Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

Collapse
X
Collapse
 
  • Page of 15
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
Previous 1 2 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 template Next
  • #166
    Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

    Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    Omg... where have you been? You're not posting anything profound, we are all aware of the possible ways to fail, we've all been down that road and know what can happen... but why the hell would any true fan focus on that?

    The case of OlBlu goes way beyond thin-skinned homers. It has nothing to do with what he's saying -- it's how he goes about it, and the frequency of it. I don't care if people have dissenting opinions. OlBlu doesn't get that either. It's how he goes about doing it. We start a normal discussion, and you can count on OlBlu entering the thread and just destroying it within a day. And you can count on him insinuating that we're a bunch of non-thinking sheepish idiots who can't form our own thoughts and all we want to do is be mindless rah-rah-rah cheerleaders for our team. He's called more people names on this forum than anyone I can remember. He posts unnecessary negative tangents to threads where he completely didn't stay on topic, and then pulls the ol "oh everyone is ganging up on me, and calling me a troll, poor me" schpiel.

    Let's give you an example. Someone posts:

    OP: Hey guys, what do you think about us getting Vontae Davis?
    Random poster #1: I think he'll be this and that.
    Random poster #2: Yea, but he has this negative, but I think he'll overcome it with this positive.
    Random poster #3: Ya, good pickup, he's 24 and young and this coaching staff will get him in shape.
    OlBlu: It doesn't matter because we'll go 0-16 with or without him. Irsay can't be trusted and Peyton Manning is going to throw 6 touchdowns on him. (Take note that there was no mention of the topic at hand).
    Random poster #1: Haven't you said this in 57 other threads also?
    OlBlu: If you don't like it, then don't read it.
    Random poster #2: Yea, but isn't this excessive? Most people would call this trolling.
    OlBlu: Why does everyoen call me a troll, you're all just stupid rah-rah homers who thinks the Colts are going 16-0 and Luck should be in the HoF. I don't think he'll make it through the season. We should probly draft Barkley from USC next year when we have the #1 pick again since Luck will out of the league by then.
    Random poster #3: Ugh, welcome to ignore.
    Random poster #2: I don't come here often, and I think I'll come here less now.
    OlBlu: I'm 65 and live in a retirement home although my status says I live in a big motorhome and travel the country, and don't have time to wait for the Colts to get good again, and--- Irsay is making Jerry Jones look like a Rhodes scholar.
    Random poster #1: Um, can you show some proof that we all think Indy is going 16-0 this year?
    OlBlu: Look, I've already posted this, go look it up, I'm not reposting something I've already written. Something about CTRL-SHIFT refreshes the page.
    ChicagoJ: Guys, what's wrong with what he said, why are you so thin-skinned.

    And never once did he discuss Vontae Davis.

    That's what we get all up in arms about. It's not a productive argument, it's just getting people riled up. He's not out to have a productive convo.

    Take like... Kstat. He's not a Pacer fan, but he comes here and provides a counter-opinion, knows when to stop, and he's part of a productive exchange... but OlBlu, just pisses people off. We can't have a Colts football discussion without him ruining it. We all get it, he thinks they suck, so move on. But he doesn't. He absolutely refuses to let us have 1 stinking positive thought about the Colts, or even a regular neutral thought. He has to ram it into our heads that he thinks they suck.

    And now you seem to joining in... trust me, that's not a path you want to go down if you want to maintain your rep around here, lol...
    I agree with you often, but I seriously doubt ChicagoJ is going down the same path that OB went. His argument is reasonable (A crappy line CAN break a team - hopefully we get that fixed soon for Mr. Luck). I've read a few of his replies and he seems to be able to back up his comments instead of going off on rants about Irsay shaving off the top (He did say he didn't like Irsay, but it wasn't in some annoying conspiratorial way). People may think he's wrong, but his comments aren't certainly out of line. Also he's been on the board since 2004 and I'm pretty confident most long-time PD members would know better than to waste brain cells derailing every Colts thread.
    Never half-a** two things. Whole-a** one thing.

