then one would say that the Pacers would get some more respect for being 17 - 13 without their best player.

    You cannot have it both ways
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
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  15. #35

    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    Did I say that they were a good team without him?

    No. I just said that they had a winning record. Because they did.

    Isn't it all about records in the whole over .500 talk? 'Cause if it wasn't all about records and it was about actual strength (including injuries) then one would say that the Pacers would get some more respect for being 17 - 13 without their best player.




    You cannot have it both ways
    If you divorce winning record from good team then what exactly is the point of the argument?

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helmet View Post
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    Good thing we have like 30ish more games to play.

    Losing sucks, but getting too upset over this one is silly.

    I was just mad Violet Palmer was a referee for the game. She is and always has been terrible. The flagrant on Lance was a complete joke.
    I actually liked the officiating most of the game. It wasn't game-changing. And I thought the flagrant 1 was a good call. The play before Lance had gotten beat because they ran a play where they had 3 guys repeatedly setting screens for Lance's guy to get open and he finally lost the shooter. He was frustrated, he lowered his shoulder and took out Korver.

    Now, I think the player where Ivan Johnson tackled Lance while holding on to the ball should have also been fragrant; that was just not the logical path for Johnson to take to pull the ball away.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    We're exactly what I said we were, a fringe good team hoping getting a big piece back will make a huge impact. We are a fringe .500 team. Sorta good. Ok. A team gunning for a 7 or 8 seed hoping their one time all star will make them able to compete with ACTUAL good teams, the 1-4 seeds. Just like Philly (with Jrue), a team a touch over .500 hoping for Bynum to make the difference. Just like the Mavs, a team hanging around .500 hoping Dirk will make the difference. These teams are all HOPING they can be feared later, but none of them can be really feared at this point, none of them are truly contenders, and good teams will continue to take games from them at a high rate.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by IrishPacer View Post
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    The poor record against +.500 teams is misleading.

    A lot of those games have been on the road.

    Generally, if a team is over 500, it means they are defending homecourt pretty well.

    /QED
    To be specific on that, the Pacers are 3-11 against over .500 teams. 11 of those have been on the road, where the Pacers are 2-9. The Pacers are 1-2 at home this season against .500 or better teams. It's certainly possible that the Pacers will just continue to be terrible against .500 teams, but it is also pretty plausible that as they start playing mostly home games against those teams that they'll start winning a better percentage of those games. The evidence is inconclusive at this point, but history says it's more likely to be the latter.

    I can see some evidence of good coaching going on. They have really worked with Tyler to accentuate what he does well and diminish what he's terrible at, and he's been much more efficient this year than last as a result. Lance and Paul continue to mature, and I think they are starting to get a better handle on what Green does well also (although he didn't shoot well tonight).

    Kind of hard to describe the game tonight. Loved the effort at times, but at the same time felt like it wasn't even as close as the final score.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by speakout4 View Post
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    If you divorce winning record from good team then what exactly is the point of the argument?
    So, only good teams have winning records. I thought that we sucked
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by boombaby1987 View Post
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    Paul George with a super quiet 18 points 9 rebounds 8 assists. If we dont resign D-West in the offseason we take 3 big steps back in my opinion.
    Don't forget PG's 5 TOs!
    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    So, only good teams have winning records. I thought that we sucked
    We have played a very easy schedule. That cannot be said enough.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by boombaby1987 View Post
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    We have played a very easy schedule. That cannot be said enough.
    With 18 road games and 12 home games. People should really start looking at the whole picture.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

    Panopticon

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    CJ Watson - 20 points on 6/10 shooting!

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  29. #43
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    having a can't leave him shooter in the 2nd unit would really help
    Having a can't leave him shooter period would really help.
    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    So, only good teams have winning records. I thought that we sucked
    If you want to continue to make the argument that we beat over .500 teams who are not good teams as a meaningful argument then continue to do so but I'm not seeing it.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by speakout4 View Post
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    If you want to continue to make the argument that we beat over .500 teams who are not good teams as a meaningful argument then continue to do so but I'm not seeing it.
    My main argument is that the statistic is incosistent. It flip flops based on several factors. Injuries, schedule, home and aways. It's not a statistic that you can look at and draw meaningful conclusions as it is prone to changes due to hot or cold streaks. Especially, early in the season. Later in the season it becomes dependable, yes. But prior to the ASG it doesn't really mean a lot to me.

    That's my point.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

    Panopticon

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    CJ Watson - 20 points on 6/10 shooting!

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    I would kill to have Williams or Korver. Hell I'd take the rookie from Vandy. But ,no, we have to continue to suffer Green & DJ. This team needs a dead eye shooter something fierce. Would add a whole new dimension.

    Anyway, I liked Tyler's rebounding a lot. Liked PG pretty well minus the TOs. Lance with another solid effort. West was great offensively but what's with the four boards?

    Roy? PATHETIC.

    Defense overall? PATHETIC,

    The latter ultimately can be boiled down to not bringing intensity on that side of the ball until the 4th qtr. The former, I just have no idea, but it's really frustrating.
    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by pacersgroningen View Post
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    Isn't Ivan Johnson crazy at the same level as Ron Artest? Be careful what you wish for..

    Well, to be honest, to the best of my knowledge, Ron has never been banned for life from professional basketball in an entire country.....
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman21 View Post
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    Well, to be honest, to the best of my knowledge, Ron has never been banned for life from professional basketball in an entire country.....
    Johnson's never beat up a fan either. Flipped em the bird sure, but the gulf's pretty wide.

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  37. #49
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Dece View Post
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    Philly with Jrue: 14-12. Fringe good team hoping to get better when Bynum gets back (sounds a lot like us with Granger!)

    Philly without Jrue: 0-4, average a 12 point loss. This is the team we beat. (by 10)
    Pacers without Granger: 17-13.
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    Default Re: Pacers/Hawks Postgame Thread 12/29/12

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Pacers without Granger: 17-13.
    How many standings will we have?

    Lakers without Nash
    Dallas without Novitski
    Etc.

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