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The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

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If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

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However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

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  • #61
    Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

    Originally posted by cgg View Post
    Seriously though. Is there still a way to ignore threads?
    You can use your mouse to scroll past offending threads and not click on them....
    Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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    • #62
      Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

      Bottonline on the trades and signings is this. I think if you are extremely excited you are going too far. if you are really upset I think that is too far the other way. We did not give up any player who was a starter or someone who was going to be in our longterm plan. So I don't see how anyone could be really upset with who we are giving up. But then again if you are jumping up and down for joy because of the three new players I think you are geting way too excited.

      So if you take out each extreme I think all other opinions are very defensible. I think overall and taken as a whole these are good moves. They will make the pacers marginally better. That is all you can hope for on these types of moves.

      The much more impactful moves are the re-signing of 40% of our starting unit - Roy and George Hill.
      Last edited by Unclebuck; 07-13-2012, 01:35 PM.

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      • #63
        Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

        It is true. The reason so many of us were upset Indiana didn't at least make an attempt at EJ, (no matter how futile) is because the starting lineup needed a talent upgrade. The second units failure has helped cover up the real problem this team had. They simply need more talent. Vogel screwing up and playing the second unit when he shouldn't obscure that fact.

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        • #64
          Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

          Originally posted by Bball View Post
          You can use your mouse to scroll past offending threads and not click on them....
          Yeah but there used to be a way to ignore threads, but now I can't find it. I wanna ignore the sticky threads too so there's less clutter at the top.
          "Danny Granger is one of the top players in the league. To move Danny, you better get a lot back." - Larry Bird

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          • #65
            Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

            I'm extremely excited about the changes. Why? Because of the simple fact that our BENCH was our weak point last year. Despite our reputation nationally (and here?) as a 'team that wins with depth', by all statistical (and eyeball) measures our bench was absolutely horrid. Our starting 5 was one of the best in the NBA, but outside of a few outlier games our bench routinely got destroyed. Upgrading our bench to even average is a GIGANTIC move for our team.

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            • #66
              Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

              Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post

              The much more impactful moves are the re-signing of 20% of our starting unit - Roy and George Hill.
              actually 40%. So VERY impactful.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                civility

                1 archaic : training in the humanities
                2 a : civilized conduct; especially : courtesy, politeness b : a polite act or expression



                respect 1. a particular, detail, or point (usually preceded by in ): to differ in some respect.
                2. relation or reference: inquiries with respect to a route.
                deference to a right, privilege, privileged position, or someone or something considered to have certain rights or privileges; proper acceptance or courtesy; acknowledgment: respect for a suspect's right to counsel; to show respect for the flag; respect for the elderly.




                I am not only talking about this thread, but just an attitude here as of late. We are all friends. We are all fellow Pacers fans. Lord knows we should be able to disagree without name calling or belittling each other

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                • #68
                  Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                  Originally posted by mattie View Post
                  It is true. The reason so many of us were upset Indiana didn't at least make an attempt at EJ, (no matter how futile) is because the starting lineup needed a talent upgrade. The second units failure has helped cover up the real problem this team had. They simply need more talent. Vogel screwing up and playing the second unit when he shouldn't obscure that fact.
                  How does everyone know that we DIDN'T make an attempt at Gordon? Just because we were smart enough to not offer him a max doesn't mean we didn't try to get him....
                  "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

                  "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "

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                  • #69
                    Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                    While some might not like the style in which the OP presented things, as others have kinda danced around, there are some potentially very valid points. There are a couple of major concerns when all is said and done. One of the major concerns to me is the fact that management is saying our starting 5 is good enought to basically compete for a title. Thats simply isnt true. People like to talk about the Pistons championship team and the facts are simple-and this pains me in ways you cant imagine-but this starting 5 isnt as talented as the Pistons. Even more importantly, with maybe the exception of one Lakers team that ulitmately had injury problems, there were none of the 'superteams' being created back then as they are now. Miami won the title and they have gotten even better. The Lakers have definitely gotten better and may not be done. Anyone discounting the Knicks is simply in denial. Bottome line is our starting 5 needs a major upgrade if we are truly going to contend for a title. While its true we spent alot of money(overpaid) to not go backwards with our starting 5, we effectively did because the contenders for the title almost all got better. Again I believe this is where the stalemate occurred with Bird and Simon, as Im sure Bird feels the starting 5 must be upgraded and still cant help but think he was targeting someone like Gordon. He knows what I know and I think deep down everyone else knows though they may choose to ignore such. This team is never going to contend for a title as currently constructed-not without a major piece being added in one way or another...that alphadog people keep talking about.

                    Which then brings us to the moves that were made. Mainly improving the bench. In the end, the bench isnt gonna win the title, but it will help playoff seeding etc over the course of a season. Remember with the shortened season our quantity and not necessarily quality bench did play a role in our regular season success. When Mahinmi was acquired I was very adamant about like him as an addition. And i still like him. Hes going to bring something we definitely needed last year. A defensive presence at the rim outside of Hibbert. And hes just a decent player on both ends. So hes definitely an upgrade. But I also added that the way in which he was acquired certainly pointing towards another move-possibly the addition of the much talked about Mayo. Why? Because we could have very simply signed Mahinmi outright and given up nothing. Period. But we chose instead to do a salary dump. So the main question remains, why did we choose to dump salary? Two expirings on top of that? Its not like it was long term salary. Especially when u look at us going out and immediately acquiring DJ for even more money than we were paying Collison. If the idea was to clear salary to improve the team, then that made alot of sense. If it was to go after Mayo or make a bid on Brand, then wonderful. But if it was just an outright salary dump to simply avoid paying the money....well thats where theres gonna be issues with the fans again and what leads to the whole concept of getting rid of the team that I believed couldve been delivered alot more eloquently than the OP chose to do.