    Comment

    • #167
      Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

      You obviously want the best QB you can get. All I'm pointing out is that your chances of getting at least a solid starter (if not better), is with a top 5 pick. Sure, there are great QBs from later picks but the odds are against you picking the right QB.

      When you have a top 5 pick (which isn't going to be every year for most teams), you have a need at QB and there's a highly rated QB available, you don't pass him up. period.

      Comment

      • #168
        Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

        Originally posted by Swingman View Post
        You obviously want the best QB you can get. All I'm pointing out is that your chances of getting at least a solid starter (if not better), is with a top 5 pick. Sure, there are great QBs from later picks but the odds are against you picking the right QB.

        When you have a top 5 pick (which isn't going to be every year for most teams), you have a need at QB and there's a highly rated QB available, you don't pass him up. period.
        Nah. I really don't care about the QB position. I want the best core of linebackers I can get, playing behind a physical defensive line. And I want to turn those LBs loose, at full speed, at QBs playing behind weak offensive lines while the front-three stuff all the running gaps.

        But that's why I'm a Steelers fan.

        No surprises here.

        But you get better value for LBs lower in the draft, especially when you have a penchant for converting undersized college DEs to monster LBs.
        Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
        Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
        Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
        Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
        And life itself, rushing over me
        Life itself, the wind in black elms,
        Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

        Comment

        • #169
          Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

          Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
          Nah. I really don't care about the QB position. I want the best core of linebackers I can get, playing behind a physical defensive line. And I want to turn those LBs loose, at full speed, at QBs playing behind weak offensive lines while the front-three stuff all the running gaps.

          But that's why I'm a Steelers fan.

          No surprises here.

          But you get better value for LBs lower in the draft, especially when you have a penchant for converting undersized college DEs to monster LBs.



          Quite simply, that comment is beyond ridiculous. QB's, not LB's win championships. CompAce, forget about the dude's join date and status here, ChicagoJ is freakin nuts
          Being unable to close out a game in which you have a comfortable lead in the 4th Q = Pulling a Frank Vogel

          Comment

          • #170
            Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

            Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
            I'm just saying, there might be some over-the-top comments in this thread that ruffled my feathers too, and not all of them came from OlBlu.
            Just in case this got lost in the shuffle, it bears repeating.
            Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
            Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
            Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
            Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
            And life itself, rushing over me
            Life itself, the wind in black elms,
            Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

            Comment

            • #171
              Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

              Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
              Nah. I really don't care about the QB position. I want the best core of linebackers I can get, playing behind a physical defensive line. And I want to turn those LBs loose, at full speed, at QBs playing behind weak offensive lines while the front-three stuff all the running gaps.

              But that's why I'm a Steelers fan.

              No surprises here.

              But you get better value for LBs lower in the draft, especially when you have a penchant for converting undersized college DEs to monster LBs.

              You say you don't care about the QB position, yet you've ragged on Kordell Stewart how many times on here? Whether you want to admit it or not, I think that deep down you know that QB is an important position. Don't take Ben for granted. If you had to watch Collins and Painter QB your team for most of the season then you would be yearning for the days of Ben's QB play.

              A great defense doesn't do you much good if you don't have a QB that can put points on the board. The Colts defense gave it to the Steelers last year and had Manning played, we would have ran them out of Lucas. But our pitiful QBs couldn't take advantage of the great game that the defense played.

              QB was without question one of the most pressing needs for the Colts this off-season. I don't see why spending *one* draft pick on a QB means that we are going to neglect every other position in the game. It's not like we traded a bunch of good players for him ala Jeff George in 1990. We can use all of our draft picks in future years to fix the other positions, as well as improve them through free agency.

              Comment

              • #172
                Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                This just in, according to Forbes: of the ten highest-paid players this season, 4 are defensive linemen, 4 are QBs, 1 is an OT and 1 is a WR.

                The highest paid player in the league is a (gasp) defensive player.

                You guys might be familiar with him.

                http://www.indystar.com/article/2012...player-season?

                Guess you better tell that team how out of touch they are with your plans to build a team the newfangled way.

