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Thread: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

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    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    I won’t be a wet blanket and complain about how it took us overtime & two record breaking performances to beat a team minus it’s two best players who were on the back end of a back to back.

    I’ll just take the win and be happy with it. As it stands right now we have clawed our way up to 9th in the East, sadly we face the Spurs on Friday and then embark on a west coast trip that usually, even in the good years, is troubling. Last season we did very well out west but that was last season.

    Chicago has been faltering lately & I’m sorry but I’m not sold on the Bucks for the long term. I believe in Scott Skiles but I just don’t believe in their roster. So what I’m trying to say is that if we can get things turned around we still can probably get a playoff spot & there is an outside chance, very outside, that we might be able to keep the Central race interesting for the year.

    I’ll just get this out of the way up front. Congratulations to Paul George, he had a record breaking game and he deserves to have the accolades being thrown his way. Obviously I believe tonight’s game was pyrite but at the very least it did save the game for us. If nothing else let us hope and pray that he now can come out of his funk and become the scorer we so desperately need. Obviously I don’t like the three point shot all that well so while I appreciate his affinity towards it I hope he starts to mix it up more and drive, drive, drive to the basket.

    Roy Hibbert definitely controlled the defensive paint tonight, not only did he block 11 shots but he scared poor old Roberts out of what should have been a pretty easy layup just by rotating over.

    This is now the second good game in a row from Roy (yes I know he was abysmal from the field but baby steps people baby steps) and right now he needs to know we need him to lock down the defensive end and rebound & he did both tonight very well. Robin Lopez & Jason Smith both tried to be very physical with Roy & it never really worked on him.

    Tonight we will just do some bulletpoints to get us through the night.

    • The most impressive thing about George’s game was that he scored 33 of his 37 points after the half. What people may not have noticed was the Paul got benched for fouls & frankly poor play in the first quarter & Lance not Paul was the first wing brought back in. Not sure if this lit a fire or not, if so then by all means let’s do this again.
    • Lance Stephenson to me is the most fun player to watch on the floor. This guy can do anything with panache & flair including making mistakes. He had a move he put on tonight where he dribbled away from the basket drawing the defender out then slicing & cutting quickly to the rack for two. 12/5/5 is a solid if not spectacular game. I’m confident he should be the 5th starter till Danny returns.
    • I hate Ryan Anderson with the passion of a white hot sun. Maybe it’s still just the lingering affects of so many years of the stretch 4 but he & Novak make me vomit in my mouth every time I see them.
    • How did Lance Stephenson’s head foul Jason Smiths forearm? I actually thought that they were going to blow a flagrant one on Smith when I nearly seized when they blew the foul on Lance. I haven’t seen it again but watching it live it looked like a pretty cheap shot by Smith.
    • Speaking of Smith, cheap shots aside, I don’t know what he contract is but I bet the Hornets are getting better value out of him than we are out of Mahinmi.
    • We are not going to be able to continue to play West & Hibbert this many minutes a game for the long haul. This sadly is all on Mahinmi & not Tyler because West has to come in & play alongside of Tyler when Ian does his disappearing act. He didn’t have a hideous game but you just can not leave him out there for any length of time right now. So far I’m still missing Lou.
    • What is wrong with me that makes me not be able to appreciate Gerald Green’s game? I mean he plays fairly solid & once again tonight he didn’t have a bad game but whenever he is in I find myself counting down the time till either Lance or Paul comes back.
    • Sam was atrocious from the field. Good hustle & defense as always but man was he ice cold from the field.
    • I really, really, really wanted Roy’s put back dunk to be the game winner but alas overtime was in the mix.
    • Tyler is just ridicules about drawing fouls. Thank God tonight he decided to hit them. Solid energy & general mayhem which is his job so pretty decent night from him.
    • Augustin looked a little more alive tonight than normal, makes me wonder if running with Hill isn’t what he wants. Had a good steal and had a nice pass (although it looked like it was going to go to the moon when he threw it) for a Green dunk.
    • I credit a lot of tonight’s win from a surprise visit pre-game from the Captain Danny Granger.

