In your point about Steve Simon, who's to say he would have any different philosophy from Herb?
Another night, another backside-kicking. They just hit you from so many sides, now, in waves. It's like a cavalry, running down hill and trampling you underfoot. You have no tactical advantage, you're just swinging wildly in the mud, and the best strategy might be to play dead.
They are an absolute onslaught right now.
------------ Matt Moore, CBS Sports "Eye On Basketball", 11/12/13
If the Pacers didn't move when Britton Johnson was in the starting lineup, it's not moving now. It's November people. Adjustments will be made and things are likely to change.
The problem is not that we need a true point guard,the problem is not that Hibbert sucks, It's not the players at all it is the front office especially Bird/ Pritchard. Pendergraph, Mahimmi, Augustine, Green, and if not for some luck we'd have Craig Smith, and Rashad McCants. How in the last four seasons How has this not been Birds M.O; we once again have a bunch of D-league like players. Think Diener, Solo, Luther Head, Earl Watson. Only difference is these new guys are now all signed to long-term deals.
Also I do not understand why a larger contract is supposed to make a guy better Roy is what he is and what he is is pretty good. He is a defensive minded Center who is a solid shotblocker and rebounder, he is not a scorer, and I have no idea why we are trying to make him one. He was certainly never more than the fourth option last year.
Protect the Promise!!!!
They suck right now anyway and yes probably making it to the playoffs is fun and all but if there is not hope to pass the first round what's the point?
Call me crazy but in this crappy Eastern conference there is a chance that multiple rebuilding teams make it to the playoff, so they are accomplishing two things, the rebuilding plus they are making it to the playoffs to keep their fans happy, I think the Pacers can do that too.
This is the truth nobody wants to admit.
Last year we were a good team. This year we took a small step back personnel-wise, but we could still be pretty good if Granger were available. His perimeter shooting is just that important to this team.
But the point is, the Knicks are a really good team. They are up there with the Chicago's and Miami's in the East...because they simply have a lot more talent than the Pacers. Chicago didn't have Derrick Rose last year and they are better as well. We benefited from Dwight and DRose being out last year.
So, here we are. Granger is out and we've taken a small step back with the trades. It should be no surprise we got beat bad by NY and San Antonio which is also one of the very best teams in the league.
David "And One" West
No, it isn't a valid sample size. Wanna know why?
Cause Granger will not be out for the whole season. If he is to be out for the whole season then I agree with your point. But he isn't, so your argument is invalid.
I'd like to see some creative trade ideas. I think we would need to take on somebody who is high upside but on a short leash. Otherwise, we'd be selling the farm. For example, something like Hibbert & a 1st for Royce White and Asik would help. Houston's got so much young depth that they don't need White at all, and they're clearly looking for some legitimacy inside. Hibbert has been horrible this season, but he's more offensive minded than Asik and would benefit from playing with Lin/Harden. Royce White is a headcase, but he is going to be a stat sheet stuffing wing if he ever gets on the court, and he brings the element that this team needs more than any other: playmaking ability.
The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)
He's not a wing at all - more of an undersized F/C type really. Aside from his other issues, it's not really clear whether he has an NBA position. So I wouldn't pin any hopes of a quick turnaround on a Royce White trade, even if you think his other issues can be ignored.
Why not go for Burks instead as in the other thread. A much better fit who also provides some playmaking from the SG position.
Last edited by wintermute; 11-19-2012 at 11:32 PM.
It's like we didn't just win a game with our max player finally playing great. Not even a hint of optimism.
At this point, TPTB has no other choice than to weather the storm.
This team has several good pieces, even as disfunctional as they presently seem to be. But blowing things up or even trading a couple of the top players? That's idiotic and something that management would not and will not do at this point.
Why? There a couple of reasons.
As has been pointed out, we are barely 10% into the season and it's certainly no time for panic and a knee-jerk reaction. If I had reacted this way every time one of my funds or stock choices dipped a little, I'd ended up working until I was 70 and not retiring at 57. We have invested in a few players, so let's take a deep breath, take a step back and ponder the situation.
In doing this it directly leads to reason #2. We have no idea how this team would perform with the insertion of Granger into the lineup. It could be that some of you are right, and TPTB has created a flawed team from the start. But, I think that it is even more likely that Granger is the missing link that enables the other pieces to perform much better. Now, I will be the first to admit that such a dependence on a single player in itself constitutes a flaw. But if this is the case, having waited for Granger's return will have provided the clarity to determine that. We would also have a very good starting point for further improving the team. In my opinion, that is far wiser than getting rid of players and possibly setting us back a year or two in our roster development.
The best players on teams usually have qualities that are not duplicated by others on the roster. Without that redundancy, teams are gong to suffer when their best player is unavailable. The only thing that might differ from team to team is the degree to which they will miss that player. For the Pacers, we miss Granger a hell of a lot.
(And yes, I think it is apparent to even his biggest detractors that Granger can now be identified as our best player.).
Last edited by beast23; 11-20-2012 at 12:17 AM.
Remember the last time fans and sponsors forced the team to "blow up" the roster?
Here's a hint:
"Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel
"And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca