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Thread: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

  1. #176
    On the Vogel Wagon gummy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Something I haven't seen discussed yet:

    Tyler set several good hard screens instead of slipping out early to roll toward the basket. Yay!

    Set good screens and rebound. Then I can forgive the flailing toward the basket - at least it does sometimes result in free throws.

    I don't remember him taking a single jump shot.
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  3. #177
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Exactly.

    I just felt that with the game at such a crucial juncture, you want your best players on the floor. Doesn't even explain PG's absence for most of the 4th quarter. I could be wrong about that, but seems like he left large chunks of our 2nd unit out there for a loong time, even after the Raps had brought back most of their starters.

    I could be wrong, but I kept looking at the clock, and it ticked down to 6:00 and I remember thinking "Why isn't PG or Hibbert out there?" We had made a run and got it close, and then the Raps started to match us score for score, and it just seemed to me that we waited an oddly long amount of time to get our guys back in.

    Like I said, we won the game, so I'm not terribly torn up about it right now. It's something I'll be keeping my 6th eye on though throughout the season. Why yes, I have six eyes.
    Instead, Vogel left Stephenson out there to barely exist.

  4. #178

    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by gummy View Post
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    Something I haven't seen discussed yet:

    Tyler set several good hard screens instead of slipping out early to roll toward the basket. Yay!

    Set good screens and rebound. Then I can forgive the flailing toward the basket - at least it does sometimes result in free throws.

    I don't remember him taking a single jump shot.
    I just watched the game focusing only on Tyler. It was an interesting experience.

    He is the main inbounder after a defensive make so that Roy gets time to go down the floor
    He dives for rebounds hard since he is the main inbounder, and knows he has to go over there anyway if they make.
    He sets good screens
    The worst thing you can do is give him the ball with the clock going down. Stephensen did this when he should have been the one to ISO. Don't make Tyler Iso.
    He runs well back and forth, harder than most.
    He did the flail around get free throws thing in a situation I wasn't even sure he had the ball secured. Got the call. Good stuff.
    Sometimes he looks like he really wants to be the focus of a play, and gets down a bit that he isn't, but doesn't move any less hard.
    He gave up baskets that weren't his fault, and were entirely the fault of the coaching staff having him cover pick and rolls so high. It's reckless, and I don't see why we do it.

    I came away from the game thinking more highly of him that I did. It's hard to notice all the things he's doing because he doesn't have the ball, but I actually like him doing dirty work, running around...
    Last edited by notque; 11-01-2012 at 02:52 PM.
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  6. #179
    Yeah, I'm a Pacers fan. MyFavMartin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    The defensive advantage Roy brings is when he gets to hang out in front of the rim and challenge shots.

    Him standing out and guarding a player 15ft from the basket takes away that advantage. The Pacers did exactly what they needed to do in order to win, why would you want to change the things that they actually did right?

    They needed to get way more athletic on their front line. Ian was brought in for this exact role. It worked out great.
    Toronto built their 10 point lead with us playing Ian on Barge, so Mahinmi wasn't exactly stopping him.

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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    whew, rough game.

    My first thought was that we really missed Granger. My second was that we really can't let West go next summer, the guy's the heart and soul of this team. My third is that our bench sucks.

    I guess the worst looking player last night was Ian. I didn't see him play in the preseason, but he was just awful last night. Also was very unimpressed with Green. He looked overwhelmed. I also don't think George is going to take that "next step" that I keep hearing about. I'm sure he will continue to improve, but I just don't see him being one of those guys who can take over game. Hibbert has a nice inside game, but it's his D that really changes this team. He has become an excellent interior defender.
    Danger Zone

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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    Toronto built their 10 point lead with us playing Ian on Barge, so Mahinmi wasn't exactly stopping him.
    Yeah, because it was Bargs that totally built that lead. He had two points during that span, and they came from the FT line. Ian did exactly what he was supposed to do, and kept Bargs a non-factor.

    EDIT: When checking the play-by-play, I should have just looked at the Pacers side. Roy was in the game when Toronto went on their run, guarding JV, so yeah...

    http://www.nba.com/games/20121031/IN...meinfo.html#Q3
    Last edited by Since86; 11-01-2012 at 05:04 PM.

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  10. #182
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    There have been very few times in the past five years, where I've seen the team respond well to pressure defense. The in-your-face full court stuff seems to really jostle the team. To me, that was what I saw happen in the 2nd/3rd. Lots of active hands, disrupting passing lanes, etc. Noone was able to really respond to that.