    Ok, let’s regroup for Thanksgiving. We now are on a two game winning streak and certainly we have seen some improvement from the Bucks debacle of last week, even the N.Y. loss looked better than the Milwaukee loss (not that you should look good in a loss but you get my point). So maybe we can put this early season malaise behind us and keep us hovering around the .500%. It’s going to be very hard to do this because the December schedule looks pretty daunting. But for tonight we celebrate & party up.



    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    If you didn't see Lance's fast-break move, it was really nifty. It was Lance vs two Hornets, so as he got near the FT line or so, he stopped and dribbled it back out. However, he quickly turned back towards the rim, went around the defender and hit a lay up. Really impressive, I thought.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Jason Smith is definitely great value. But they were able to resign him very cheaply before he started to perform well. He improved a lot last year, especially when it comes to defense, toughness and post play on both ends.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Completely agree about Lance being the most fun Pacer to watch. Now that i think about it, Lance appears to be the Pacer having the most fun playing.

    conclusion, lance is fun

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    But I still think Lance somehow pi$$ed in Frank's Cheerios. He keeps Sam Young out there at the end of the game instead of Lance. Then he subs Young with . . . DJ!

    DJ got burned two times in a row, and so Frank finally had to yield to reality and everything obvious in the universe and reinsert Lance, where we then quickly shot from behind to back up front for the game.

    Not sure what's going on there, but Frank is messing with him. Lance may be having fun, but Frank apparently is not having fun with Lance's fun.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    I don't see how you can take anything but a positive for this game. It was an uphill battle for the entire game, and aside from two stretches early in the first and fourth we played much better offensively than we have all season. I suppose you can complain that our performance isn't repeatable, but that's overlooking a few things. First of all, the Hornets played zone a LOT. They dared us to move the ball and shoot from outside and we rose to the challenge.

    Secondly, they were very physical. And not in the way that you normally attribute to basketball. Ryan Anderson fouled out, but Jason Smith and Robin Lopez did not even through an extra OT period. Lopez shot 3/17 from the field and finished with a career high 21 points. 15/17 (88%) from the FT line, outdoing his career average of 71%. You know that off-hand push-off sweep on hook shots that Hibbert gets a way with more often than not recently? Lopez was doing its equivalent on drives and actually being rewarded by going to the FT line. To not give up post position, they were literally assaulting checking West, Hansbrough, and Hibbert and being rewarded. They got called for a bunch of those early in the third quarter (timing?), but then the refs seemed to stop paying attention. Smith knocked people in the face on more than one occasion, including Lance's foul. They missed another flagrant when Ryan Anderson hockey checked David West instead of playing defense, and was only given a personal. I'm sorry, but you can't tell me crossing your arms in front of your chest and taking a 3 step launch into somebody's back is a valid basketball move.

    Our defense had MULTIPLE lapses, giving up lots of easy baskets. But when we weren't giving up wide open drives to the hoop they were just making really difficult shots. Ryan Anderson was 5/5 from 3 and I think 3 of those shots were of the contested step-back variety.

    So yes, while our play may not be completely repeatable in all facets, New Orleans played out of their mind. And I'm noticing a trend. Every time Haywoode Workman is one of our referees I have bad things to say about the officiating. And I don't say that lightly. I try to hold my mouth shut because I know I have bias in my view of the calls. But I've come to dread when he's on the crew.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    But I still think Lance somehow pi$$ed in Frank's Cheerios. He keeps Sam Young out there at the end of the game instead of Lance. Then he subs Young with . . . DJ!

    DJ got burned two times in a row, and so Frank finally had to yield to reality and everything obvious in the universe and reinsert Lance, where we then quickly shot from behind to back up front for the game.

    Not sure what's going on there, but Frank is messing with him. Lance may be having fun, but Frank apparently is not having fun with Lance's fun.
    I think that was more for trying to get Augustin into the swing of things than in Lance. Augustin was having a pretty good game, and he was trying to give him a few more minutes to give him more exposure while at the same time giving us that 2nd ballhandler. It didn't work out defensively after a while so he pulled him.

