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Thread: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

  1. #351
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    What really frustrates me is that Cal isn't a good coach. Last year, none of his 5 players knew they should have fouled there at the end. And his teams always suck on FTs, why they had to have an amazing night against us in the tourney I have no clue.

    But understanding when to foul, and hitting FTs are the little things good coaches get their players to do. Verdell Jones and Watford might not have been able to hold a candle to any of the Kentucky starters last year in the talent department, but they were much better coached players.
    It's tough for me to not at least say Cal is a good coach, he is able to blend his teams in a very short amount of time. I think he does struggle as an in game coach though.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    First year at UK he got to the Elite 8. The next year he got to the Final Four. The third year he won it all. Seems like he's a good coach to me.

  3. #353

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    First year at UK he got to the Elite 8. The next year he got to the Final Four. The third year he won it all. Seems like he's a good coach to me.
    Having a team of nba rookies and winning doesnt make you a good coach. Actually teaching them makes you a good coach

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    Having a team of nba rookies and winning doesnt make you a good coach. Actually teaching them makes you a good coach
    The record speaks for itself. Being able to recruit and secure the best talent coupled with the task of convincing them to play TEAM ball (at the expense of egos) requires a great leader, motivator, and coach. If he recruited the best and they played street ball and failed in the big games I might agree with you. That's not the case by any stretch of the imagination. Be upset with the rules, not the man playing by them.

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  6. #355
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Darren,

    Just out of curiosity, how do you rationalize what Cal was most likely caught up in at UMass and Memphis? Or do you just accept that he was completely ignorant to it?

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  7. #356

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Hes had the most talented team in the country what 5 years and won it all once. Butler has a great coach, Kentucky has a great recruiter

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    Hes had the most talented team in the country what 5 years and won it all once. Butler has a great coach, Kentucky has a great recruiter
    85% of being a good coach is being a good recruiter.
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Darren35 View Post
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    Be upset with the rules, not the man playing by them.

    But Cal doesn't play by the rules, that's the problem!

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Joe,

    I thought that the NCAA had cleared Rose to play before the season- reviewed the transcripts, tests, etc- just like they did with Wall and now Noel; afterwards, they declared him ineligible and the season was vacated. If Calapari knew that Rose didnt take that class then I would not support him at all. Camby hired an agent during the season- I really doubt Cal knew this, but again he might have.

    I told all my UK loving buddies that hiring Cal was a mistake in the beginning- the more I looked into it, the more I felt like he might have a bad rap. Ultimately, I think he falls somewhere between those that believe he is a cheater and those that think he was the victim. I dont personally know so I just take it a year at a time with him.

    Also, I have heard that Crean is good friends with him. I would not think Crean would associate with someone that is a cheater. If UK goes down because of something Cal did, then I'll burn all my UK mdse.

    My son is most likely going to end up at IU next year- I tried to push him toward UK or WKU but the campus at IU is hard to beat (not to mention the business school). I cant believe this is happening to me, but what the heck...it is his decision. My daughter says whe will attend UL in three years- another stab in the back- at least I have a few years to change her mind.

    So I suppose I might be a UK and IU fan next year.

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  14. #360
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    IU's campus is top notch there is no doubt.

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  15. #361

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    85% of being a good coach is being a good recruiter.
    No its not. They are very different things. Very different skill sets. High Schools aren't supposed to recruit, so what there are no great high school level coaches? NBA coaches don't go out and negotiate with FAs on a day to day basis, so what there are no great NBA coaches.

    Coaching is about knowing the game of basketball and being able to impart that knowledge to kids. Recruiting is simply one of the jobs a coach has to undertake to hopefully get a talented player he can then coach up and improve. And thats the problem with Cal, he doesn't teach the kids. They get to the NBA and not only are they less talented comparatively, they also have less of an understanding of a game than they could if they had gone to college with a good coach.


    Unless Cal is paying players he isn't a cheater though. Hes just a jerk willing to exploit young desperate kids for his own benefit.

    But really its the NBAs fault, they need to copy the MLB model. And even though it will never happen they need to stop overrating complimentary players on championship level teams.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Exploit? I think it's a mutually beneficial relationship. The players are better off after playing for him.

    Calipari wins so the fans are happy. He gets players in the NBA which makes the players happy.

    Assuming he is playing by the rules, nothing else really matters.

  17. #363

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    Hes had the most talented team in the country what 5 years and won it all once.
    And that one was aided by the threat of an NBA lockout causing three important upperclassmen to return for another year and help the one-and-dones accomplish something they could not have done on their own, IMO.

    I do not think that there will be any more championships for Cal and will be saddened if I am wrong.
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    No its not. They are very different things. Very different skill sets. High Schools aren't supposed to recruit, so what there are no great high school level coaches? NBA coaches don't go out and negotiate with FAs on a day to day basis, so what there are no great NBA coaches.

    Coaching is about knowing the game of basketball and being able to impart that knowledge to kids. Recruiting is simply one of the jobs a coach has to undertake to hopefully get a talented player he can then coach up and improve. And thats the problem with Cal, he doesn't teach the kids. They get to the NBA and not only are they less talented comparatively, they also have less of an understanding of a game than they could if they had gone to college with a good coach.


