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Thread: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

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    Default Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story...ove-steve-nash

    We've heard all the speculation for the past year about Deron Williams and Dwight Howard.

    As for Steve Nash? It's been quieter. Daily speculation about his next destination hasn't been nearly as persistent.

    Yet entering the opening of free agency Sunday, Nash might be the one A-list free agent who is most in play. He's 38, yes, but he's still playing at an All-Star level. While Howard's fate is likely to be determined by trade in the short term and while Williams apparently has narrowed down his field to two teams (Brooklyn and Dallas), Nash still has a wide array of choices before him, none of which clearly trumps the others.

    While our Marc Stein brings you the viewpoint of Nash himself, we also need to look at the other half of the equation. What can the teams chasing him potentially offer, what are their alternatives and does Nash make sense for them?

    Of the eight quasi-realistic candidates, here's how it breaks down:

    Phoenix: The sentimental choice, Phoenix can offer Nash big money via his Bird rights (up to the $18 million-and-change maximum for a player with 10 or more years of service) if it wishes and offers a training staff that many regard as the league's best. While a more realistic figure for Nash is probably in the $10 million to $15 million per season range, it's worth noting that the Suns can match any bidding war.

    Nothing much changes in Phoenix if Nash comes back, and that's the problem -- while he gets to run the same Nash-centric offense, he's also running it with the same teammates who missed the playoffs last season.

    Phoenix will have little or no cap space if it re-signs Nash, and likely will be holding the line by re-signing other free agents and bringing back more or less last season's team. (Exercising the amnesty rights on Josh Childress and using the midlevel exception on a replacement likely would be the biggest change.)

    It's hard to see how that is tempting for either side, which probably explains why the Suns drafted point guard Kendall Marshall and why both sides seem resigned to the fact that the party is over. Owner Robert Sarver is going to get absolutely destroyed in the local media if and when Nash leaves, but after the Suns missed the playoffs in consecutive seasons, it's hard to see why they would force the issue any longer.

    Moreover, the Suns can rebuild quickly post-Nash. They're an alluring free-agent market due to the weather and training staff, and they can have more than $20 million in cap space if they let their veteran free agents walk, re-sign Robin Lopez for reasonable money and use the amnesty rights on Childress. There might be a year or two of pain involved, but it probably beats bringing back Nash, Grant Hill and Shannon Brown just to squeeze out an upside-free 39-43 campaign.

    Dallas: At first glance, this one looks awfully tempting if the Mavs' Deron Williams hopes are dashed. Nash can go back to a familiar haunt with his best bud in the business, Dirk Nowitzki, and can chase an elusive ring with the Mavs. Dallas can offer him a not-quite-max deal by exercising the amnesty rights on Brendan Haywood, or it can try to ink him for a bit less and use the extra space to add more help (such as longtime Nash buddy Grant Hill, for instance).

    The idea from the Dallas perspective would be to land Nash with a two-year deal, or with a non- or partially-guaranteed third year. The Mavs' books are as clean as a whistle after the 2013-14 season, so they could make a two-year run with a geriatric Nash-Nowitzki-Shawn Marion-Vince Carter core before all their contracts expire and it becomes time to reload.

    The negative is that takes the Mavs out of the running for bigger fish such as Chris Paul or Dwight Howard, and one suspects that was the real goal of all this in the first place. Would they really be title contenders with Nash after stripping down the roster to generate the cap space? And would Nash really take a two-year deal if other teams offered him a third guaranteed year at these dollars?

    Toronto: If I had to bet on one of these outcomes as most likely, this is the one. Toronto has money and motive, and the situation packs enough positives for Nash to join in. For starters, he goes way back with Raptors GM Bryan Colangelo (who signed him away from Dallas before), and there's the obvious patriotic impulse to help the game in Canada.

    Oh, and the Raptors can pay him a boatload of money. If Toronto uses the amnesty rights on Jose Calderon, it can offer Nash a max contract; it's the one team that probably would be most inclined to both overpay and give him a third guaranteed year. Additionally, Toronto could have enough leftover cap room to sign a fairly decent wingman for midlevel-ish money after giving Nash a three-year deal worth $45 million to $50 million.

    And then you stop and say, "Holy crap, $50 million for a 38-year-old point guard on a rebuilding team?"

    But Colangelo has always been the impatient sort, and coach Dwane Casey quietly made this team a much tougher defensive unit a year ago. With a healthy Andrea Bargnani-Jonas Valanciunas frontcourt, Nash at the controls, and some decent help using their leftover money and exceptions, the Raptors could be a solid playoff team and regain some traction locally after years in the wilderness.

