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Thread: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them, UPDATE: No he isn't

  1. #26
    Member LoneGranger33's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    Orlando didn't fail (although they did make a Finals so did they really fail at all?) because the elite center couldn't push them over the top. They failed because they never put anything around the elite center that gave them a better chance. San Antonio won with Tim Duncan because he was great and they also put other supremely talented players around him. Shaq's teams won because he had other elite talents. If they surrounded him they way the should have, we probably wouldn't be having this discussion.
    I guess "fail" was too harsh a word. You are right, they certainly had more success than most teams in the league during that time period, including that sole Finals appearance (something our Pacers have sadly only achieved once since the '76 merger). And I agree with you that the problem was the supporting cast of characters, not any of Dwight's own shortcomings. I should have made it more clear that I place the blame on management as well. I just don't think they'll want to take another shot at that model of team-building - and I don't blame them. I'd imagine free agents are less likely to want to play with Bynum than they were with Howard, so it might even be more difficult to build around him than it was with Dwight. I don't know enough about salaries and the cap to determine what effect, if any, the new CBA might have on such plans either, but I can't imagine the new numbers helping out.
    Last edited by LoneGranger33; 07-19-2012 at 09:25 AM.

  2. #27
    Droppin' knowledge, yo. Mackey_Rose's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
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    Allow me to play devil's advocate for a minute and let's just say Bynum agrees to go to Orlando. Since this is the last year of his contract, the Magic will have to commit long-term to Andrew Bynum at a price very close to what Dwight Howard was making/will make (aka, the max). Howard is almost universally viewed as the better player, but by how much is a subject of debate. Regardless of this skill differential, Bynum will cost roughly the same as Howard. Now, Bynum is almost two years younger and has played one less season than Howard, and in terms of "mileage", Howard has more than twice as many minutes and games played than his potential successor. This may not be to Bynum's advantage, however, as Howard has only missed 19 (regular season) games whereas Bynum missed over 130 games to a combination of suspension and injury.

    I won't argue that Dwight Howard's popularity in Orlando is great at the present moment, but he was a very marketable star from his rookie season until last year. He had dominant on-court skills and a effervescent off-court personality to match. Bynum, on the other hand, has a miscreant's reputation in this league. Perhaps he's just living in Kobe's shadow right now in L.A., but I'm not sure that the same marketing opportunities exist for him.

    All that leaves us with one question for Magic ownership/management: Do you continue to try building around a dominant post-player in a very clearly guard-oriented league despite five good years of coming up short - and now with a weaker centerpiece?

    I could see the reasoning both ways, but I'd rather try my hand at the draft lottery than risk another 5+ years of mediocrity with Bynum.
    I think you do. The problem the first go around, was Otis Smith simply didn't do a good enough job of building around Howard. That doesn't mean that strategy doesn't work, it just means you need to do better the second time.

    Bynum is worth the max contract he's going to get. Same as Hibbert was worth the max contract we gave him. Orlando needs better pieces around Bynum than they put around Howard, but I think you can win that way. When Bynum is motivated, he is one of the most dominant players in the league. You need a superstar to win. He can be that superstar.

    How many chances do teams have to get a guy of Bynum's caliber? Not many.

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  4. #28
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    Get Bynum out of my division. Come on stern, be a dick and veto this!

    Edit: according to ESPN Bynum would go to Cleveland and Verejao to Orlando.


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    Play McRoberts and Price! BRushWithDeath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    I should say I think Howard's decision to accept a longterm move to LA has no bearing whatsoever on the course of the trade talks. LA wouldn't have cared what he was saying. They would try to get him regardless. How many players are going to take less money to leave LA. I'm guessing none. I think the Lakers would have the same guess.
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  7. #30
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Steagles View Post
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    Get Bynum out of my division. Come on stern, be a dick and veto this!

    Edit: according to ESPN Bynum would go to Cleveland and Verejao to Orlando.


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    If this trade happens the Pacers should be all over Orlando trying to get Varejao.

  8. #31
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    I think you do. The problem the first go around, was Otis Smith simply didn't do a good enough job of building around Howard. That doesn't mean that strategy doesn't work, it just means you need to do better the second time.

    Bynum is worth the max contract he's going to get. Same as Hibbert was worth the max contract we gave him. Orlando needs better pieces around Bynum than they put around Howard, but I think you can win that way. When Bynum is motivated, he is one of the most dominant players in the league. You need a superstar to win. He can be that superstar.

    How many chances do teams have to get a guy of Bynum's caliber? Not many.
    I forgot that Otis Smith and Stan Van were both out. Perhaps the new GM, Rob Hennigan, and his team will succeed where Otis Smith stumbled. That is certainly within the realm of possibility. Smith definitely made some poor decisions (in addition to some moves that just didn't pan out), and this new guy comes in with experience and success in both San Antonio and OKC. Moreover, I've seen Bynum in beast mode, and I agree that he can be dominant when motivated. You don't see a lot of Andrew Bynum-level specimens come through this league. I'll go even further and say that part of the Lakers woes the past season (and perhaps the year before too) stemmed from the team's unwillingness to feature him more on offense. I personally don't see it working, nor do I think it's worth the gamble for Orlando. I'd probably feel differently if this franchise hadn't just gone through the same process with Howard for the past six years.
    Last edited by LoneGranger33; 07-19-2012 at 09:49 AM.