                Hee hee.
                Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                And life itself, rushing over me
                Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                Comment

                • #173
                  Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                  Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                  You say you don't care about the QB position, yet you've ragged on Kordell Stewart how many times on here? Whether you want to admit it or not, I think that deep down you know that QB is an important position. Don't take Ben for granted. If you had to watch Collins and Painter QB your team for most of the season then you would be yearning for the days of Ben's QB play.
                  Okay, I'm guilty of a little bit of hyperbole. Its in the top-five of important football positions, but not the most important position. I've watched O'Donnell take a team to the Super Bowl. Kordell to the AFC Championship game. TommyGun to the playoffs. That's 3-4 more SuperBowls we could've won with a better QB than those bozos. I've never said the idea is to pick up a rec-league QB but I've said over and over that you CAN find a QB to lead a well-rounded team outside of the top five picks.

                  A great defense doesn't do you much good if you don't have a QB that can put points on the board. The Colts defense gave it to the Steelers last year and had Manning played, we would have ran them out of Lucas. But our pitiful QBs couldn't take advantage of the great game that the defense played.
                  You got great QB play that game, from turnover-prone Ben. Meanwhile, if our defense can hold opponents to 13 or less then we don't need a high scoring offense. We need a competent offense that keeps its hands on the ball for long periods of time, but not a high scoring one.

                  QB was without question one of the most pressing needs for the Colts this off-season. I don't see why spending *one* draft pick on a QB means that we are going to neglect every other position in the game. It's not like we traded a bunch of good players for him ala Jeff George in 1990. We can use all of our draft picks in future years to fix the other positions, as well as improve them through free agency.
                  If Luck survives, then it may well work out like that. Or you could be drafting a QB again soon like the Bengals, Browns, Lions, Jaguars, and other teams have done. We'll see.
                  Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                  Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                  Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                  Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                  And life itself, rushing over me
                  Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                  Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                  Comment

                  • #174
                    Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                    Highest paid positions are not evidence of which positions are most important to the success of the team.

                    It's simple supply and demand which effects market value that determines which positions have the highest paid players.

                    It's raining in Indiana so it must be hot in California. Huh? What? It seems like that's the kind of reasoning we're getting in this thread.

                    Comment

                    • #175
                      Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                      Come on, J. Really? Your general argument makes sense (even if I don't buy it as the single,correct argument), but giving the Steelers D credit for holding the Painter-led Colts offense to 13 points. That's shameless.
                      I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                      -Emiliano Zapata

                      Comment

                      • #176
                        Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                        Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
                        No, that's not what I'm saying.

                        I'm saying a lot of highly-touted QBs never live up to their potential because they spend their first four seasons on their back, looking at the clouds and a linebackers shoulder pads at best or even worse suffer the types of injuries that tear away at their potential and bring them back to "average".

                        And some of those GMs that build a solid foundation of offensive and defensive line play never get a chance to draft a QB that high because an average QB keeps them in playoff contention.
                        I don't disagree with you, because I feel there are QBs out there (like David Carr) who could have been better if they weren't absorbing so many sacks. But I say that's a risk living with, because you're more likely to end up succeeding once you find a good QB. Competent organizations will find good protection for him allow the QB to succeed. But you can't just wait to get a QB once you shore up your line, because you don't know when that is going to happen, and you don't know when you're going to get a good QB.

                        But as you said, QB doesn't matter to you as much. Which is fine, I understand some teams like their defense and run game more than they do QB. But the Steelers line sucks. You know that. But you still have a competent QB. He's been battered and bruised and they can't fix their line (though Decastro was a great pickup).
                        Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

                        Comment

                        • #177
                          Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                          Also J, what's really the difference between the Steelers drafting Ben with their first round pick (11th pick) and the Colts drafting Luck with theirs (1st pick)? Not much, IMHO. You only get one first round draft pick, and it's your most important pick of the draft, whether it's the first pick or the 32nd. The 11th pick is a pretty high pick, which is what the Steelers had in 04. ChiJ, even your Steelers have gone into a draft after a bad season (6-10 in 2003) with the idea that QB was the team's most important need in the draft.