    Brooklyn: And now we get to the dark horse that probably warrants more discussion. The Nets are desperate to make a splash in their new digs and will be devastated if Deron Williams leaves. Nash resides in New York in the offseason and would find it awfully convenient to amble across the Brooklyn Bridge to work every day.

    So while I think the Toronto scenario above has a good shot, if Williams leaves, I would move the Nets to the head of the list. They are at least as desperate as Toronto and have more of a hometown advantage.

    The Nets will have heaps of cap room if Williams leaves and can afford to meet whatever price Nash needs met, even after re-signing Gerald Wallace, Brook Lopez and Kris Humphries.

    Would Brooklyn be a good team after all this? Probably not, but the Nets would at least be competitive. That's hugely important to this team. A big part of the Nets' Plan B if Williams goes is merely to save themselves from becoming a laughingstock in their first year in Brooklyn.

    The biggest negative is how this would affect a potential Dwight Howard pursuit. The Nets would have to either get Nash on a one-year deal -- not happening -- or let Humphries or Wallace walk in order to keep enough cap space open for Howard in 2013. One presumes that would be Humphries if a choice were to be made, as Billy King would be subject to ridicule if he traded a 2012 lottery pick for Wallace and then watched Wallace walk as a free agent.

    New York: Despite all the chatter, it is virtually inconceivable that Nash will end up in New York. The Knicks already used their amnesty on Chauncey Billups a year ago and can't create cap room to sign Nash.

    In fact, New York almost certainly will be in the tax after re-signing Jeremy Lin, Steve Novak and J.R. Smith, which means Nash almost certainly would have to take the Knicks' taxpayer midlevel exception, which would start at $3.09 million. He'd be taking about $10 million a year less than his market value, give or take, while playing the same position as Lin, a marketing cash cow. Move along, people, nothing to see here.

    Miami: As with New York, the Heat are almost a comically unrealistic destination for Nash. For starters, either he'd be relegated to spot-up shooting on the weak side or the Heat would have to re-engineer their offense to fit his talents.

    But mostly, as with New York, the money just doesn't work. Miami can offer only the taxpayer's midlevel exception, and while we hear stories of stars taking a bit less money for the right situation, they don't leave $10 million a year on the table.

    Portland: Portland has both motive and opportunity. This organization has coveted Nash in the past and has a glaring opening at point guard; even with the drafting of Damian Lillard, one can imagine the rookie serving an apprenticeship at Nash University before being given the keys to the offense.

    As for opportunity, the Blazers will have enough cap space to make Nash a godfather offer if they wish. Portland has $16.7 million in space even with cap holds on its free agents and can increase it to $18.8 million by using the stretch provision on Shawne Williams. That means the Blazers can make Nash a max offer if they choose.

    However, a few factors complicate matters. First, I'm not sure whether new GM Neil Olshey is as big a Nash fan as the previous tenants of his chair, and I'm not sure the Blazers are in win-now mode the way they were a year or two ago. Nash would make them better, but he wouldn't make them a contender.

    But mostly, it doesn't seem Nash is that interested in going to Portland. The Blazers offer neither a familiar haunt, nor a patriotic return, nor familiar figures with whom to play. One supposes how that could change (what if they hired Mike D'Antoni and took Shawn Marion into their cap space?), but we're getting into the land of the farfetched here. About the best Portland can do for a lure is that it's kinda sorta close to Nash's hometown of Victoria, British Columbia.

    (Complicit in this problem, I should add, was our Marc Stein, who played in Nash's soccer game in New York on Wednesday and yet -- despite clear instructions to "push the bike lanes" -- failed to advise Nash of potentially game-changing information about Portland's cycling-friendly culture and organic produce markets.)

    Indiana: And this, my friends, is why non-glamour markets are always operating at a huge disadvantage. The Pacers are a good team with a need at point guard and a bunch of cap space; with Nash, they could be champions. In fact, I would be hard-pressed to find a more perfect free-agent fit.

    By all rights, the Pacers should be the favorites to land Nash. At the moment, they aren't even on the radar.

    The Pacers will have about $12 million in cap space this summer, including the cap holds on restricted free agents Roy Hibbert and George Hill. Indiana could offer Darren Collison in a sign-and-trade with Phoenix and give Nash a three-year deal worth about $45 million, which would put the Pacers on equal or near-equal footing with every other suitor for his services.

