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Thread: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

  1. #51

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    When I say "defensive specialist" I basically mean he's a much better defensive player than offensive. He's not about to be Noah or Varejao and go shut down a penetrating guard or something.
    He's a good defensively, but against a good pick and roll team he gets exposed. I agree with both you guys, we need to tell him to focus on the little things. That's why I said we need a defensive specialist to put on the other teams best pick and roll player so we can allow Hibbert to camp in the paint, protect the rim, and rebound. Honestly the way it's going now I'd rather find that player to put next to D. West, but that's not happening anytime soon. Hibbert's contract is dead weight right now.

  2. #52

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Just home from the game.
    Pacers played their best basketball of the young season BY FAR for the first 3+ qtrs.
    Watching Roy work 1 on 1 and then hoist a 10' hook shot makes me ill. He misses, claps his hands and runs to the other end. 5 for 18! My God at one point he missed a point blank put back and two 3 footers. Made several really good passes though.
    The bench played the best they have ever played by a mile. Still don't know why we have Sam Young. Don't see what he adds at all.
    How many dumb fouls, technicals did we have? Push offs, fouls away from the ball. Two stupid technical fouls.
    It was sad to watch a 17 pt lead evaporate in just a few minutes. Last four minutes you could just tell it wasn't going to work out. They were finding open shooters. We had no one who really wanted to score. Plus, West missed two easy ones and then bricked two FT's. Lots of good things but a bad loss preceding a west coast trip.

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  4. #53
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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    By the way does anybody think Blair is better than Tyler at this point? Tyler is also the better defender.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Anyone know when we going to get some COMPETENT refs?
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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  7. #55

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    By the way does anybody think Blair is better than Tyler at this point? Tyler is also the better defender.
    There's 4 players drafted BEFORE Tyler in 09 I'd take him over in a vacuum.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman21 View Post
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    Anyone know when we going to get some COMPETENT refs?
    When Stern retires.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Smith View Post
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    Is 20 ppg and 10 rpg too much to ask from the max contract player? I guess so
    It would depend entirely on who the player is and what their game is.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    There's 4 players drafted BEFORE Tyler in 09 I'd take him over in a vacuum.
    Thabeet, Flynn, Hill and Twill?

  13. #59

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Thabeet, Flynn, Hill and Twill?
    Obviously, and not even in a vacuum, that was overstating it. Maybe Gerald Henderson but that's completely depending on teammates.

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  15. #60

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Boyle said before the game that one of the refs was a trainee . I think it might have been the guy that gave Lance the tech.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    One thing to positively take away from this is that the second unit actually looked like the group we traded and paid for. I was watching the re-run on FSN when I got home and DJ said it was the first time he felt really comfortable with that group. Hopefully a sign of things to come.
    Obviously the missed shots late really hurt but they did score 97 points. Of course when the other team scores more than 97 points its not good but coming into tonight they were averaging 91 points allowed and had only two games where they allowed over 100 (first game vs SA and NO on Wednesday). I remember when Butler made their first run to the Final Four the line was 60 points, the only team they let score 60+ was Duke, who scored 61 and won the title. 90 seems to be that line for the Pacers against any team. Hold them to 90 or less and we should get a win.
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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3 View Post
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    It's really hard to look at the positive after such a depressing conclusion. However, it's still early, and this team is looking better and better all the time. So, that's the positive.

    The negative...

    Roy. For god's sake. 5/18? An absolute choke-job, missing 4 or 5 shots in the last 5 minutes. So, so very bad. Oh, and his decision making...he hustled, got the offensive board, and instead of working it to a guard and running a play (got them a 17 point lead) he rushes back up, missing badly.

    Frank. Really, was pretty happy up until he called a play to Roy, despite the fact that Roy was clearly off. He's getting better in my opinion, but needs to continue getting better late in games.

    Paul. Absolute choke-job himself after the 3 he hit. Burned by Green (3 points) lost dribble and breakaway (2 points) and leaves his feet fouling Green (2 points). 7 straight, massive choke.

