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Thread: Spurs to be punished for resting players

  1. #176
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    How does second-guessing a coach's decision in favor of the fans getting to see certain stars on the floor improve anything other than ratings?

    Maybe resting your players helps your team later in the season - it is about more than just the few games you play against the marquee teams still, isn't it?

    Bottom line is that it is the coach's decision. If he screwed up a winnable game by sitting stars and it hurts him down the road, that's his mistake to pay for. Whether the fans deserve to see certain stars play has nothing to do with it.
    Sitting out your players to work the schedule into your favor disrupts competitive balance. My argument has nothing to do with the fans or ratings. It's about what's right in my opinion. If Pop hadn't sent his players home during a road trip before the road trip ended, I wouldn't have cared. If he sat them for the game against the Magic in Orlando I wouldn't have cared. That would've actually helped competitive balance.

    When the league creates a schedule, they take a look at the team's record the previous year. Teams that were really strong last year usually have more 4-games-in-5-nights scheduled. Teams like the Bobcats and Warriors have had a really favorable schedule to start the season. Sure the Spurs schedule has been rough and they've played a lot of games this month but every team in the league is going to have a stretch of games that is tough.

    Another problem I have, although it didn't garauntee a win for the Heat, is that it gives a good team like the Heat an extra chance to win a game against lesser talent. That's not fair to the Pacers or the rest of the league. It's like if the Pacers had the opportunity to play the Wizards 5 times and the rest of the league only gets to play them 4 times.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by diamonddave00 View Post
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    The entire game I kept thinking of Pacers post brawl and was cheering for the undermanned Spurs. I kept waiting for Marcus Haislip, Britton Johnson and Tremaine Fowlkes to check in.
    One of Rick Carlisle's finest hours. They actually did pretty well.
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    I see in these posts that the overwhelming majority of people on this board are in favor of Pop's authority to sit these players. If this was a game on a wednesday night, on two regional cable stations, I would have an easier time agreeing. But this was 'THE' game of the week. Until ABC starts showing games on Sundays, the early TNT game is the most watched NBA game.

    Ask yourself this question, What is David Stern's job? Not his title, we all know that. What is his responsibility? He works for the owners. His number one duty is to keep the NBA a sellable product, which makes it a profitable organization. This includes disciplining players to protect the image, and also making sure the product that is the NBA is desirable to advertisers and ticket buyers. When a person involved in the NBA spits on the product, by removing the most marketable thing in the NBA, its stars, in the most important showcase of the week, it is Stern's responsibility to inform that person that this is not acceptable. The NBA is not an amateur sport. It is a business. David Stern is trying to make that business as profitable as possible.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    I like the article an all but the Spurs should give a big thanks to Stern for suspending Amare and the rest of the Suns players on that famous series, if Sterns doesn't do that Phoenix wins that series and goes to the finals.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    Sitting out your players to work the schedule into your favor disrupts competitive balance. My argument has nothing to do with the fans or ratings. It's about what's right in my opinion. If Pop hadn't sent his players home during a road trip before the road trip ended, I wouldn't have cared. If he sat them for the game against the Magic in Orlando I wouldn't have cared.

    When the league creates a schedule, they take a look at the team's record the previous year. Teams that were really strong last year usually have more 4-games-in-5-nights scheduled. Teams like the Bobcats and Warriors have had a really favorable schedule to start the season. Sure the Spurs schedule has been rough and they've played a lot of games this month but every team in the league is going to have a stretch of games that is tough.

    Another problem I have, although it didn't garauntee a win for the Heat, is that it gives a good team like the Heat an extra chance to win a game against lesser talent. That's not fair to the Pacers or the rest of the league. It's like if the Pacers had the opportunity to play the Wizards 5 times and the rest of the league only gets to play them 4 times.
    I really couldn't disagree more.

    First, the number of long road trips or X-games-in-y-nights has nothing whatsoever to do with the previous record of the team. During our stretch of missing the playoffs we had at least one season where we were in the top 5 of teams with bad back-to-back situations and longest road trips. In at least one of the last 2 seasons Miami had one of the most FAVORABLE treatments as such.

