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    Default Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/81...-replay-tweaks

    The NBA's Board of Governors is meeting in Las Vegas on Thursday, and a source with knowledge of the talks told ESPN.com the agenda includes votes on several rule changes, especially expanding the use of instant replay. If passed, the changes would be in effect for the next NBA season.

    The board, comprised of one owner from each team, is slated to vote on three instant replay issues, and one proposal about inbounding the ball:

    Instant replay for all flagrant fouls: The competition committee proposes to let referees review all flagrant fouls on video.

    In May, Game 5 between the Indiana Pacers and Miami Heat was marred by a succession of violent fouls. First, the Pacers' Tyler Hansbrough fouled the Heat's Dwyane Wade hard. Less than a minute later Wade's teammate Udonis Haslem evidently sought retribution with a blow to Hansbrough's head and upper body. Both were given the milder designation of "Flagrant 1" and thus referees did not review video of either play mid-game. Under the rules at the time, only the harsher "Flagrant 2" calls could be reviewed on video by referees. After the game, NBA officials reviewed video of all three calls, upgraded Hansbrough's call to a Flagrant 2, while issuing suspensions for Haslem and the Heat's Dexter Pittman, who also committed a violent foul later in the same game.

    The league long has sought to prevent escalations of violence, and in this a mid-game video review of Hansbrough's initial foul could have resulted in a Flagrant 2 call just after the play, which would have meant Hansbrough's automatic ejection and, therefore, no opportunity for Haslem to retaliate, and for the violence to escalate.

    Instant replay for late-game goaltending and restricted area: Owners also will vote on two more new uses of instant replay, to review goaltending and to see if a player was standing in the restricted area under the basket. Both kinds of plays can be very difficult in real time.

    In the first, referees are asked to use the naked eye to judge if a shot is on its way up or has yet to reach the backboard, and is therefore fair game to block -- or past that point and off-limits to shotblockers. In the second, referees must both watch a collision in the lane and know with certainty if the defensive player had both feet entirely outside the semi-circular "no charge" zone under the hoop.

    Instant replay often gives fans in the arena and at home views referees don't have. If approved, replay for goaltending and restricted area calls only would be available in the final two minutes of games, or in overtime.

    Inbounding from the sideline or baseline: The fourth and final proposed rule change slated for a vote is letting teams choose to inbound the ball from the baseline or the sideline after timeouts. Previously, teams would have lost that choice by, for instance, inbounding and dribbling the ball before calling the timeout.

    Also slated for discussion, but not scheduled for votes, are changes to how the league handles flopping, the draft lottery and potentially adopting international basket interference rules.

    Flopping: This may be the biggest issue with fans, but is not slated for a vote Thursday.

    NBA commissioner David Stern discussed the league's ideas on flopping after a June competition committee meeting in Miami: "One of the things we're looking at is a postgame analysis of flopping," he explained. "We could see something like (the current points system for technicals) ... If you continue to do this you have to suffer some consequences. What exactly that should be, and the progression is, is to be decided. We just want to put a stake in the ground and say this is not something we want to be a part of our game -- without coming down with a sledgehammer but to do it in a minimalist way to begin stamping it out."

    Under the current points system for technicals, fines and suspensions mount as the offenses continue.

    Draft Lottery: The draft lottery has long been much-debated, with some saying it does too much to reward the league's worst teams and others saying it doesn't do enough.

    The league instituted the lottery after complaints that teams were losing in order to get good picks, and has since tweaked the system in response to complaints that the weights favored certain kinds of teams. Further changes have been much-discussed, but are not likely to be approved Thursday. Stern has been dismissive of suggestions that big changes are necessary.

    Basket interference: The NBA's current basket interference rules prohibit touching the ball while it's "in the cylinder," an imaginary column above the rim. Under FIBA's international rules, there is no such prohibition, and Stern has long supported adopting FIBA's rule, which is in effect in the NBA's D-League, where it is said to create exciting plays at the rim without leading to higher injury rates as has been feared.