                    Look...we got rid of Collison, D. Jones, Amundson and basically replaced them with Dj Aug, Mahinmi, and Green...in the end theres not alot there other than just changes to make changes....might they be marginally better? yes....quite possible....and if that salary dump leads to one more major acquisition then I think that will significantly answer alot of the questions that realistically still do exist. Most notably, why the salary dump? If you wanted Mahinmi, you couldve signed him outright. Collison and DJ are likely a wash either way and its not like the Pacers have much faith in DJ in giving him a 1 year deal...so....maybe you have the potential of Green versus the known quantity of Jones...but...lets not forget Jones is great in the locker room and has significantly contributed to the handling and dvelopment of both Lance and P. George. So saying we are spending alot more money on a roster that ultimately made alot of lateral moves is pretty much accurate, in spite of us wanting to believe otherwise due to the fact we knew we had to get markedly better if we stand any chance to contend.

                    Most wont like hearing this, but this roster as it appears now will likely make the playoffs but will probably do well to get out of the first round....noone wants to hear that...but we were really only a Dwight Howard injury from the same happening last year. So....

                    Again, if we land Brand, Scola, Mayo or something similar, then all makes sense. But if this is the final product of the plan...well....I have a feeling the sentiments on this board will get fairly negative in the not to distant future once we start playing the games and see where we begin stacking up in the overall scheme of things...
                    The Most Common Cause of Stress is Dealing with Idiots

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                    • #70
                      Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                      Originally posted by doctor-h View Post
                      All you homers that don't have a clue about real competitive basketball should lay off someone that has a different opinion than yours. Pacerfreak is right all these moves are lateral moves. We very well could be no better than last year. The Collison trade makes no sense. Even the beat writer for the Mavs was confused by that. They had no interest in resigning this guy. The Bobcats as pitiful as they are had no interest in resigning Augustine. The Green move IMO is worth the risk. Lance is showing what he can do in the summer league. In case anybody is paying attention, he is doing it as a pg with the ball in his hands. That is his strength, that is when his game lights up. Its not when he is standing in a corner like they made him do last year and just take up space. The signing of Augustine tells us that is their plan again this year. So go ahead and waste him and let him leave as soon as his contract is up for a guy who obviously doesn't want to be hear long term and is using us to get a better contract. Stop believing every little misguided rumor about everything and actually take a look at what is going on. The Pacers have no prayer of competing for anything with this kind of nonsense.
                      Peck says our moves were lateral moves and gets thanked. I say it and get called names.

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                      • #71
                        Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                        Originally posted by Sandman21 View Post
                        How does everyone know that we DIDN'T make an attempt at Gordon? Just because we were smart enough to not offer him a max doesn't mean we didn't try to get him....
                        Talking to Gordon about taking a below market value contract that he obviously wouldn't excpet and New Orleans would obviously match is not an attempt. An attempt would be offering him a max contract.

                        I mean I'm not upset. Happens. At the end of the day Gordon is still a guy who's had a lot of injuries and may never pan out. But was an opportunity to add legit talent that could possibly made this team championship caliber.

                        Now we're stuck hoping Roy makes another big improvement (unlikely) and Paul George makes the big jump. It's becoming more and more likely that Paul George will never reach our lofty expectations. (which isn't his fault, probably more of a case of us not being realistic)

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                        • #72
                          Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                          I don't care what anyone else says, this team as it is constructed now, gets passed Miami in that last playoff series. Yes, Bosh was hurt, but the bench killed the team time and time again. LeBron and Wade would find it much harder to drive in on Plumlee and Mahinmi than Hans and Lou, and just about anyone can provide better D than Barbosa.

                          EDIT: I do not think the transactions make the team "a contender" though, but I do think they're a little better than they were last year.
                          Last edited by pezasied182; 07-13-2012, 04:49 PM.

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                          • #73
                            Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                            posts like these are why i am happy fans don't run the team. if you didn't think we improved this team, you're crazy. You're crazy if you think the value of DC/DJ was going to bring something great back. You also underrate Mahinmi and how badly we needed a legit back up C.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                              Originally posted by k_lewis93 View Post
                              Can we just all agree this kid knows nothing and just end the convo? He isn't even worth arguing with bc it's like talking to a freaking wall.
                              Put. Him. On. Your. Ignore. List. It makes life much better.
                              http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
                              "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetime’s worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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                              • #75
                                Re: Either the front office needs to go or the owner needs to sale the team.

                                Originally posted by doctor-h View Post
                                Peck says our moves were lateral moves and gets thanked. I say it and get called names.
                                You do realize you started your post on lateral moves by calling people clueless homers, right? If you don't like being called names, then practice what you preach.
                                "Reggie Miller is the hardest player to guard." --Kobe Bryant

                                "Playing Reggie Miller drives me nuts. It's like chicken-fighting with a woman." --Michael Jordan

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