    Second, how the coach decides to deal with resting players in order to handle such situations is his choice. That is (and always has been) PART of how you compete. I have no problem with coaches sitting players for meaningless (to them) games at the end of the season, even when it can affect how other teams end up in the standings - the solution is to play well enough to have your destiny in your own hands, not to count on good teams beating your opponents.

    Essentially, "fair" or "not fair" regarding how other teams play other teams should have nothing to do with your own decisions as a coach. You have to keep focused on your own plate, your own schedule, and your own situation. Same with players. Worrying about what other teams choose to do against their opponents leads to excuses. You want to be in the playoffs? Beat the teams you play.

    Now, if a coach has a PATTERN of doing it throughout a season, it should be investigated to see if there are non-sports reasons for such decisions, but a single game?

    Let the coach do his job. If there is anyone who should complain it should be the team members (for not being allowed to compete) or the ownership (if they think the coach isn't doing what he needs to do to maximize wins overall in the season). That's it.
    BillS

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  9. #181
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Absolutely. Anyone else think it was fishy how the Lakers got their one b2b2b done in the first three games last year?
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by kent beckley View Post
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    I see in these posts that the overwhelming majority of people on this board are in favor of Pop's authority to sit these players. If this was a game on a wednesday night, on two regional cable stations, I would have an easier time agreeing. But this was 'THE' game of the week. Until ABC starts showing games on Sundays, the early TNT game is the most watched NBA game.
    Why should that change the rules?

    Are we going to start saying that on the Thursday night TNT game players get 6 fouls plus one additional foul for every time they were voted into an all-star game? Are we going to start saying that the team with the most fan votes gets a 10 point head start? Are we going to pause a game every time the referees make a call and open the text voting lines so viewers can vote to overturn the call? Are we going to give a player extra free throws if he has a high selling jersey?

    If your answer is "of course not", then why should which players are on the floor matter based on which televised (or non-televised) game it is?

    It's a sporting event, and needs to be treated as such. The "risk" - like showing a Heat game is any kind of ratings risk whatsoever - is that players might not be on the floor OR might not perform up to the hype.

    You want to "punish" the Spurs, don't pick them for the Thursday night national TV game next year. That's about the only "punishment" this deserves.
    BillS

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  12. #183
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    I really can understand where both sides are on this one.

    But ultimately there is nothing the league can do unless there is a pre-establish rule against resting your players. And Stern knows it.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I'd thank this a bazillion times and thank Wojnarowski a million for writing it in the first place.
    Best NBA related article I've ever read.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I really couldn't disagree more.
    That's because you're looking at it from Popovich's vantage point and I'm not. I'm looking at it from a commissioner and fan of the Pacers POV. As a commissioner, Stern has the right to say - "Don't try to work the schedule".

    All-in-all, this really isn't a big help for the Spurs anyway. I doubt this will help the Spurs win the championship or even help them stay healthier or rested for the playoffs.



    I also like Woj's article. He's my new favorite writer this season. Last year it was Sheridan but ever since the playoffs of last year and the offseason, Woj has really stepped his game up.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Why should that change the rules?

    It's a sporting event, and needs to be treated as such. The "risk" - like showing a Heat game is any kind of ratings risk whatsoever - is that players might not be on the floor OR might not perform up to the hype.
    This is an extremely naive statement. Of course the NBA is a sporting event. But it is also, and more importantly from a financial standpoint, a 'show'. It is entertainment. The average fan, not you and me who are currently in a discussion on a small-market team web-forum, pays money to see the stars. They are who pay the bills. If they go away, you have hockey. You have a small niche sport that the general public doesn't give two craps about.

    Why is 'The Office' in their final season? Why is nobody watching it? The show's star is no longer on the show. Therefore people stopped watching it.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    How could this have been avoided? The old three could have sat on Wednesday Night.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by kent beckley View Post
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    This is an extremely naive statement. Of course the NBA is a sporting event. But it is also, and more importantly from a financial standpoint, a 'show'. It is entertainment. The average fan, not you and me who are currently in a discussion on a small-market team web-forum, pays money to see the stars. They are who pay the bills. If they go away, you have hockey. You have a small niche sport that the general public doesn't give two craps about.
    Of course there has to be entertainment value of some kind. But the more that entertainment value diverges from your core product, the more you change from a sports match to a "sports entertainment show" like the WWE. When the entertainment decisions are placed above sports decisions, it isn't a sports match any more.