    Rule changes approved now could result in new rules in effect for the 2012-13 NBA season. Items like flopping and the draft lottery, which are only under discussion, could also result in quick changes, even though there is not another Board of Governors' meeting scheduled soon -- the board can vote to approve rule changes without convening.
    I like the pro-Miami spin in the last paragraph of the bullet on the Hansbrough flagrant.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    **** ESPN.

    Anyway the basket interference thing is something I'm surprised hasn't been changed already, makes the game a little more exciting.
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

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    Totally takes the shooter's bounce out of the game.

    Putting a good spin on the ball will no long mean **** since anything that doesn't swish through is now a threat to get knocked off the rim before it has a chance to roll in.

    It'll be interesting to see how long this last as guards around the NBA watch their numbers plummet.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Totally takes the shooter's bounce out of the game.

    It'll be interesting to see how long this last as guards around the NBA watch their numbers plummet.
    Rebounds up, shooting percentages down, would be odd initially.
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

    ----------------- Reggie Miller

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Totally takes the shooter's bounce out of the game.

    Putting a good spin on the ball will no long mean **** since anything that doesn't swish through is now a threat to get knocked off the rim before it has a chance to roll in.

    It'll be interesting to see how long this last as guards around the NBA watch their numbers plummet.
    Remember though, if the ball has started to fall in the rim at all it cannot be bothered. That was mentioned during the USA practice I saw.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cactus Jax View Post
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    Rebounds up, shooting percentages down, would be odd initially.
    Take a look at the early 60's, when guards all shot in the upper 30's and there were 70+ rebounds to be had in any given game.

    It would not surprise me at all for that one little rule to completely change the entire game and slingshot us back to the stone age, where guards were pretty much irrelevant unless they were super-sized.

    I can see coaches putting in four 6'10"+ guys in the final seconds of a 3-point game and pretty much telling the other team to take whatever shot they want, knowing if it isn't a clean swish, its going to get swatted out of the rim.
    Last edited by Kstat; 07-19-2012 at 06:41 PM.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Take a look at the early 60's, when guards all shot in the upper 30's and there were 70+ rebounds to be had in any given game.

    It would not surprise me at all for that one little rule to completely change the entire game and slingshot us back to the stone age, where guards were pretty much irrelevant unless they were super-sized.

    I can see coaches putting in four 6'10"+ guys in the final seconds of a 3-point game and pretty much telling the other team to take whatever shot they want, knowing if it isn't a clean swish, its going to get swatted out of the rim.
    Shooting percentages of guards in the 60's can be compared almost identically to today's players. The percentages were slightly lower overall, but these guards who shot in the high thirties were mostly bench warmers. Kinda like AJ Price, Lance Stevenson, etc. I would be inclined to say that the physical nature of the game and rules in the 60's had more to do with those small declines in shooting percentages. They clobbered each other back then. Especially big men. Wilt Chamberlain retired periodically after his rookie year because he called the league a bush league because of the ridiculous, accepted fouling. I think you are overreacting a bit.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle View Post
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    Shooting percentages of guards in the 60's can be compared almost identically to today's players. The percentages were slightly lower overall, but these guards who shot in the high thirties were mostly bench warmers. Kinda like AJ Price, Lance Stevenson, etc. I would be inclined to say that the physical nature of the game and rules in the 60's had more to do with those small declines in shooting percentages. They clobbered each other back then. Especially big men. Wilt Chamberlain retired periodically after his rookie year because he called the league a bush league because of the ridiculous, accepted fouling. I think you are overreacting a bit.
    Wilt retired? What are you taking about? But I will say that Wilt took a beating every game in those days........

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    OMG, seriously...

    I can not believe people are still calling Tyler's foul on Wade a F2.

    No freaking way.

    A F1, sure... But HE MADE A PLAY ON THE BALL!
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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by TMJ31 View Post
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    OMG, seriously...

    I can not believe people are still calling Tyler's foul on Wade a F2.

    No freaking way.

    A F1, sure... But HE MADE A PLAY ON THE BALL!
    They're calling it that because that's what it was upgraded to. The last paragraph of the flagrant foul rule is right on the money. I don't think it was a Flagrant 2 either, but theoretically that's what the refs would have upgraded it to had they had a chance to look at it on replay.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by TMJ31 View Post
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    OMG, seriously...

