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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Coach Frank Vogel

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  • #31
    Re: Coach Frank Vogel

    Originally posted by PacersPride View Post
    it wasnt that great of an IU team. from what i remember they got pretty lucky in who they played on the way to the final 4. kinda like the Pacers last year in playing a D12 less Magic squad.
    I'm not the biggest Davis supporter out there, but any team that comes back from 17 down against a STACKED Duke squad ranked #1 in the country is not "lucky".
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Coach Frank Vogel

      Originally posted by vnzla81 View Post
      Vogel's offense sucks but I'm not going to blame him yet, he said he was going to make the offense less complicated yesterday, whatever that means? either way I think the blame should go to the front office for not giving Vogel the right pieces to make it work, they knew they needed a go to scorer and didn't get one, they knew they needed a rebounder/defender and didn't get one, if you look at the Pacers signings other than Roy and Hill(to be evaluated) they signed the equivalent of Travis Diener, Kareem Rush and Solomon Jones, the amazing part is that they did it by using the rest of cap space they had and not only that but they gave long term deals to two of them.

      BUT Walsh knows what he's doing. That's why he left Bird with a mess when he left. I was totally against Walsh being brought back, voiced my opinion strongly about it. I haven't changed my mind either about Walsh being in charge, just trying to be patient and watch what happens. I just hope when Walsh finally leaves the Pacers that his decisions don't cause the Pacers problems for years to come...... like last time.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Coach Frank Vogel

        I don't like the options. I want a choice that says with the right players he certainly could lead them to a title.


        Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Coach Frank Vogel

          Originally posted by Peck View Post
          I don't like the options. I want a choice that says with the right players he certainly could lead them to a title.
          with the right players even Eric Spolstera can lead a team to the NBA finals. difference b/t miami and indiana is we do not have the ability to attact those players whereas the right coach is a little more of a realistic possibility.

          i like Frank as much you all do.. but i believe this team has the talent. we just dont have a coach like the Bulls do.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Coach Frank Vogel

            Originally posted by PacersPride View Post
            with the right players even Eric Spolstera can lead a team to the NBA finals. difference b/t miami and indiana is we do not have the ability to attact those players whereas the right coach is a little more of a realistic possibility.

            i like Frank as much you all do.. but i believe this team has the talent. we just dont have a coach like the Bulls do.
            I'll just agree to disagree then.

            I don't think the talent (with Danny missing) is there for any real significant championship hopes. If Danny was here we still wouldn't win a title but we would be in the conversation.

            But I respect your opinion of saying the talent is there to be better than what we currently are, which I would agree with that point.


            Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Coach Frank Vogel

              I've been pleased with Vogel and how his coaching has translated to this team's style of play. The fact that he was a strong candidate for COTY says something.

              Currently, I have no problem with him being the coach. There's been some times where the offense and drawn up plays look like a mess, but for the most part, he's done well coaching a team with no so called "superstars".

              A coach can only do so much, but I believe he can get this team to the ECF with everyone healthy and at their best.

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                Originally posted by duke dynamite View Post
                Give me elite players and I can win a Championship.

                Example: Erik Spoelstra, Doc Rivers
                ? Doc Rivers is one of the best coaches in the game.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                  Coach Vogel isnt the greatest x and O coach, his offense is too predictable, throw down low and pretty much it, the new bobcats coach out coached him, he doubled n tripled low post n vogel never adjusted, offense looked lost, last year coach of heat figured out vogel style n shut us down the rest of that series, and why are teams getting so many steals from us by swatting at the ball while its low? Our defense isnt doing the same, come on vogel!!!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                    We're talking about a guy who was a legitimate contender for COY last season. Who has only been a coach for 1 and 1/2 seasons. Who doesn't have his best player. And it's only 5 games into the season. (And we've won two of them.) Come on guys.

                    Bottom line is, I don't think Vogel coaches a pretty offense (although last season it was efficient.) And I don't think we have the players to run a pretty offense. (We don't even have a starting point guard.) I've noticed a little bit of improvement from PG with moving without the basketball. And Hill does. (But he doesn't do it well.) No one moves, no one sets good screens, and the ball gets stuck, and if that's what the players on the team do, there's nothing a coach can do to make the offense look prettier.

                    Now, if we can make some of our outside shots, the inside/outside game can be efficient. But someone needs to step up there, because that was Danny Granger's job.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                      Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                      We're talking about a guy who was a legitimate contender for COY last season. Who has only been a coach for 1 and 1/2 seasons. Who doesn't have his best player. And it's only 5 games into the season. (And we've won two of them.) Come on guys.

                      Bottom line is, I don't think Vogel coaches a pretty offense (although last season it was efficient.) And I don't think we have the players to run a pretty offense. (We don't even have a starting point guard.) I've noticed a little bit of improvement from PG with moving without the basketball. And Hill does. (But he doesn't do it well.) No one moves, no one sets good screens, and the ball gets stuck, and if that's what the players on the team do, there's nothing a coach can do to make the offense look prettier.

