p.s I changed a word in my post to make it more clear.
Last edited by xIndyFan; 08-16-2012 at 04:14 PM.
The arguing over big market versus small market seems odd when two of the three teams that mattie describes as Finals-set are not big market.
We've only been to the finals once and that was more than a decade ago...and we had the JO era with excellent talent....and it never made it. So, sure, I would be surprised if this team made it to the finals in the next 5 years. However, I seriously doubt that Kevin Pritchard is going to sit with this lineup for 5 years. That's less likely than the Pacers winning the championship.
With that said, the east is weak and Miami is the only obstacle I think stops the Pacers cold at the moment. The Pacers are capable of beating most other teams in the conference and Boston will soon be a non-factor. Other teams will rise up though, so it's going to be tough. IMO, unless Paul George blows up in a good way, we aren't sniffing the finals for a long, long time. We need a great player who can get to Reggie Miller level under pressure...or better...and we need a really solid group to get there...because there will always be really good teams with superstars that will beat us. So, no, we are not there yet but I wouldn't rule out this group. At least one guy is going to have to really step up his game and I think the only guy even capable is Paul.
Thank God for this thread. If I had one complaint about PD it would be the rampant optimism.
Last edited by PacersHomer; 08-17-2012 at 01:57 AM.
Memphis dealt with a title ending injury to their best player. That's why they lost. Their title hopes went up in smoke before Randolph was injured. Before that, everyone in league considered them title contenders.
You gotta a remember Memphis almost beat OKC and that was without Gay. Now with Gay back on the roster for 2011-12 season, they really had good reasons for believing they could. They also offered this: They could beat any team on the boards. And they did. LA's front line at the time was no match for Memphis despite having Gasol and Bynum.
Gay was additional scorer to Zach and Marc. Memphis has much more low post scoring compared to us. Their back court I'd argue is a wash compared to ours. I mean as good LAL is, I would not be surprised if it the coming post season Z-Bo and Marc beat Howard and Pau like rented mules. It's conceivable. It really is.
Find me on the internets @mattiecolin
Anywho, I completely agree with this being a make or break year for Paul George. He really needs to prove that he's going to be a major part of this teams future, or they'll have to start considering other directions. I think he'll prove that quite easily.
Getting back to my complaints of the starters, I wanted to address why I thought they didn't play the best in the playoffs despite building leads against Miami.
Miami was clearly not at full strength without Chris Bosh in the series which clearly changed the tone of the series. It is one big reason why we got an early 2-1 lead. While in general all season our starters were building leads and the bench was losing them. I believe Miami at full strength would have been able to do a better job against our starters.
While Indiana has definitely gotten better this offseason, so has Miami. So instead of simply hoping Indiana's young talent in Roy, Paul and Hill make up the difference because of their growth, I'd rather see TPTB make a concerted effort to improve possible weaknesses the team has. More to the point, even if the Pacers young talent could be predicted to make this team that much better, it still doesn't change the fact that Pacers do have particular weaknesses that could be addressed immediately. If all three young players made vast improvements AND we addressed our weakness at the 4 for instance, how great would Indiana be then?
I'll concede however, that we are going to see a very good Indiana team and their is a possibility they can take us to the next level. I have my doubts, but that is why we play the season.
P.S. Here's a silver lining to my somewhat bleak forecast of the future: (take heart! haha) Many people in the Pacers organization will read this thread, and it'll give them an idea on why at least a group of Pacers fans don't entirely buy into Donnie's plan. (not suggesting I personally have any influence, I'm suggesting the Pacers are very in tune to what fans in general are thinking)
So at the very least if what I say is momentarily true, maybe it motivates the TPTB to prove us wrong? Or re-evaluate their thinking? I'm grasping here!
Last edited by mattie; 08-16-2012 at 07:43 PM.
Find me on the internets @mattiecolin
Way to go out on a limb there sport. What's next, proclaiming that the Cubs won't win a World Series in the next five years?
I am more than content to continue my minority position as resident "I honestly feel we can beat the Heat, Lakers, whoever you throw at us" guy.
Last season we had early success against Miami, and when they came back swinging we had no answer. We shirked the challenge instead of rising to it.
I think we learned from that and will be hungry to avenge our loss.
Yes, the Heat are a very, VERY good BOUGHT team. The Pacers are a very, VERY good TEAM of players who fit and complement each other.
I still like our chances. Remember the super human games LeWade had to put up to eliminate us. Anytime you force opposing players to play at THAT high a level to simply beat you by a few points, you are in a much better position than you think. It does not take 3-4 "Bad" games from LeWade to make the Heat vulnerable. It simply takes a few games where they aren't absolutely superhuman, scoring 80+ points by themselves.
Could they do that to us again? Sure. It could happen. But at some point we are going to slow them down JUST enough to let our superior depth win the series.
Just my 2c.
...and I'm thankful for posters like TMJ31. Without them, y'all might be taking prozac.
With that said, I don't think we make it to the finals with this group. The talent has started to converge into very few hands again around the league. A handful of great players are beginning to control their own destinies and that means more championships on the coasts and warm weather cities. Let's face it. When your best player isn't any better than Shawn Marion, you aren't going to load up on rings.
Silliness. Stars win championships not good teams with midlevel players. As soon as you realize that you will see how hopeless the Pacer situation really is. The Pacers lost ground to several teams this off season. They will have to fight to be as high as a sixth seed from what I see. They have NO chance against Miami or Boston. None. You can believe anything you want but that is just homerism.....
Other teams like Chicago and Miami still are the favorites. There will probably be 3 or 4 other teams contending with the Pacers for positions 3 through 7. That may include Boston, but again, the Pacers have more than a chance against them.
Edit: I predict a 4 seed. Just dropping Collison and picking up Green, Augustin and Mahimini is probably worth a couple games. Every minute Collison is on the floor is a minute Hill is out of position...and Hill is the better player. Tack on the fact we have a creator in Green on the second unit and a well rounded backup PG in Augustin....and an improving Paul George, Roy Hibbert and Lance Stephenson...its not hard to see this team should be stronger this coming year.
Last edited by BlueNGold; 08-16-2012 at 09:18 PM.
Well, lets see. Paul Pierce better than any player the Pacers have, KG better than any player the Pacers have, Jason Terry better than any player the Pacers have and Rondo, WAY better than any player the Pacers have. They are also deeper with the draft, players returning from injury and other aquisitions. If it was a playoff series, I pick the Celtics in four games.....
If any one here sets homerism aside, they will easily see the same thing. You are not going to get enough improvement in PG, Hibbert and Lance to make up for that.