    Unless Cal is paying players he isn't a cheater though. Hes just a jerk willing to exploit young desperate kids for his own benefit.

    But really its the NBAs fault, they need to copy the MLB model. And even though it will never happen they need to stop overrating complimentary players on championship level teams.
    I do think that high schools recruit and they have done it for a long time. Doesn't seem like a lot of players wind up at Lawrence North? In the mid sixties, I played for a small school in southern Indiana and a legendary coach in the area named Howard Sharpe recruited me to play for his team in Terre Haute, IN. He had a family for me to live with and everything. My father wouldn't buy it so I stayed at my small school. But I know of several players in that area that Sharpe did get to move to Terre Haute and play for him......

  19. #365
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    No its not. They are very different things. Very different skill sets. High Schools aren't supposed to recruit, so what there are no great high school level coaches? NBA coaches don't go out and negotiate with FAs on a day to day basis, so what there are no great NBA coaches.

    Coaching is about knowing the game of basketball and being able to impart that knowledge to kids. Recruiting is simply one of the jobs a coach has to undertake to hopefully get a talented player he can then coach up and improve. And thats the problem with Cal, he doesn't teach the kids. They get to the NBA and not only are they less talented comparatively, they also have less of an understanding of a game than they could if they had gone to college with a good coach.


    Unless Cal is paying players he isn't a cheater though. Hes just a jerk willing to exploit young desperate kids for his own benefit.

    But really its the NBAs fault, they need to copy the MLB model. And even though it will never happen they need to stop overrating complimentary players on championship level teams.
    Okay. 85% of coaching is having the team with the best players. In college, that means in recruiting.

    It's cliche but Jimmy's and Joe's really do beat X's and O's.

    A bad coach can lose with good players. A good coach will lose with bad players.
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  20. #366

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    recruiting has really only been a really big deal for what 15-20 years?
    It's been pretty big for a long time. Classes were ranked back in the 80s. It was a big deal when Knight recruited Damon Bailey as an 8th grader.

    On Ky, I remember when Shawn Kemp made his campus visit to IU. He was a funny guy who loved to talk, and of course a big-time recruit. He made it 100% crystal clear that IU, or anyone else, was not in the running unless the coaches could do "for him and his family what Kentucky was going to do for us."

    Of course he did go to Kentucky, stole the coach's son's jewelry, and was kicked off the team.

    I wonder if Eddie Sutton or the KY boosters got his money back. Not for the jewels, but for what they had done "for him and his family." We all knew Kentucky players were paid since forever. It was just kind of funny to hear it straight from one of them, and this was before the Emery money package exploded en route to its delivery to Chris Mills. Kentucky cheats like a dog pants and smiles. All day, every day.
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    There is a HUGE Inside the Locker Room up on Peegs. I will skim and try to post some good tidbits.

    http://indiana.rivals.com/showmsg.as...id=942&style=2

    Quote Originally Posted by Rabjohns
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    We have timetables on visits and updates for all remaining 2013 basketball prospects, updates to the Hoosier Hysteria visitor list that is now pushing two dozen and some major football news regarding four-star prospects that could give Indiana its best football recruiting class in program history.

    Here is the updated list of confirmed visitors for Hoosier Hysteria:

    Class of 2013
    BeeJay Anya - DeMatha Catholic (Md)
    Troy Williams - Oak Hill Academy (Va)
    Devin Davis - Warren Central (In)
    Stanford Robinson - Findlay Prep (Nv)
    Collin Hartman - Indianapolis Cathedral (In)
    Luke Fischer - Germantown (Wi)

    Class of 2014
    James Blackmon Jr.- Forth Wayne Bishop Luers (In)
    Trevon Bluiett ? Indianapolis Park Tudor (In)
    JaQuan Lyle - Evansville Bosse (In)
    Ernie Duncan - Evansville Harrison (In)
    Bryant McIntosh - Greensburg (In)



    Class of 2015
    Hyron Edwards ? East Chicago Central (In)
    Jalen Coleman - Indianapolis Cathedral (In)
    Luke Kennard - Franklin (Oh)
    Bronson Kessinger - Corydon Central (In)
    Chandler White ? Forth Wayne Carroll (In)
    Josh Speidel - Columbus North (In)
    Stanley Duncan - Evansville Harrison (In)
    Everett Duncan - Evansville Harrison (In)

    Class of 2016
    Eron Gordon - North Central (In)
    Vijay Blackmon ? Fort Wayne Bishop Luers (In)
    Garrett Holland - Indianapolis Cathedral (In)

    In talking with several AP voters we know, it seems there is growing sentiment that IU is the best team entering the season after summer brought us what seemed more 50-50 opinions on either IU or Louisville.

    Here is what Sports Illustrated's Seth Davis wrote on Twitter after sitting a couple seats down from me at practice this week:

    "1. Expect Zeller to handle the ball and shoot more from the perimeter. Won't get away from what he does best but he'll be harder to guard.

