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Thread: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

  1. #2926
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I don't mean to be a dick here guys, but we all know Hoosieryguy's game by now and it gets really tiring as an honest to goodness IU fan who doesn't act like an asshat to come in here and constantly have to read you guys trying to debate him. It ruins the thread for all the other IU fans, and I'm not trying to tell you guys how to post just saying that I think maybe we could all just start to ignore him.
    So it's my fault? I praise IU on an IU sports thread- HOW DARE I!!! Perhaps you should direct your ire at the fans of other schools that clearly have nothing to talk about that stalk every single post I make and pollute this thread with their personal attacks and vendettas.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    In a year of Purdue sports hell, he's the gift that keeps on giving.
    Yes, I'm sure my posts make up for your awful sports teams. That makes a whole lot of sense. You must be really desperate.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    They're the same people.

    Had to.
    That is the most tired Purdue argument. Instead of reflecting on why neither your football or basketball programs are capable of generating any significant interest you choose to insult, without evidence, hundreds of thousands of people who prefer to root for proven WINNERS with national brands. Welcome to the typical American sports fan.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    That is the most tired Purdue argument. Instead of reflecting on why neither your football or basketball programs are capable of generating any significant interest you choose to insult, without evidence, hundreds of thousands of people who prefer to root for proven WINNERS with national brands. Welcome to the typical American sports fan.
    You take sports entirely too seriously.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    I never said IU was the only place with awesome facilities. That is a pure strawman on your part.

    My argument, and it is a shame that I have to make it AGAIN, is that IU has the underlying infrastructure that makes it a better program than Duke. Coach K is Duke's program whereas IU has had success under multiple coaches and maintains a rabid and passionate following even after going through very difficult times over the past decade. That is not up for debate.

    Furthermore, am I not entitled to an opinion, especially when I buttress it with reasonable arguments? There are like five or six Butler/PUke nutjobs that just wait around to pounce on anything I say that might be controversial and turn it into an indictment on my personality. It is rather sick behavior.

    Couldn't someone have easily said the same thing about Bobby Knight? When he was fired in 2000, he was the program for all intensive purposes. Sure we had the 1940 and 1953 championships before him, but those were a lifetime before Knight's tenure. Yet what has happened with the fan base in the 13 years since Knight has been gone? It has remained fiercely loyal, despite many rough years. Likewise, Duke's supporters will remain fiercely loyal to Duke whenever Coach K leaves. It won't be a messy situation like we had with Knight where we axed him and then gave a dud his job. No, Duke will have plenty of time to hire one of the many top candidates who lineup for the job. High school players all over the country will still recognize Duke as an elite brand of winning and will thus want to play there. It will be sad for Duke fans when Coach K leaves, but the program will survive and keep winning.

    Denny Crum and Louisville is another example. He coached there for thirty years and won two championships (just one less than Knight). But when he left, they brought in Pitino and kept on winning. Coach K won't be the first coach who is synonymous with his program to leave.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    I never said that you said IU was the only place with awesome facilities. I said you act like it, which is true considering you use it as a point for IU in a post trying to explain how IU is better than Duke. If both of them have great facilities, then there is no point to be made.

    But whatever man, you put me in my place.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    I never said IU was the only place with awesome facilities. That is a pure strawman on your part.

    My argument, and it is a shame that I have to make it AGAIN, is that IU has the underlying infrastructure that makes it a better program than Duke. Coach K is Duke's program whereas IU has had success under multiple coaches and maintains a rabid and passionate following even after going through very difficult times over the past decade. That is not up for debate.

    Furthermore, am I not entitled to an opinion, especially when I buttress it with reasonable arguments? There are like five or six Butler/PUke nutjobs that just wait around to pounce on anything I say that might be controversial and turn it into an indictment on my personality. It is rather sick behavior.
    Your argument should be made over and over again, until you can get it to a point that isn't totally absurd. We aren't there yet. What makes a program "complete," and what does "complete," even mean? What is the "underlying infrastructure" that you think IU has, that Duke lacks?

    IU has a great (although you aren't helping this case any) group of fans. They stuck with them through a few lean years. Nobody tried to argue anything to the contrary. You think all of the fans of Duke basketball, are simply fans of Coach K, and will just disappear the very second he retires? Too bad the best college basketball program of the past couple decades doesn't have that "underlying infrastructure" to keep them, I guess.