    Meanwhile, basketball-wise this is by far the best team for which Nash could sign up and still be paid market value. The Pacers would just need to re-sign Hibbert and Hill and fill in the gaps on the wings with exception money, and Indy would give itself a three-year run at winning a championship. Could you imagine this offense with Nash at the controls, all that outside shooting at spots 2 through 4 and Hibbert in the paint?

    Alas, imagine is all you'll ever get to do. It won't happen, because it's Indiana, and it doesn't appear Nash has any desire to go there. And I'm sorry, Commissioner Stern, but all the lockouts in the world aren't going to fix this.

    Yep. I honestly didn't even read anything but the Indiana part. It makes an absurd amount of basketball sense it almost makes me mad, until I realized I knew he wasn't realistic all along. Damn.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story...ove-steve-nash



    Yep. I honestly didn't even read anything but the Indiana part. It makes an absurd amount of basketball sense it almost makes me mad, until I realized I knew he wasn't realistic all along. Damn.
    I thought he was fine until he talked about aquiring Nash making Indiana champions. They wouldn't even be close and might not do as well as they did last year... Pass!!

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Wow....if it would take up to $15 mil a year for 3 seasons / $45 mil total to get him....then even I'd consider passing. There's no way that the FO would sign off on that.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Steve Nash for 15 Million a year? UGH!
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/221903/Raptors_Expected_To_Offer_$12M_Annually_To_Nash

    Raptors Expected To Offer $12M Annually To Nash
    Jun 30, 2012 10:55 AM EDT

    The Raptors will bring a contingent of five members of the organization to meet with Steve Nash as soon as he's ready on Sunday.

    Toronto's offer, likely to reach $12 million per season according to sources, is likely to be the most lucrative.

    The Raptors are pushing for a playoff return in the 12-13 season.

    "The Raptors would be one of those teams where you're probably not going there to win a championship in the next three years," said Nash. "For me it'd be going home to Canada, to a great city, and trying to help an organization move forward.

    "I'm open to the positives of all of them. It'd be great if four or five contenders came after me and all offered me a deal, but the reality is I might not get that opportunity. So I'm going to look at every opportunity and Toronto will be one that I'll study as well and look at the opportunity for them to grow in the next three years and what kind of impact I can have on that team. And obviously from a community standpoint, it's a special place for me."
    Again...pass....but more than likely...the FO doesn't want to offer that much.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    I thought he was fine until he talked about aquiring Nash making Indiana champions. They wouldn't even be close and might not do as well as they did last year... Pass!!
    The Pacers' biggest weakness last season was their inability to score efficiently. How would Nash not improve that significantly?

    With Nash, the Pacers would be the second-best team in the East (yes, even better than Chicago w/Rose).

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    I thought he was fine until he talked about aquiring Nash making Indiana champions. They wouldn't even be close and might not do as well as they did last year... Pass!!
    Yeah like I said before Nash is my favorite player in the NBA but I don't see him making us contenders, we need more than just Nash.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    we were next to dead last in assists per game and had major scoring droughts I'd say were caused by the lack of a true point guard to facilitate good shots. But I am not allowing any time to get my hopes up.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    The Pacers' biggest weakness last season was their inability to score efficiently. How would Nash not improve that significantly?

    With Nash, the Pacers would be the second-best team in the East (yes, even better than Chicago w/Rose).
    Nash would not make this team one bit better than they are now. Yes, he would help the offense a little but that would be swallowed up by his getting lit up by every other PG in the League. His day is long past and I think he going to Toronto where he will put some people in the seats and they will be happy just to make the playoffs.... Pass!!!

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    I'd do it easy. If we did that deal the field house fills up, we are on tv, and have a shot at getting good players to sign with us for less.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

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    Wow....if it would take up to $15 mil a year for 3 seasons / $45 mil total to get him....then even I'd consider passing. There's no way that the FO would sign off on that.

    The only reason the article uses those numbers is it's speculated that that's what Toronto may offer. Nash said that if he went to Toronto he would go knowing they wouldn't win a championship in the next 3 years.

    So basically only Toronto would have to offer that much to pique Nash's interest, because they're incapable of winning. So they have to offer him something else.