    If it is to be a sport, then what is on the floor has got to be handled like a sport and not like a Vegas Show. Otherwise, when does it become acceptable to give even greater advantages to the stars the "fans" pay to see? Is there a line any more?
    BillS

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by kent beckley View Post
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    How could this have been avoided? The old three could have sat on Wednesday Night.
    Even if the coach thought having his stars on Wednesday night made more of a difference than on Thursday night? Or should every coach be required to call the League Office before every game and ask permission to sit players?
    BillS

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    An NBA coach should be allowed to decide what is in the best interest of his team. If that means resting players or sending them home to be ready for a division game, so be it.... They should be trying to win their division or make the playoffs....

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Even if the coach thought having his stars on Wednesday night made more of a difference than on Thursday night? Or should every coach be required to call the League Office before every game and ask permission to sit players?
    You don't think Pop knows when he is on national TV?

    I understand your point. My point is that Stern is in the position to make sure all teams are doing what is in the common interest of the league, not just the San Antonio Spurs. The league would have been better off if the Spurs starters played their normal minutes last night. I don't see how anyone could argue with that.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by kent beckley View Post
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    You don't think Pop knows when he is on national TV?

    I understand your point. My point is that Stern is in the position to make sure all teams are doing what is in the common interest of the league, not just the San Antonio Spurs. The league would have been better off if the Spurs starters played their normal minutes last night. I don't see how anyone could argue with that.
    Could you expand on why the League ( as a whole ) would have been better if the Spurs Starters played their normal minutes?
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Well Stern stuck it to them $250,000 fine thats bull

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by diamonddave00 View Post
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    Well Stern stuck it to them $250,000 fine thats bull
    I don't get how can Owners be okay with this.

    So, the rule of thumb is that you can't rest your Starters during a game on National TV. If a Coaches wants to rest their Starters.....then dress them....have them play for a minute and then rest them for 47 minutes . Are Coaches allowed to do that without getting fined?

    Also...is Pop fined $250k or are the Spurs Owners fined?
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    http://www.nba.com/2012/news/11/30/s...ent/index.html

    Quote Originally Posted by NBA
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    San Antonio Spurs fined by league

    Offiicial Release
    Posted Nov 30, 2012 6:05 PM

    The NBA announced Friday that the San Antonio Spurs organization has been fined $250,000 for its decision to send four players home prior to the Spurs' Nov. 29 game in Miami. The Spurs' actions were in violation of a league policy, reviewed with the NBA Board of Governors in April 2010, against resting players in a manner contrary to the best interests of the NBA.

    NBA Commissioner David Stern stated: "The result here is dictated by the totality of the facts in this case. The Spurs decided to make four of their top players unavailable for an early-season game that was the team's only regular-season visit to Miami. The team also did this without informing the Heat, the media, or the league office in a timely way. Under these circumstances, I have concluded that the Spurs did a disservice to the league and our fans."
    Last edited by Pingu; 11-30-2012 at 06:56 PM.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    $250,000 fine, WOW
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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    If Stern is going to fine the Spurs for doing a disservice to the league and the fans, then he should probably also fine the Bobcats and the Wizards for being terrible.

    I hope the Spurs pay the fine in pennies and have it sent to Stern's office.


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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    Quote Originally Posted by kent beckley View Post
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    The league would have been better off if the Spurs starters played their normal minutes last night. I don't see how anyone could argue with that.
    The league also would have been better off if the schedules weren't so ridiculous that Pop has to rest his players in pursuit of success in the big picutre, and if the sheer multitude of games hadn't devalued the importance of each individual games to the point that its not a big deal in the overall picture of championship pursuit to basically throw in the towel on any number of individual games in a season.

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  36. #199

    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    The NBA shouldn't have a say in what players play for individual teams... I mean essentially the NBA can fine you for anything... what precedence is being set here?
    "We've got to be very clear about this. We don't want our players hanging around with murderers," said Larry Bird, Pacers president.

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    Default Re: Spurs to be punished for resting players

    There's no clear cut definition of the violation that took place... is every team going to have to be on their toes everytime the rest a player now?
    "We've got to be very clear about this. We don't want our players hanging around with murderers," said Larry Bird, Pacers president.

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