  9. #32
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    If you have the option to build around a dominant post player, you do it every single time.

    Well, with the exception of Jordan and Lebron I guess.

  10. #33
    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Money trade for the Lakers. They're now the team to beat...again.

    Good deal for the Cavs, assuming Bynum doesn't kill someone.

    Horrible deal for the Magic. I know they pretty much have to trade Howard, but still...

  11. #34
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    The only good news in this is that it now removes Orlando as a threat to us.

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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Kyrie, Waiters, Jason Richardson?, Thompson and Bynum? no bad.
    Last edited by vnzla81; 07-19-2012 at 10:32 AM.

  13. #36
    Member LoneGranger33's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    I was hoping at least one person would agree with my logic, if not my conclusion.

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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    I don't understand why Orlando just doesn't receive Bynum, I think he'd be more attractive than anything else they could get.

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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
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    I don't understand why Orlando just doesn't receive Bynum, I think he'd be more attractive than anything else they could get.
    He is not willing to sign an extension, he has attitude issues and people are also forgetting that Bynum needs to get some kind of lubricants in his knees at least twice a year.

  16. #39

    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Brilliant management. This deal isn't possible if they dont draft Bynum in 2005 and develop him into the NBA's 2nd best center.
    Just once, I'd like to see the Pacers pull off a deal like this. We have grown accustomed to having little to get excited about in the off-season. For as long as I can remember, the Lakers have always been able to find a way to get anyone they wanted and make it fit. I'd just be happy if we could do this once every 5 years.

  17. #40

    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
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    I was hoping at least one person would agree with my logic, if not my conclusion.
    No I definitely agree. Re-building around Bynum won't be getting it done. It would be much smarter to rely on draft picks

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    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    This isn't a done deal. I'll believe it when I see it.

    Wake me when this Dwightmare is over.

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  21. #42
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Brilliant management. This deal isn't possible if they dont draft Bynum in 2005 and develop him into the NBA's 2nd best center.
    To a point. There can be no denying that they are shrewd & brilliant, but they also have the tremendous advantage of location.

    I know the counter to this will be that the Clippers are in the same building but by the time the Clippers moved from San Diego to L.A. each teams culture was already set and even then some tried to give the Clippers a shot only to find out that Sterling actually viewed his team as a money making enterprise, not just a rich man's hobby.

    But, as you stated, location will only get you so far. They are able to sucker teams more than one could even imagine.


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  22. #43

    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Varejao, multiple picks for Cleveland, a pick from LA, and dumping a bad contract or two has to be appealing for Orlando, and better than fewer picks and a 1 year Bynum rental.

    Still if I am Orlando, I would be asking for Zeller as well.
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  23. #44
    BoilerUpMan Really?'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    The part the makes no sense to me is the part that Cleveland is unwilling to trade Zeller to Orlando as part of the package, not only that but they want Bynum plus a pick, wtf are they thinking?
    Dude it is Cleveland and we all know how their owner is...
    Why so SERIOUS

  24. #45
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    I understand that, but their alternative if they can't get him to agree to an extension, is a complete and total rebuild.

    If Bynum doesn't decide to re-up with Orlando, and goes elsewhere in free agency, then you begin the same complete and total rebuild at that point. You're starting a year later, but essentially the same goal is accomplished, and at least you've taken a shot at acquiring one of the best assets in the league.
    They already went down this path with Dwight and it has turned out ugly, why not start the rebuild now, get more assets then you would if he just walked through free agency and probably put yourself in a better situation to get a higher draft pick as well.
    Why so SERIOUS

  25. #46
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    This trade is starting to become laughable, with what Orlando is getting, Picks from any of these teams will most likely be in the 20's, if they do not get Prospects back in return then it seems like they are wasting their time.

    And no we do not need Varajae or however you spell his name.
    Why so SERIOUS

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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Really? View Post
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    This trade is starting to become laughable, with what Orlando is getting, Picks from any of these teams will most likely be in the 20's, if they do not get Prospects back in return then it seems like they are wasting their time.

    And no we do not need Varajae or however you spell his name.



    Yes we do.

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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    [/B]

    Yes we do.
    Nope
    Why so SERIOUS

  28. #49
    Flipped Off The Refs Larry Staverman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    Horrible deal for the Magic. I know they pretty much have to trade Howard, but still...

    That is why this trade is not close to happening

    What Howard does or does not want has nothing to do with Orlando trading him

    It's about what Orlando wants and a trade will not happen until they get it.

    For what it is worth I still think he goes to Houston

  29. #50

    Default Re: Dwight Howard ready to join Lakers and sign extension with them

    Not really.

    They don't have power in this situation. Every team in the league knows Dwight wants out. Which means every team in the league knows that Orlando can either chose to get nothing from Howard or chose the best of the worst deals that they are offered.

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