    All these "controversial" statements you continually make, are not controversy in any sense of the word. They are mostly the senseless, rambling statements of a raving lunatic. So far the only thing you've said on this topic that can be classified as a reasonable argument, is that IU has a larger arena. It's larger. Not as nice as Cameron, but certainly larger.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    That is the most tired Purdue argument. Instead of reflecting on why neither your football or basketball programs are capable of generating any significant interest you choose to insult, without evidence, hundreds of thousands of people who prefer to root for proven WINNERS with national brands. Welcome to the typical American sports fan.
    He was talking about Duke basketball and Notre Dame football fans being the same people (Of course, there are plenty of IU/UND fans including the Ball State grad in the cubicle next to me), but you keep doing you.

    Also, the bolded section is exactly why the following is laughable:

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    IU has a MUCH larger fanbase
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

    -Lance Stephenson

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    I'm not sure hoosierguy isn't at least on the right track with the larger fanbase statement, at least in regards to UCLA, which is where I believe it started. Larger than Duke? I doubt that.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I'm not sure hoosierguy isn't at least on the right track with the larger fanbase statement, at least in regards to UCLA, which is where I believe it started. Larger than Duke? I doubt that.
    He's arguing it as larger than Duke. Not UCLA.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    They are mostly the senseless, rambling statements of a raving lunatic.
    I am not raving about Agenda 21 and black helicopters or the magic gnomes that speak to me. Grow the hell up! I merely contended and will continue to contend that the IU is a stronger program because it has maintained its fanbase and support through very difficult times, a situation that Duke has yet to experience. Did I hit a sore spot with you? Who cares if you think Duke is a better program? You want a cookie for scolding me?

    Comments like the one I quoted are out of line but par for the course for someone of your low moral fiber- you routinely resort to absurd hyperbole and nasty personal attacks when someone has the audacity to post something with which you disagree. For example, you took a completely unwarranted shot at Nuntius a couple of weeks ago, attacking his country of origin.
    Last edited by hoosierguy; 04-02-2013 at 10:00 PM.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    Your argument should be made over and over again, until you can get it to a point that isn't totally absurd. We aren't there yet. What makes a program "complete," and what does "complete," even mean? What is the "underlying infrastructure" that you think IU has, that Duke lacks?

    IU has a great (although you aren't helping this case any) group of fans. They stuck with them through a few lean years. Nobody tried to argue anything to the contrary. You think all of the fans of Duke basketball, are simply fans of Coach K, and will just disappear the very second he retires? Too bad the best college basketball program of the past couple decades doesn't have that "underlying infrastructure" to keep them, I guess.
    What the hell is this? The Inquisition? Are you so agonized by the failure that is Purdue athletics that you resort to pathetically taking out your anger on me?

    Let me make this simple for you: the underlying infrastructure is as follows- a consistent and battle tested fanbase that supports the program in the leanest of years. The Duke fanbase has not had its devotion tested with multiple bad seasons and coaching changes. How will it respond if such events do come to pass? The underlying infrastructure also includes location in a fertile recruiting area that produces numerous high D1 prospects that are familiar with the tradition and brand that is Indiana basketball. Proximity matters. Furthermore, the IU fanbase travels extremely well and supports the team wherever it plays. I revise my statement that IU has better overall facilities, since the value of the size of venue can be debated (I think bigger is better) but it is at least a draw with Duke. As previously stated, Duke has had better on court success without question but that is irrelevant to the fundamental point I am making- the IU mens basketball program transcends any one coach and survives and thrives even in the leanest of years- THAT is why I said that the IU program is stronger.

    After the success of the past two seasons and the aforementioned factors it is clear that with a good coach IU can and will continue to attract the interest of elite talent across the country and compete at the highest of levels, including against Duke. Noah Vonleh, Troy Williams, Theo Pinson, and Dante Exum are all high level recruits that have either committed to IU or are seriously considering the school.