    But Lance actually played more minutes than everybody but West and Hill, so I don't think there was anything wrong there. I actually was thinking it's becoming pretty obvious Lance should be our fifth starter and that I was happy Vogel was giving him more room for mistakes last night haha

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by aamcguy View Post
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    I think that was more for trying to get Augustin into the swing of things than in Lance. Augustin was having a pretty good game, and he was trying to give him a few more minutes to give him more exposure while at the same time giving us that 2nd ballhandler. It didn't work out defensively after a while so he pulled him.

    But Lance actually played more minutes than everybody but West and Hill, so I don't think there was anything wrong there. I actually was thinking it's becoming pretty obvious Lance should be our fifth starter and that I was happy Vogel was giving him more room for mistakes last night haha
    Aside from the flagrant on Lance, Smith is the guy who hurt George Hill's arm shortly thereafter... Hill just kind of stopped, stunned and gave up on the play for a second. He then tried to start something with BAMF, and at the time out, you could see West looking back at him mouthing something all the way to, and on the bench. All this in front of Woody and not one call. I'm really surprised a fight didn't break out in that 2 minutes, because it looked like Smith was really trying to instigate one.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Jason Smith and Ryan Anderson are two guys I just wanna hit in the face when I see them. I was kinda hoping one of them tried to pick a fight with D-West cause that would have been something to see.

    This was probably the most fun game to watch for me this season. Paul and Roy are finally starting to do some things that we hoped they would be doing all season. I hope they can keep it up. I don't wanna get my hopes too high for the Spurs game, but at least we are playing at home this time.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    • I credit a lot of tonight’s win from a surprise visit pre-game from the Captain Danny Granger.
    Wait a minute. Has Granger not been attending the games? Or do you mean he was visiting with fans at the game?

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Originally Posted by Peck
    • I credit a lot of tonight’s win from a surprise visit pre-game from the Captain Danny Granger.
    Do you know if he was already riding the white horse?

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    I know a win is a win, but I don't like having a win created by shooting "27" 3 pt shots. As the ole saying goes, you win by the and die by the 3. In this case the Pacers were fortunate enough to win, but it took 27 3's to beat the Hornets!

    This team needs to score more in the paint and develop a better mid-range game instead of relying so much on 3's. Otherwise, making the playoffs isn't even close to being achieveable. Reality is that relying on constantly shooting 3's isn't going to win many games.

    Last year and this past off season I expressed numerous times I'd like the Pacers to acquire Robin Lopez as Hibbert's b/u. I can only say I still feel he'd have been good center for the Pacers. He would have been so much better than Walsh's brainstorm b/u center! Surely, there has to be more to Mahinmi than he's shown so far. Seriously, what was it that Walsh saw in Mahinmi that he just had to have him??

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Yeah I also wanted Robin Lopez for a while, he is really underrated, he was always under use in Phoenix because he is not a good shooter.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    I won’t be a wet blanket and complain about how it took us overtime & two record breaking performances to beat a team minus it’s two best players who were on the back end of a back to back.
    Even without their two best players, New Orleans is a team that ALWAYS plays us hard. They are a victim of being in a tough Western Conference. I think they'd be a decent playoff team in the East.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Robin Lopez has the ugliest hook shot I've ever seen.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
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    Wait a minute. Has Granger not been attending the games? Or do you mean he was visiting with fans at the game?
    Nope, this was his first visit with the team since he had his procedure (that's what they are now calling it). He wasn't at the game though and he is still on crutches.


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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Green, Augustin and Mahinmi are all still finding themselves and they will continue to improve. I'm not concerned with theses guys.

    Young is like from brick city and he needs to stop shooting so much, anything more then garbage buckets and lay ups should be avoided if all possible. He will never stop throwing bricks at the basket.

    Lou, I will never miss Lou for any reason, he is one of the very worst basketball players of all time, imo. Lou should be playing rugby or bicycling.

    Thanks to Paul for showing up big time or we would have seen another loss!

    Good game by the Hornets, they played their butts off.

    Good win for the Pacers!
    .