    I can not believe people are still calling Tyler's foul on Wade a F2.

    No freaking way.

    A F1, sure... But HE MADE A PLAY ON THE BALL!
    I still don't believe it was even a flagrant. His hand was on the ball. But I digress.
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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    I don't want to get rid of basket interference for the same reasons as kstat, but I mean, we just gave Roy a max deal. If they did change it it'd help him.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Hey, it helps us too. We just drafted a 7-foot 280 lb man with a 34-inch vertical and a wingspan of 7'4."

    Still doesn't make it a good idea.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    The way they worded it is BS. They say if Hans is out of the game there is no need for revenge. Well there wasn't any ****ing reason to retaliate anyway. Haslem was just being a whiny *****. Notice how they didn't even mention the Flagrant foul on Wade against Collison. Wade should have been thrown out and suspended but they don't mention the Heats gods

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersalltheway10 View Post
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    The way they worded it is BS. They say if Hans is out of the game there is no need for revenge. Well there wasn't any ****ing reason to retaliate anyway. Haslem was just being a whiny *****. Notice how they didn't even mention the Flagrant foul on Wade against Collison. Wade should have been thrown out and suspended but they don't mention the Heats gods
    Because it wasn't upgraded after the fact to a Flagrant 2. Somehow.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    The best thing about basketball, relative to hockey, soccer, and most other sports with a goal or net, is the absence of a goalie. If the NBA allows goaltending, I'll be done. That's a boring game - just have a big leaper play zone right in front of the rim and swat everything away. And change the name from "center" to goalie. Yawn. The rim is horizontal, unlike the other sports with legal and encouraged goalies, and the rim and backboard can allow a shot to fall in the rim or out of the rim. Once its out of the cylinder, its fair game. But interfering with the ball inside the cylinder should remain a violation for either team.
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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    The best thing about basketball, relative to hockey, soccer, and most other sports with a goal or net, is the absence of a goalie. If the NBA allows goaltending, I'll be done. That's a boring game - just have a big leaper play zone right in front of the rim and swat everything away. And change the name from "center" to goalie. Yawn. The rim is horizontal, unlike the other sports with legal and encouraged goalies, and the rim and backboard can allow a shot to fall in the rim or out of the rim. Once its out of the cylinder, its fair game. But interfering with the ball inside the cylinder should remain a violation for either team.
    I agree, except for on tip-ins, putbacks. Those should be legal IMO.
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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Steagles View Post
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    I agree, except for on tip-ins, putbacks. Those should be legal IMO.
    They should be legal once the ball has left the cylinder. Otherwise, how do you differentiate? This is a case where the NBA has always been right (rare it seems), FIBA has always been wrong (DON'T turn basketball into European football. I don't want to watch European football. It SUCKS! (just my opinion, of course.)), and the only change should be FIBA getting in compliance with NBA.
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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    I think goal tending stays, but offensive interference goes.

    I'd have to relisten to the interview, but thats the impression I got at the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SycamoreKen View Post
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    Remember though, if the ball has started to fall in the rim at all it cannot be bothered. That was mentioned during the USA practice I saw.
    Good luck policing that.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Good luck policing that.
    Refs have been doing it around the world for quite a while now.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Good luck policing that.
    No harder than the ridiculous "invisible cylinder" they police now.

    I'd be interested in seeing how it plays out, as I've never watched a league that didn't have basket interference.