    What I have articulated in this post is in no way the "ramblings of a raving lunatic" as you so typically stated. It is the heartfelt belief of a fan that has seen the sleeping giant awaken.
    Last edited by hoosierguy; 04-02-2013 at 10:01 PM.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    No, Duke will have plenty of time to hire one of the many top candidates who lineup for the job. High school players all over the country will still recognize Duke as an elite brand of winning and will thus want to play there. It will be sad for Duke fans when Coach K leaves, but the program will survive and keep winning.
    If that does in fact happen then I will issue a mea culpa. However, as of now that remains to be seen. If Duke makes a coaching hire mistake and the program struggles will the fanbase still remain passionate and devoted? We know what happened with IU- that is my entire point- the underlying infrastructure remained which allowed a coach that started with two walk-ons to build to a #1 ranking for 10 weeks in just four years. When Duke comes back from the pits of Hell then we can talk.
    Last edited by hoosierguy; 04-02-2013 at 10:10 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    If that does in fact happen then I will issue a mea culpa. However, as of now that remains to be seen. If Duke makes a coaching hire mistake and the program struggles will the fanbase still remain passionate and devoted? We know what happened with IU- that is my entire point- the underlying infrastructure remained which allowed a coach that started with two walk-ons to build to a #1 ranking for 10 weeks in just four years. When Duke comes back from the pits of Hell then we can talk.
    Underlying infrastructure Is pretty redundant. Duke has been one of the most dominant programs for the past 20 years plus. I don't give a crap about fanbases but Duke is the number one fanbase. Live in southern California as far away from both schools as possible. See a **** ton of duke stuff, haven't seen anything IU oriented.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Just playing devil's advocate here: We all seem to agree on one thing: 99% of Duke's fanbase did not actually attend Duke. I would wager that 97% of them have a real connection to the university (parent/sibling/relative went there, from Durham, etc). They weren't "nothing" before Coach K arrived, but they weren't exactly a national brand like they are now. Say Coach K leaves and they make a poor coaching hire. Or two. Or three. They have a decade like Indiana just had. How many of these people who are wearing Duke shirts in Southern California will still be wearing Duke shirts? Duke may have a larger fanbase, but I'd be willing to bet they are a much more fickle fanbase than Indiana's.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I don't mean to be a dick here guys, but we all know Hoosieryguy's game by now and it gets really tiring as an honest to goodness IU fan who doesn't act like an asshat to come in here and constantly have to read you guys trying to debate him. It ruins the thread for all the other IU fans, and I'm not trying to tell you guys how to post just saying that I think maybe we could all just start to ignore him.
    You would have us miss out on this?!?!?
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Just playing devil's advocate here: We all seem to agree on one thing: 99% of Duke's fanbase did not actually attend Duke. I would wager that 97% of them have a real connection to the university (parent/sibling/relative went there, from Durham, etc). They weren't "nothing" before Coach K arrived, but they weren't exactly a national brand like they are now. Say Coach K leaves and they make a poor coaching hire. Or two. Or three. They have a decade like Indiana just had. How many of these people who are wearing Duke shirts in Southern California will still be wearing Duke shirts? Duke may have a larger fanbase, but I'd be willing to bet they are a much more fickle fanbase than Indiana's.
    I don't disagree with any of that. Does that one simple fact, that IU has a more sturdy fanbase, mean that somehow IU has an "underlying infrastructure" that makes it a better college basketball program?

    Hell no.

    Am I really supposed to believe that just because IU chose to hire a totally unqualified Mike Davis, and then a known cheater in Kelvin Sampson, and the fans didn't bail, that alone makes IU a better program than Duke? This myth that Duke was 100% the creation of Coach K, and that as soon as he goes, Duke will fall back into the woodwork, is ridiculous. Like IU before and after Coach Knight, Duke had success before Coach K, and they will continue to have success after he is gone. Will some of their bandwagon fans go away with a few years of struggle? Sure, probably, and then they will be right back on the bandwagon when they start winning again. That doesn't make them a worse program. That means they probably have a more fickle fanbase.