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Nope, this was his first visit with the team since he had his procedure (that's what they are now calling it). He wasn't at the game though and he is still on crutches.
    Is that a normal thing for the type of procedure he had? I mean the lack of getting out and about?

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
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    Is that a normal thing for the type of procedure he had? I mean the lack of getting out and about?
    I have no idea really but my guess is that if he is on crutches sitting on a folding chair for any length of time, even a good padded one, is not comfortable or good for the healing process.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    I think for Ian to have a disappearing act, he'd first have to have an appearing act.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Do you know if he was already riding the white horse?
    It was in the stable being fitted with an emporer's saddle.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    I posted this elsewhere...

    It was a nice win, but...

    I still have problems with Vogels coaching. DJ has been terrible this year, and Lance has been a positive spark plug most games. When he put DJ in in the fourth, I about had a conniption. As foreseen, that didn’t work out too well and with 3 min left Vogel finally put Lance back in. Pacers came back to win it. Offense is a hot mess. The nice thing is there seems to be more ball movement as the number of assists for the past few games have been very high.

    This team still struggled most of the night against a bottom feeder team that didn’t have Unibrow or Gordon. It took an immortal effort by PG to get the win. If PG doesn’t go for a record night for 3s, this team might have lost this game (also add in Roy’s triple double, and I think the Pacers had a season low 8TOs). Had Vogel kept DJ in in the 4th, the Pacers absolutely lose this game. It took a record setting night, a triple double and possibly a season low in TOs to beat a bad team. I’m not being negative here, just telling the truth. This team still has a long way to go.

    I’m not sold on Vogel as a head coach. This struggling against inferior teams with their best player(s) injured is more than unsettling and doesn’t give fans like me much confidence. Pacers can’t count on getting triple doubles and record setting nights to keep winning. I get that the Pacers are missing Granger, but they still play other teams that are missing their best player, and they've played several teams with out their top 2 or 3 players and still struggled against them.

    This team has talent, and that’s why I get so frustrated seeing this team struggle so much. That is a sign of bad coaching if they can’t get talent to play up to their potential.

    Pacers play the Spurs again on the 23rd. This will be a true gauge on how much they’ve improved since the last time they played them. Play the Lakers coming up too, though I’m not sure if they are back to playing like a playoff team…still could be a good test of teams with talent that are struggling.

    Hopefully PG has his confidence back. Hibbert will get those close shots to fall soon, I just feel it. He's going to be fine. Lance is *****ing awesome.

    As always, Go Pacers!
    Last edited by Sparhawk; 11-22-2012 at 10:30 PM.
    Lance + Starting SG = Awesome

    Now really free Lance!

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    That is why I opened with the idea of not being a wet blanket. I agree with a lot of what you have written, the only place we differ on is the Coaching.

    But even then I'm not going to sit here and tell you that it's 100% not the coaching either.

    But where you see talent I see lack of living up to the talent & that I feel is on the players, not the coaching staff.

    This isn't an O'Brien based offense where the open shot was a wide open three, there are plenty of mid range and even some close to the basket shots that are just not going in. How can any coach change that?

    You even talk about Roy and his shots being right there but just not dropping, again what difference would Brian Shaw sitting in the next seat over (or any other coach for that matter) change that?

    If anything I've read two story's back to back now where both Roy & Paul have stated that Frank has reached out to them and given them hope and his belief in them and that more than anything has helped with their performance. I think if anything Frank has been given a rotten bench to deal with by management.

    Ian & D.J. have both been beyond atrocious. Green is nowhere near being a productive game to game bench player & Sam Young at best has been a spot player. Tyler is the only one giving any consistant bench production this year.

    But I'm also not above saying that maybe it is coaching, I just don't believe it is. Yet.

    However I freely admit, I am biased (just look at my avatar).


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Tyler is the only one giving any consistent bench production this year.
    Which I was totally not expecting, and very glad to be wrong.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Swatting the buzzing pests...

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Which I was totally not expecting, and very glad to be wrong.
    yep- me too. but i will gladly take positives when and where i can get them.

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