                      Now, if we can make some of our outside shots, the inside/outside game can be efficient. But someone needs to step up there, because that was Danny Granger's job.
                      The COY stuff is a not relevant imo. how many coaches in the last ten seasons have won COY and been let go the following season. Sam Mitchell comes to mind and I believe there are others (Carlisle as well i believe). True Vogel has been coach for only 1.5 seasons. If you can spin that as a positive and buy it then go for it.

                      I would love to eat crow on this one. im not even saying Vogel is a bad coach. I guess im just skipping past the trial phase were giving Vogel because we all are still very satisfied with anyone other than a coach who constructs on offense predicated on a PF shooting 3's.

                      Are the Pacers a team that can win a championship.. i think were gettting there. im looking at the bigger picture than just 5 games. to beat the best were gonna need the best and since we probably will not have the best talent on the floor in an NBA Finals were going to have to out-coach the opponent.

                      I believe Vogel is a good coach for a team rebuilding. Pacers are a team competing now. we have our core intact and we need to MAX it to the fullest.

                      it was only when Larry Bird and Carlisle took the reigns did this team make a finals appearance. we got the most out of Smits during that era of Pacers basketball.

                      to get the most out of Paul George, Roy Hibbert and the remaining talent we need a veteran well seasoned coach. Jerry Sloan comes to mind immediately although im not sure if he willing to come back but i use him as an example.

                      I really like Vogel, but im gonna be blunt. I would prefer Shaw as the HC and Vogel the assistant.

                      bottom line:

                      Vogel/Shaw need to fix this offense and fast without Danny Granger. Its not going to be easy for a coach with 1.5 years experience.

                      Go Pacers!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                        Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                        We're talking about a guy who was a legitimate contender for COY last season. Who has only been a coach for 1 and 1/2 seasons. Who doesn't have his best player. And it's only 5 games into the season. (And we've won two of them.) Come on guys.
                        Agree.


                        Bottom line is, I don't think Vogel coaches a pretty offense (although last season it was efficient.) And I don't think we have the players to run a pretty offense.
                        Agree.


                        No one moves, no one sets good screens, and the ball gets stuck, and if that's what the players on the team do, there's nothing a coach can do to make the offense look prettier.
                        Disagree. I think Vogel can teach these guys how to move, cut, and where to move and cut. And he can demand they do it.
                        "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                          Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
                          I'm not convinced Vogel is the long-term answer, never have been. I'm also not ready to give up on him. I'm hoping, though, that Brian Shaw gets a job somewhere else this next offseason so that he's out of the picture. Let somebody else deal with him.

                          I've got somebody different that I want in here after Shaw and Vogel are gone.

                          I don't have as much of a problem with Vogel's x's and o's as the rest of you. I also didn't have a problem with Carlisle's x's and o's even when I wanted Rick to be run out of town.

                          I don't feel like Frank has lost control of the team. But I'm not sure how high Frank's ceiling is right now or over the next couple of years. To me, this was a bigger concern two years ago when our team had no mental toughness. Having West and Hill take over the leader's role has made me less concerned about Frank's lack of experience on the hotseat.
                          I'm not trying to indicate that Vogel should go or that Shaw should replace him. I am just genuinely curious to know why you hope Brian Shaw leaves and/or think he would be a bad choice to be this team's head coach? Who would you like to see coach this team after Vogel?

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                          • #43
                            Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                            Man, people have short memories and a quick trigger.

                            Vogel leads the Pacers to their first .500+ season in years and into the playoffs the last two seasons. He loses his best offensive player and is one game under .500 after 5 games into the season. Now people want him out. He's no Rick Carlisle at the moment, but the players love him and with more experience we may have a great coach. If anything, he deserves at least another year without this talk.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                              Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                              Man, people have short memories and a quick trigger.

                              Vogel leads the Pacers to their first .500+ season in years and into the playoffs the last two seasons. He loses his best offensive player and is one game under .500 after 5 games into the season. Now people want him out. He's no Rick Carlisle at the moment, but the players love him and with more experience we may have a great coach. If anything, he deserves at least another year without this talk.
                              THis has nothing to do with a short memory as none of the complaints are new, just people aren't giving him the benefit of the doubt anymore.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Coach Frank Vogel

                                Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                                Man, people have short memories and a quick trigger.

                                Vogel leads the Pacers to their first .500+ season in years and into the playoffs the last two seasons. He loses his best offensive player and is one game under .500 after 5 games into the season. Now people want him out. He's no Rick Carlisle at the moment, but the players love him and with more experience we may have a great coach. If anything, he deserves at least another year without this talk.
                                I agree, Vogel deserves a chance with a full training camp. Unfortunately, he will not have Granger for awhile. If he can coach this team up to a 5th seed or better by All-star break i think you can t really find criticsm.

                                im concerned with our younger players and giving them the best coaching possible. thats certainly no slight on Coach Vogel. I think he has a bright future.

                                Comment

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