    Look at Notre Dame football for a perfect example of this. After Lou Holtz, they hired Bob Davie, Ty Willingham, and Charlie Weis, before Brian Kelly took them back to playing for a National Championship. National brands like ND football, and Duke basketball can withstand a few bad hires, and a stretch of bad seasons. They have had enough prolonged success, that they won't simply fade into the black, overnight. They may not have been the best program in college basketball before Coach K, but they certainly are now, and they will remain a national brand after he is gone. "Underlying infrastructure" is a really dumb term, but by this dumb definition, Duke basketball certainly has plenty of it.
    Last edited by Mackey_Rose; 04-03-2013 at 08:18 AM.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Terry Hutchens, wrote about the upcoming springcreaning that will be required.

    http://www.indystar.com/article/2013...hips-available

    Quote Originally Posted by Terry Hutchens, Indy Star
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    While Indiana basketball fans await the decisions of Victor Oladipo and Cody Zeller about entering the NBA, another issue looms:

    There are more players committed to the Hoosiers than scholarships.

    Indiana has 16 scholarship players for 13 spots. Even if Oladipo and Zeller leave, one player will still be left out.

    Zeller and Oladipo have until April 16 to withdraw from NBA consideration and retain college eligibility. While Oladipo, a junior and first-team All-America, seems sure to leave, Zeller, a sophomore and second-team all-America, might choose to return to get stronger and develop a power forward’s game.

    Schools have until July 1 to notify athletes if year-to-year scholarships are not being renewed.

    Asked for an interview with IU coach Tom Crean, athletic department spokesman J.D. Campbell said, "Coach will be happy to address these types of questions at an end-of-the-year news conference."

    Campbell said Crean plans to have that news conference before the end of the semester. Finals are the first week of May.

    IU was in a similar situation last year, having “over-signed” by one player. Former Broad Ripple standout Ron Patterson, one of five players in Indiana’s recruiting class, announced Aug. 15 he would not be attending IU after failing to meet academic standards. He later signed to play at Syracuse and will be eligible in the fall.

    It appeared that IU over-signed by two players last year, but the school opted not to bring Matt Roth back for a fifth year academically and fourth in terms of eligibility. Roth, who earned his undergraduate and graduate degrees at IU, had been informed early in the 2011-12 season that he likely would not have a scholarship in 2012-13.

    Here’s the current situation with IU’s roster:

    The Hoosiers lose three players from the past season --- Derek Elston, Jordan Hulls and Christian Watford.

    Ten scholarship players remain: Remy Abell, Maurice Creek, Austin Etherington, Yogi Ferrell, Jeremy Hollowell, Peter Jurkin, Hanner Mosquera-Perea, Victor Oladipo, Will Sheehey and Cody Zeller.

    In November, IU signed a six-player recruiting class -- Devin Davis, Collin Hartman, Luke Fischer, Stanford Robinson, Troy Williams and Noah Vonleh.

    Call Star reporter Terry Hutchens at (317) 444-6469. Follow him at twitter.com/indystar_hutch.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Mo Creek will get the Matt Roth treatment and it will work out.

    And if Zeller stays and his reason is to get stronger and develop a power forward game, he's totally pulling a Gob Bluth.
    Last edited by BRushWithDeath; 04-03-2013 at 09:03 AM.
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    Mo Creek will get the Matt Roth treatment and it will work out.

    And if Zeller stays and his reason is to get stronger and develop a power forward game, he's totally pulling a Gob Bluth.
    I agree on the Creek part. I also think Peter Jurkin is out the door.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Aulani Sinclair won the womens 3 point shootout, Hulls got 2nd in the mens. And that dude from Detroit can freaking dunk.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Hoosier baseball going for 17 straight wins tonight against Illinois. It is IU's first ever home night game.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    Aulani Sinclair won the womens 3 point shootout, Hulls got 2nd in the mens. And that dude from Detroit can freaking dunk.

    His dunks were better than anything I've seen in the NBA dunk contest in some time. That's the way it should be done. Plus, none of this give me 5 tries to complete the dunk stuff. He did every dunk on the first try and got all perfect scores. He would smash the field of the NBA contest.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Hoosier baseball going for 17 straight wins tonight against Illinois. It is IU's first ever home night game.
    I hope they can pull out another win to keep the streak alive. I'm going to their game tomorrow. Looking forward to checking out the new stadium.
    Take me out to the black, tell 'em I ain't coming back. Burn the land and boil the sea, you can't take the sky from me.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    FWIW, I keep reading where Oladipo is 100% gone, but Zeller is "leaning" towards leaving, but no one really knows. That kid is a ****ing expert at keeping secrets. His recruitment was a guessing game until the day he announced his decision.

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