                          There's really not much difference between what the Steelers did in 2004 and what the Colts did in 2012. Both came off of bad seasons and felt that QB was the most important need. The Steelers went 10-5 in 02, 6-10 in 03 (after which they got Ben), and then 15-1 in 04, so Ben was definitely put into a better situation. But I still think that the mindset was the same entering the draft.
                          Last edited by Sollozzo; 08-28-2012, 08:46 PM.

                          Comment

                          • #178
                            Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                            Posting from iPhone, could get messy, sorry. Responding to several things at once.

                            A I have no idea how many points either team scored last season. 13 was the opponents PPG from our last Super Bowl trip. #1 in points allowed, total yards allowed, rushing yards allowed and opposing QB rating (but not passing yards allowed- missed out on the quadruple play). And yes, even with that Aaron Rogers (the best QB right now was a top-five pick, right? Never mind...) had his way with us in the biggest game of the season.

                            2011 will be known as the year that the Steelers neglect of the line reached rock bottom. You are absolutely right that this has been our Achilles heel. They started addressing it with Pouncy, then Gilbert, then DeCastro and Adams. If the last two progress as the first two have, that era of lousy line play will be over soon and should carry over deep into the career of Ben's replacement.

                            And clearly, poor quality line play was a big factor last season. Your two quick DE's were a nightmare for our crappy line, and Ben made some awful decisions. And presto, the game that wasn't close on paper became competitive.

                            QB wasn't our biggest "need" in 2004, and Ben was a strategic choice knowing that TommyGun wasn't a spring chicken. We needed a cornerback more. Ben did nothing to beat out TommyGun in the preseason, only took over because of injury, and merely managed the game and gave the ball to Bettis on his way to 15-1. He was badly overmatched by Brady in the playoffs. the 6-10 record the previous season (2003) is generally attributed to the mistake of giving the ball to TommyGun after the 13-3 season in 2002 (and taking the ball away from Bettis). The personnel was still built for the power run, and the infatuation with Maddox is one of the low spots in Cowher's career. Ben's inexperience led to a renewed reliance on The Bus and winning football returned.

                            What else is up there?

                            That's a huge difference, I think, between drafting Ben and Luck.

                            I'll give you this: if the Steelers miss the playoffs in the next 3 seasons and get a top-15 pick, they'll take a QB to eventually replace Ben. Absolutely.
                            Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                            Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                            Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                            Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                            And life itself, rushing over me
                            Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                            Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                            Comment

                            • #179
                              Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                              Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
                              And clearly, poor quality line play was a big factor last season. Your two quick DE's were a nightmare for our crappy line, and Ben made some awful decisions.

                              -snip-

                              I'll give you this: if the Steelers miss the playoffs in the next 3 seasons and get a top-15 pick, they'll take a QB to eventually replace Ben. Absolutely.
                              And if they miss the playoffs, it might be this season as the OL help isn't ready yet (DeCastro's injury, and Adams isn't ready for LT yet) and we may finish the season with either Leftwich or Batch as QB. It's a decent probability, at least.
                              Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                              Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                              Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                              Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                              And life itself, rushing over me
                              Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                              Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                              Comment

                              • #180
                                Re: Another Colts Trade - Could be big - Irsay Tweet

                                Originally posted by D-BONE View Post
                                Come on, J. Really? Your general argument makes sense (even if I don't buy it as the single,correct argument), but giving the Steelers D credit for holding the Painter-led Colts offense to 13 points. That's shameless.
                                That wasn't my intention, but it reads wrong. 13 PPG was the Steelers average their last SB season. Sorry about the confusion.

                                Also, to be clear, I'm not saying the alternative strategy I'm talking about is the only way, but it is a lower- risk alternative. Many of the bottom teams in the NFL stay there for a long time chasing that strategy (that the Colts are currently following) through multiple iterations.
                                Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                                Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                                Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                                Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                                And life itself, rushing over me
                                Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                                Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                                Comment

                                Previous 1 2 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 template Next
                                Working...
                                X