    However, if we look at Team USA 2008 statistics, I think the impact on FG% may be overstated:

    ## Player GP-GS Min--Avg FG-FGA Pct 3FG-FGA Pct FT-FTA Pct Off Def Tot Avg PF FO A TO Blk Stl Pts Avg
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    09 Wade, Dwyane....... 8-0 150 18.8 47-70 .671 8-17 .471 26-41 .634 14 18 32 4.0 13 0 15 13 1 18 128 16.0
    06 James, LeBron...... 8-8 198 24.8 50-83 .602 13-28 .464 11-24 .458 9 33 42 5.3 16 0 30 17 8 19 124 15.5
    10 Bryant, Kobe....... 8-8 188 23.5 48-104 .462 17-53 .321 7-12 .583 9 13 22 2.8 19 0 17 15 4 9 120 15.0
    15 Anthony, Carmelo... 8-8 153 19.1 27-64 .422 14-37 .378 24-29 .828 5 29 34 4.3 23 0 3 6 2 8 92 11.5
    11 Howard, Dwight..... 8-8 129 16.1 35-47 .745 0-0 .000 17-37 .459 15 31 46 5.8 23 0 4 9 7 5 87 10.9
    12 Bosh, Chris........ 8-0 138 17.3 24-31 .774 0-0 .000 25-29 .862 14 35 49 6.1 13 0 2 4 6 2 73 9.1
    07 Williams, Deron.... 8-0 152 19.0 23-52 .442 9-24 .375 9-10 .900 3 15 18 2.3 21 1 22 12 0 6 64 8.0
    13 Paul, Chris........ 8-0 175 21.9 19-38 .500 4-14 .286 22-24 .917 6 23 29 3.6 15 0 33 9 0 18 64 8.0
    14 Prince, Tayshaun... 8-0 88 11.0 13-22 .591 6-11 .545 2-4 .500 6 9 15 1.9 7 0 2 2 1 3 34 4.3
    04 Boozer, Carlos..... 8-0 48 6.0 10-18 .556 0-0 .000 6-8 .750 5 10 15 1.9 9 0 2 8 0 2 26 3.3
    08 Redd, Michael...... 8-0 73 9.1 10-31 .323 5-18 .278 0-1 .000 3 6 9 1.1 1 0 4 3 0 2 25 3.1
    05 Kidd, Jason........ 8-8 108 13.5 6-7 .857 1-2 .500 0-0 .000 6 15 21 2.6 13 0 16 12 2 5 13 1.6
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Total.............. 8 1600 312-567 .550 77-204 .377 149-219 .680 95 237 332 41.5 173 1 150 110 31 97 850 106.2
    Opponents.......... 8 1600 222-551 .403 60-201 .299 123-156 .788 102 185 287 35.9 184 - 85 154 29 53 627 78.4

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    Not even a remotely fair assessment. It's like saying the 3 point line had no effect in the game in 1980.

    Give NBA athletes 2 good years of this rule and it will be exploited every single possession.

    Not to mention teams will start fouling with 9 minutes left knowing they can knock the 2nd FT off the rim.
    Last edited by Kstat; 07-19-2012 at 08:02 PM.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Not even a remotely fair assessment. It's like saying the 3 point line had no effect in the game in 1980.
    Um, I'm likely missing the comparison, but showing statistics from a FIBA tournament involving teams that have been playing with these rules primarily for their entire careers seems to be a pretty good way to look at potential impact. Not a perfect way, just pretty good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Give NBA athletes 2 good years of this rule and it will be exploited every single possession.
    Again, this has been in play for years overseas without the issues you're speaking of. Sure, it isn't the NBA, but it isn't exactly a joke either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Not to mention teams will start fouling with 9 minutes left knowing they can knock the 2nd FT off the rim.
    I imagine this is something that can be dealt with if it needs to be, ala the "Hack-a-Shaq" of the early 2000's. However, again, I don't see this as a huge issue.

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    Default Re: Board of Governors to vote on rule changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Not even a remotely fair assessment. It's like saying the 3 point line had no effect in the game in 1980.

    Give NBA athletes 2 good years of this rule and it will be exploited every single possession.

    Not to mention teams will start fouling with 9 minutes left knowing they can knock the 2nd FT off the rim.
    Well me agreeing to it meant in essence, that a bank shot couldn't be bothered with before it hit the rim, or that free throws couldn't be affected either, players would have to let free throws do what they do, there would be interference if done on a FT. I think it makes life a lot easier for the officials not having to worry about the invisible no touch zone around the rim.
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

    ----------------- Reggie Miller

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