    Whereas the Pacers, for example, would be instant conference champion contenders if not favorites (if they added Nash). So don't take those numbers as his going rate / market value, because they only apply to Toronto.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Espn is reporting that Toronto will offer Nash 12 mil. If that's the case and Williams really shows not interest then I say we move Jones for a future 2cd. and offer Nash 12/36. He's surely sign here over Toronoto for the same money. Then we can afford to move DC to upgrade our backup 4/5 position, re-sign Hibbert and Hill and we're through.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Logic would dictate he would sign here. Hopefully he's one of the few NBA players that exercises it when deciding where to go.

    We'd be at or very near Miami's level if Nash were here. Roy and West would instantly average 3-4 more ppg on much better %'s based on easy baskets that nash gets them alone, emphasising whet is already a significant advantage over the heat in interior play. I'd also feel better facing them with a monstrous advantage at the 1 and 5 spots as well as the bench, while still having very good starters at 2, 3 and 4 than just a moderate advantage at point with our only real advantages over them being our bench and Roy, with Roy having the disadvantage of our inability to feed him in the post. With PG to cover the most explosive point guards which are not so common, Nash is good enough on offense to more than make up for defensive lapses, and our team D is strong enough to make him not a liability.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    Logic would dictate he would sign here. Hopefully he's one of the few NBA players that exercises it when deciding where to go.

    We'd be at or very near Miami's level if Nash were here. Roy and West would instantly average 3-4 more ppg on much better %'s based on easy baskets that nash gets them alone, emphasising whet is already a significant advantage over the heat in interior play. I'd also feel better facing them with a monstrous advantage at the 1 and 5 spots as well as the bench, while still having very good starters at 2, 3 and 4 than just a moderate advantage at point with our only real advantages over them being our bench and Roy, with Roy having the disadvantage of our inability to feed him in the post. With PG to cover the most explosive point guards which are not so common, Nash is good enough on offense to more than make up for defensive lapses, and our team D is strong enough to make him not a liability.
    You are a dreamer. Nash would not put us on a par with Miami. They have THREE superstars...... They are going to make moves and be better next year. We are light years from catching up with Miami, Chicago or Boston....

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    You are a dreamer. Nash would not put us on a par with Miami. They have THREE superstars...... They are going to make moves and be better next year. We are light years from catching up with Miami, Chicago or Boston....
    But i'm not the only one!

    But really I believe you are underselling us and being overly cynical.

    We're going to be better than Boston with another year on their old tired legs, and who are likely losing Ray Allen next year, we weren't far behind them this season, though their previous experience surely helped them in the conference finals.

    Chicago and Boston aren't worlds better than we are now, with Nash we are easily on Chicago's level, but given the fact that you apparently believe obtaining a future f\hall of famer who jsut posted one of the best seasons of his career despite having barely any help in phoenix would hardly improve us at all (your own argument) then i'm not sure I can really say anything about the disagreement than to agree to disagree, as I think you are dead wrong about NAsh, and how he would help us.

    We have alot more room to improve than Boston, Chicago or Miami, and we played Miami tougher than the Western Conference Champions (I know bosh was out, but in the Finals he wasn't a dominant factor (14-9.4, but really only having 1 "great" game, other than the clincher he had games of 10, 16, 10, 13) and even considering that we still would have likely won game 3 and still had a chance in games 1 and 2.

    Even without Nash we'll be near the level of Chicago and better than boston next season. Miami isn't SO much better than the rest of the league that we won't be able to challenge them in years to come if Roy and PG develop as they should, provided we can add some other pieces to top ourselves off. We did just take them to 6 games on our first go around being a real playoff threat, and an absolutely ancient Boston team took them to 7, and though they didn't have Bosh, Wade is looking like he's declining and they don't have the cap to pick up any real pieces who aren't minimum salary ring chasers.

