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Thread: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

  1. #76
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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    we werent gonna bid on a PF unless we were able to unload Hansbrough

  2. #77
    You can call me Taz cinotimz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    we werent gonna bid on a PF unless we were able to unload Hansbrough
    Because?

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    I would have loved to have Scola on the team, but even with him and Green the only additions, lets say, does that put us over the top next year? He has a lot more mileage on him than West does, even though he is one year older. Does his production fall off more after another summer of Olympic play? Brand is even older. I just don't see them being what we need to take the next step, but then again, i could be completely wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by cinotimz View Post
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    Because?
    log jam at PF, paying Tyler 3 mil to sit on the bench, and i dont think the FO wants to do that to Tyler, just like they didnt want to hamper DC

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    Can see thru wooden doors dal9's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by cinotimz View Post
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    Because?
    the only thing I can think of is that we did not bring in a better backup PF because West would be pissed if we brought in a backup who legitimately challenged him for PT in a contract year. causing locker room / chemistry problems.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by SycamoreKen View Post
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    I would have loved to have Scola on the team, but even with him and Green the only additions, lets say, does that put us over the top next year? He has a lot more mileage on him than West does, even though he is one year older. Does his production fall off more after another summer of Olympic play? Brand is even older. I just don't see them being what we need to take the next step, but then again, i could be completely wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.
    Over the top? Highly unlikely...but better? I dunno....Whos better, Tyler or Scola? and they would cost about the same...thats the scary part. And you could have Scola for a nother couple years at that price...thats just tremendous value...at a position with serious questions going forward. Not to mention I think he would quickly become a fan favorite.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by dal9 View Post
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    the only thing I can think of is that we did not bring in a better backup PF because West would be pissed if we brought in a backup who legitimately challenged him for PT in a contract year. causing locker room / chemistry problems.
    I doubt Wests playing time would be affected much. They would probably play a fair amount of time together. And west would definitely benefit from that given Scolas style of play. Remember West getting worn down at the end of games in the Miami series. Give him the right amount of minutes to maximize his play. And Scola is just significantly better than Tyler. Just no two ways about it.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    log jam at PF, paying Tyler 3 mil to sit on the bench, and i dont think the FO wants to do that to Tyler, just like they didnt want to hamper DC
    Somebody has to sit on the bench. Only 5 play at a time...and god knows weve paid a ton more than 3 million to sit on the bench. God forbid we get better on fantastic financial deal like that would be. All this concern over LT and salary cap, and yet a steal comes along at a position of need and we totally whiff.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    What if we don't win the bidding? I think the FO was more comfortable knowing what they had in hand instead of what they might end up with.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by SycamoreKen View Post
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    What if we don't win the bidding? I think the FO was more comfortable knowing what they had in hand instead of what they might end up with.
    Not sure much needed to change. If managed properly couldve likely just been an addition. And if we lose the bidding then we have exactly what we have now.

  13. #86

    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    You sent PS&E your extensive resume yet cinotimz? I mean hell, you know the market better than the people who actually set it.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    You sent PS&E your extensive resume yet cinotimz? I mean hell, you know the market better than the people who actually set it.
    I doubt they could afford me

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  17. #88

    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    I think some of you are getting so defensive because you are afraid cinotimz might be right. First Donnie Walsh has a long history of over paying players. Tinsley's deal is one of the best examples but 40 million for George Hill is going to look pretty bad in a couple of years. Sixteen million for Mahinmi also seems a little spendy. If Simon is worried about money why would he even let Walsh into the building? Reasonable deals for these two would have saved the Pacers more cash than the chickenfeed they were paying Jones
    . OK with the acquisitions but the pacers overpaid and many of you who are long-term fans should be able to see the pattern repeating.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    FWIW, I had no problem with moving DC and D. Jones for cap space. Cap space can go for surprising amounts some times - for example, Minnesota just paid two 2nd rounders to NOH to get ~800k of cap space. So I'm willing to give the FO the benefit of the doubt and assume that trading DC and Dahntay for nothing is the best deal on the table at the time.

    What bothers me more is what we didn't do with the cap space - which was that we didn't make full use of it. I like our signings well enough, but we're at least $5m below the tax line. It seems odd that we should stop spending when we still have needs and there are still good players left on the market. Especially since we knew that cap space would disappear once we sign our RFAs.

    Possible reasons why we did so: 1) Hibbert and Hill's agents forced the issue of timing. This seems unlikely to me, as both players have already waited a while and a few more days isn't going to hurt them. Plus, the Pacers have an excellent rationale to ask them to wait a little longer. You'd think that the agents would continue to play ball, just to maintain good will. 2) Our FO just isn't interested in the remaining players out there, save for maybe Barbosa or similar budget player, who we can still sign with our $2.5m room exception. The problem with this is that it misses the opportunity for adding amnesty players on the cheap, since acquiring amnesty players requires cap space, and can't be done with exceptions. 3) I mentioned this possibility in another thread, and it's one that I'm not very comfortable with. But it's possible that we're operating on a self-imposed spending cap that's comfortably below the tax line (say $65m as compared to $70m for the tax). It could be that our owner is only comfortable spending up to this amount, it could be that our FO wanted to maintain future flexibility in the face of expected future spending. It would explain though why we've been dancing around balancing contracts like an over the cap team would - Shinn's Hornets and the current Grizzlies do this all the time, for example. Regardless of why, again the problem with this is it misses the chance of adding cheap contributors from amnesty. If we do end up going over budget after all, we still have plenty of time to dump a contract (like Hans' $3m expiring).

    So what could the FO have done to make me a happier fan this offseason? For me, it's simply to wait through the amnesty period before finalizing Hibbert's and Hill's contracts. The amnesty period this year is from 11 July to 18 July - players can't be amnestied outside of this period. So just wait it out, bid on players that make sense for us, and if we miss, well we end up exactly where we are now. Surely we could have waited a week to do this.

    At the very least, I hope they frontloaded Hill, Mahinmi, and Green's deals as much as possible. Which is to say, instead of standard escalating contracts, I hope we gave them flat or even decreasing contracts. That would at least have made more use of this season's cap space (as compared to escalating contracts) before that cap space disappeared into the ether.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by cinotimz View Post
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    I doubt they could afford me
    I agree. That Pacers would be in Settle within 3 years.

    I really think that would have stood a good chance of happening if they hadn't resigned Hibbert.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    quoting this so it doesn't get lost on the previous page. very good post Hicks, confirms what i thought.
    Honestly, I missed it until you quoted it. Your evil plan worked.

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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    Who cares?

    The Pacers brass doesn't have to tell us every detail and rationale of their business dealings.

    The deal is done. The sports blogger experts and the message boards don't see the sense in it. But I don't think the Pacers much care what entities unrelated to their running of the team think about what they do or why.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhoLovesYaBaby? View Post
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    Who cares?

    The Pacers brass doesn't have to tell us every detail and rationale of their business dealings.

    The deal is done. The sports blogger experts and the message boards don't see the sense in it. But I don't think the Pacers much care what entities unrelated to their running of the team think about what they do or why.
    Hell, in that case Hicks might as well shut this site down instead of Shade migrating it elsewhere. You heard him fans: show up, pay your money, and shut up! (can't make this green on my phone)

  24. #94
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    Default Re: Cash Considerations kept quiet in the Mahinmi/Dallas deal??

    It's definitely a make or break year for Tyler. The team is giving him the green light as the primary backup PF, despite some safer options becoming available.

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