    In most of the first, George and Hibbert were either facilitating or getting great looks thanks to Hill (which was a pleasant surprise). Then they tried to run a few plays through West and it got a little ticky tacky, which amplified throughout the next few quarters. West got pissed off and Hill was jawing to the refs. They all starting losing their mental edge. Toronto defense then started to swarm...

    I give credit to Casey for instilling that motivation in them, but as Unclebuck I believe mentioned earlier... it will be interesting to see if they can keep up that style of defense for 82 games.

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  12. #183
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by notque View Post
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    I just watched the game focusing only on Tyler. It was an interesting experience.

    He is the main inbounder after a defensive make so that Roy gets time to go down the floor
    He dives for rebounds hard since he is the main inbounder, and knows he has to go over there anyway if they make.
    He sets good screens
    The worst thing you can do is give him the ball with the clock going down. Stephensen did this when he should have been the one to ISO. Don't make Tyler Iso.
    He runs well back and forth, harder than most.
    He did the flail around get free throws thing in a situation I wasn't even sure he had the ball secured. Got the call. Good stuff.
    Sometimes he looks like he really wants to be the focus of a play, and gets down a bit that he isn't, but doesn't move any less hard.
    He gave up baskets that weren't his fault, and were entirely the fault of the coaching staff having him cover pick and rolls so high. It's reckless, and I don't see why we do it.

    I came away from the game thinking more highly of him that I did. It's hard to notice all the things he's doing because he doesn't have the ball, but I actually like him doing dirty work, running around...

    I think people get too caught up in how much he's not a starting PF and forget that he's an above average reserve PF. I do think that he seems to have matured over the summer and shouldn't always be the black hole he was much of the time in previous years. Also, his defensive rotations are better.

  13. #184
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Roy and JV weren't on the floor when Toronto built their 10 point lead. Number of points Bargs scored after Roy came on: 0. so, yes, dWest can guard bargs.

    Roy did a good job last night on both ends of the co urt. Ian was a turnover machine who doesnzt command double yeamsor facilitate the offense.

  14. #185

    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Tyler seemed willing to not shoot every time he touched the ball, so that in itself is important. As usual his best asset is typically bulldozing his way to the free throw line.

    Ian Mahimni had a really rough time holding onto the ball, I hope it was debut game jitters because his picks and defense is really solid

  15. #186
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by Pace Maker View Post
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    Tyler seemed willing to not shoot every time he touched the ball, so that in itself is important. As usual his best asset is typically bulldozing his way to the free throw line.

    Ian Mahimni had a really rough time holding onto the ball, I hope it was debut game jitters because his picks and defense is really solid
    I noticed a couple of times how lightning quick Ian was guarding the pick and roll. Something we have sorely needed.
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  17. #187
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    Roy and JV weren't on the floor when Toronto built their 10 point lead. Number of points Bargs scored after Roy came on: 0. so, yes, dWest can guard bargs.

    Roy did a good job last night on both ends of the co urt. Ian was a turnover machine who doesnzt command double yeamsor facilitate the offense.
    I posted the play-by-play so you didn't even have to dig it up yourself. I should have quoted it, I guess.

    09:03
    [TOR 54-53]
    Valanciunas Layup Shot: Made (8 PTS)
    Hibbert Violation: Defensive Goaltending 09:03


    08:38 Bargnani Running Layup Shot: Missed Block: Hibbert (4 BLK)
    Then they go on their run.

    Then
    04:58 Valanciunas Foul: Personal (4 PF)
    04:58 Valanciunas Substitution replaced by Gray


    Here's the biggest lead.
    04:01
    [TOR 67-57]
    Gray Layup Shot: Made (4 PTS) Assist: DeRozan (1 AST)
    And then
    Hibbert Substitution replaced by Mahinmi 02:26
    http://www.nba.com/games/20121031/IN...meinfo.html#Q4
    Last edited by Since86; 11-02-2012 at 08:33 AM.

  18. #188
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I posted the play-by-play so you didn't even have to dig it up yourself. I should have quoted it, I guess.



    Then they go on their run.

    Then



    Here's the biggest lead.


    And then


    http://www.nba.com/games/20121031/IN...meinfo.html#Q4
    I was talking about the 10 point lead later in the game that Toronto had with about 6 minutes left in the game when we all thought we were going to lose and then DWest went all gangster on them.

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  20. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDon View Post
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    George Hill on that last play: "I'm goin rover coach"

    Vogel: "Do not go rover George Hill stick with the play!"
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    Default Re: Indiana-Toronto Postgame

    I thought this was one of the better games that Hansbrough has played in awhile ( dating back to last season of course ).

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