    I'm pretty frustrated, this would have/should have been a signature win early. It's so hard to lower expectations from top 3 seed to barely getting in.
    You have to change expectations when your best player is out injured.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by CJ Jones View Post
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    Boyle said before the game that one of the refs was a trainee . I think it might have been the guy that gave Lance the tech.
    Are you ******** me? Why is the NBA putting a trainee ref on a regular season game when they run a freaking D-LEAGUE?
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Young coming in for Lance when up 17 in the 3rd reeked of putting the cue in the rack. Vogel got conservative and wanted to consolidate. An appalling miscalculation. The short leash and restricted minutes for Lance are eerily similar to the Michael Curry days. His play has been sound, he has not been forcing it, has applied himself defensively, and has the upside in his game to help this team THIS YEAR. He also posses an almost unique skill-set for this team as someone who can create for both himself and team mates off the dribble. Should he be installed as the go-to man on offense, no. But surely he has played well enough consistently enough to deserve 30+ mins and some license to create when the offense stagnates. Every time Sam Young spots up or receives a dribble hand-off and is asked to create I wonder what part of my basketball education I missed not to appreciate the ensuing clang off the rim, travel, or pass out of bounds. I actually appreciate what Young brings on the defensive end but contend that Lance's net impact (offense+defense) is greater and when considered in the context of the broader team dynamic; a team holding its own defensively whilst laboring offensively - his strengths are faaaaar preferable to young's at this time.
    "He's a strong physical presence out there on both ends of the court. He's a man. There's a reason he was an All-Star." -- Vogel on David West

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  23. #65

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman21 View Post
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    Are you ******** me? Why is the NBA putting a trainee ref on a regular season game when they run a freaking D-LEAGUE?
    If I heard it right they said he worked college (or maybe it was D-League) games, but he works an occasional NBA game to see if has what it takes to become a full time NBA ref.

    Oh, I was wrong about him giving Lance the tech. It was the younger looking guy (#30) that's been in the league for a while, John Goble. He called the holding call on Lance in the 4th too which after watching the replay could have easily been called an offensive foul. The way Neal acted he had to call something, but he got that one wrong too. I guess even experienced refs have bad games. The tech wasn't all his fault, though. Ginobili was such a ***** with that flop. He probably got away with 5 travels tonight too.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    Obviously, and not even in a vacuum, that was overstating it. Maybe Gerald Henderson but that's completely depending on teammates.
    There are about 6 or 7 other Players taken AFTER Hansbrough that I'd take or even consider
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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  26. #67
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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Sam Young has been okay lately, but Vogel's been pulling Lance WAY too often for him. Frank really loves him some hustle players with little basketball skills.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Offense much improved and they showed some beautiful flow at times.The 4th quarter was a disaster though and Hibbert once again disappointed there.Hate to say "told you so" but i did.
    Last edited by Johanvil; 11-24-2012 at 06:45 AM.

  28. #69

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by CJ Jones View Post
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    Ginobili was such a ***** with that flop. He probably got away with 5 travels tonight too.
    Ginobli and Parker travel more than any two players on earth. One time Ginobli had already taken 2+ steps so Mahinmi jumped to block his shot, Ginobli took one more step and fell under Ian and drew a foul. It was only a foul BECAUSE GINOBLI TRAVELED!!

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  30. #70

    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Hate watching Sam Young take those threes (there's a reason he's always wide open) but it's nice knowing he's not gonna miss a defensive rotation or get lost on defense with the frequency of Lance or Green. It's up to Vogel to balance out how much to play the right guys in the right situations to maximize their abilities and avoid allowing the other team to exploit their weaknesses.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanvil View Post
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    Offense much improved and they showed some beautiful flow at times.The 4th quarter was a disaster though and Hibbert once again disappointed there.Hate to say "told you so" but i did.
    Why did Hibbert disappoint? He had a double-double with a couple of blocked shots against one of the premier big men in the game. Did you think Hibbert was going to transform into a 20 ppg 15 rebounds per game type of player just because he signed a big contract?

  32. #72
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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdStrike View Post
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    I agree entirely. I think Frank got his head out of his you know what just in time, and the Pacers are actually looking like an NBA team. The Sam Young stuff boggles my mind. As you said it's not only his shooting but bringing the ball up the court, being a focal point of plays, it makes no sense at all.
    Sam Young is the new Posey.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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  34. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    By the way does anybody think Blair is better than Tyler at this point? Tyler is also the better defender.
    Didn't you used to rail that we took Tyler over Blair? Or was that someone else?"

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  35. #74
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    Not much mention of our D. Our offense lives off our defense. We defended well all game, and our offense followed suit. We didn't defend in the 4th and our offense followed suit.

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    Default Re: Pacers/San Antonio postgame thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Tuts Tomb View Post
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    Hate watching Sam Young take those threes (there's a reason he's always wide open) but it's nice knowing he's not gonna miss a defensive rotation or get lost on defense with the frequency of Lance or Green. It's up to Vogel to balance out how much to play the right guys in the right situations to maximize their abilities and avoid allowing the other team to exploit their weaknesses.
    If Frank were consistent about his concern for players missing defensive assignments, he would be pulling Paul before he pulls Lance.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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