    You don't HAVE to have "superstars" to win, and Steve Nash IS a superstar player anyhow. OKC had Kevin Durant and Westbrook as well as Harden, who some overrate and call one, and they put up a worse fight vs. Miami than we did.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    You are a dreamer. Nash would not put us on a par with Miami. They have THREE superstars...... They are going to make moves and be better next year. We are light years from catching up with Miami, Chicago or Boston....
    Light years? I don't think so. We could have beaten Boston this year. We would have beaten Chicago after Rose went down. It's true Miami is a notch above, but next year with our players' growth, we will start catching up. Their players are getting old. Haslem, Battier and Miller are on the downside of their careers already. Wade is going to be 31 and his explosiveness will subside. The only way Miami gets better next year is if we see ring chasers go to South Beach. That could happen. But there's no guarantee of that.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    You are a dreamer.
    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    But i'm not the only one!
    I hope some day you'll join us and the world will live as one.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Light years? I don't think so. We could have beaten Boston this year. We would have beaten Chicago after Rose went down. It's true Miami is a notch above, but next year with our players' growth, we will start catching up. Their players are getting old. Haslem, Battier and Miller are on the downside of their careers already. Wade is going to be 31 and his explosiveness will subside. The only way Miami gets better next year is if we see ring chasers go to South Beach. That could happen. But there's no guarantee of that.
    Dwayne could play on a crutch and be better than any player the Pacers have. Some players there will move on and other will move in. How about if they get Ray Allen? I am not convinced that the Pacers could have beaten Chicago without Rose but certainly not if thry had him. There will always be players willing to sign for less to play with Miami but they certainly would not have done that. I also do not think we could have beaten Boston this year. They took Miami to seven game if you were watching. Miami would have beaten the Pacers 4-0 if they had Bosh and basically won three in a row after they adapted to him being gone. James just cranks it up and scores whatever is necessary and we do not have players who can do that. Miami would not be interested in Nash because they don't need that kind of PG. Lucky for us, Nash will avoid the Pacers like a plague.....

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    This article just makes me mad by reminding me of something I already know.
    "We've got to be very clear about this. We don't want our players hanging around with murderers," said Larry Bird, Pacers president.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    You are a dreamer. Nash would not put us on a par with Miami. They have THREE superstars...... They are going to make moves and be better next year. We are light years from catching up with Miami, Chicago or Boston....
    They're good but not as good as you make them out. They don't have 3 superstars, they currently have 1. Bosh is a consistant all star and Wade is no longer on the superstar level. They also have weaknesses. I don't know if Nash puts us on a level with Miami but he gets us a lot closer to where we have a good chance to take them out if everyone is healthy. If we landed Nash he wouldn't have to be our only upgrade, we'd be in a position to trade DC for a major upgrade at the backup 4/5.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    Nash would not make this team one bit better than they are now. Yes, he would help the offense a little but that would be swallowed up by his getting lit up by every other PG in the League. His day is long past and I think he going to Toronto where he will put some people in the seats and they will be happy just to make the playoffs.... Pass!!!
    This already happens with DC/Hill.
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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    They're good but not as good as you make them out. They don't have 3 superstars, they currently have 1. Bosh is a consistant all star and Wade is no longer on the superstar level. They also have weaknesses. I don't know if Nash puts us on a level with Miami but he gets us a lot closer to where we have a good chance to take them out if everyone is healthy. If we landed Nash he wouldn't have to be our only upgrade, we'd be in a position to trade DC for a major upgrade at the backup 4/5.
    Wade not on superstar level? i have to disagree. He is 30 but still has plenty of ball left in him. Did u see what happen in game 4 against us? He was fire and didn't surprise me one bit. Played very well in the finals also.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    I thought he was fine until he talked about aquiring Nash making Indiana champions. They wouldn't even be close and might not do as well as they did last year... Pass!!
    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    Nash would not make this team one bit better.... I think he going to Toronto where he will put some people in the seats and they will be happy just to make the playoffs.... Pass!!!
    So your telling me Nash would put butts in the Toronto seats (true) AND the Raptors will be a playoff team (farfetched)?

    BUT

    Your also telling me Nash would not bring more fans to the Field House (false) AND the Pacers would not be a better team (false) AND would potentially be a worse team (BULLSHYT)?

    Pass the dutchie my friend.

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by LA_Confidential View Post
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    So your telling me Nash would put butts in the Toronto seats (true) AND the Raptors will be a playoff team (farfetched)?

    BUT

    Your also telling me Nash would not bring more fans to the Field House (false) AND the Pacers would not be a better team (false) AND would potentially be a worse team (BULLSHYT)?

    Pass the dutchie my friend.
    Hey, we could get Jason Kidd or better yet, John Stockton is available!! Might have to buy him a pair of short shorts....... Nash is a joke for the Pacers. He isn't coming here now or any time. So, as you say, cut the bullshyt.........

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    Default Re: Nash's Next Move (Hollinger ESPN Insider column)

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    Hey, we could get Jason Kidd or better yet, John Stockton is available!! Might have to buy him a pair of short shorts....... Nash is a joke for the Pacers. He isn't coming here now or any time. So, as you say, cut the bullshyt.........
    Nice rebuttal. I apologize for calling you out for your blatant contradiction.

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