    "2. Yogi Ferrell is L-E-G-I-T. Short but built like a running back. Great speed, vision and court sense. Can shoot it too. The missing piece.

    "3. Indiana's depth has depth. A lot of internal competition. Crean's entire focus was on toughness yesterday. Sheehey is much improved.

    "Having just watched Ohio State and Louisville, I had a nice frame of reference. IU is better than both. Only team in U.S. not missing anything."

    Peegs.com has heard that Allen, Kenney and Latham, along with Avon defensive end Elijah Daniel, are expected to be in attendance for Hoosier Hysteria tomorrow night at IU.

    Speaking of Daniel, there has been a lot of speculation that he could also be close to committing to Indiana. While there is a great deal of basis for that speculation, it appears that the Clemson commit is not as close to changing his pledge as Kenney and Latham are.

    Josh Helmholdt reported earlier this week that a commitment from Daniel could just be a matter of time for IU based on what he is hearing:

    "The one prospect who could be worth watching closest in the coming weeks is Rivals250 defensive end Elijah Daniel of Avon, Ind. Daniel was also in attendance for Saturday's game in Bloomington and spent a lot of time with both Kenney and Latham. Daniel's commitment to Clemson is very soft, by his own admission, and other schools have slowed their recruitment of the four-star over concerns about his qualification potential. Indiana, however, continues to pursue hard and the impending commitments of two of Daniel's good friends could swing this recruitment in the Hoosier's favor."

    A couple other Indy area prospects that could be next for the Hoosiers are offensive lineman Tim Gardner from Lawrence Central H.S. and linebacker John Kenny from Carmel H.S. Gardner is committed to Ohio State while Kenny is an Iowa pledge. Both have been down to IU for unofficial visits this fall, and according to Helmholdt they are listening to what IU has to say:

    "Other prospects in that watch category are Indianapolis Lawrence Central offensive lineman Timothy Gardner and Carmel, Ind., linebacker John Kenny. Both have made game visits to Indiana this fall - Gardner on more than one occasion. Kenny is also committed to Iowa and close friends with (David) Kenney. We'll see if the latter's decommitment has any effect on the former. Gardner, meanwhile, is committed to Ohio State, but there is obviously some strong interest in the Hoosiers there."

    It goes without saying that this could be a huge next few days and weeks for the Indiana football program.Coach Kevin Wilson and his staff have made the state of Indiana a top priority since the day they came to IU and it looks like it could pay-off in a monster way.It is no secret that Indiana has struggled for years on the defensive side of the ball, but adding guys like Allen, Kenney, Latham and Daniel would give them the type of talent it takes to build a shutdown defense.If they can also add J. Kenny at linebacker then it would give them a very talented player at every level of the defense.And there is also the strong possibility that 4-star cornerback Rashard Fant from Georgia joins the IU class.He recently came out with his top four and the Hoosiers are number one on his list.

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  22. #368

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    Exploit? I think it's a mutually beneficial relationship. The players are better off after playing for him.

    Calipari wins so the fans are happy. He gets players in the NBA which makes the players happy.

    Assuming he is playing by the rules, nothing else really matters.
    Show me which one of the players on last years team wouldn't have gone to the NBA anyway?

  23. #369
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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Crean says he wants HH tomorrow to be standing room only and says the fire department better be ready to deal with it haha.

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  24. #370

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    There is a HUGE Inside the Locker Room up on Peegs. I will skim and try to post some good tidbits.

    http://indiana.rivals.com/showmsg.as...id=942&style=2
    I liked the part about "Only team in U.S. not missing anything." Makes me suspect Crean has succeeded in shoring up the defense. Otherwise there would be a but or an except after that sentence.

    And ***** on the football recruiting front. WTH has happened.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    With the new baseball stadium going up, the fact that the soccer team is looking as good as ever, and everything going with bball and football, it is a hell of a time to be an IU fan. And it's tough not to give Crean a ton of credit for the effort he has put in on all fronts.

    When he stood up there and took this job and said "It's Indiana." I couldn't tell whether it was just joy or truth, well it looks like he was all in with us. It's Indiana, It's Indiana.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Crean has done a fantastic job in coaching and recruiting. Last year's team hustled and was not intimidated one bit- not even facing hostile crowds bothered them...kind of played with a swagger. Fans of other teams definitely could tell a difference. This team is flat out deserving of a top ranking. I am not much of a gambler, but I wouldnt bet against them this year.

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    I just spent the last hour or so watching videos and things of last year, the Kentucky game, Crean's introductory presser, etc. I've come to this conclusion: No matter what happens this year (good or bad), last year will go down as my favorite year for IU basketball in my lifetime. Given the context of the situation, the last four years, all the misery, the fact that I was at that Kentucky game, the high level of character of every single player on that team, all the crap the upperclassmen went through...just a special group. Sometimes you need that perspective from the bottom to truly appreciate the top. I just hope we win our last game this season.

  28. #374

    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    looks like Elijah Daniel decommited today

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    Default Re: Indiana University Athletics Thread 2012-2013

    Wow. Hoosier Hysteria is not only a packed house, but it looks like several thousand people who were in line will not be getting in. Amazing showing from Hoosier fans.

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