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Thread: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    I really thought things were going to change with Bird gone but is starting to look like everything is going to stay the same, draft safe picks, keep the same pieces together and keep bringing role players to complement our role players, I'm starting to agree with some people here, that Simon is just happy to make the playoffs and is not willing to go the extra mile to win a championship, I'm preparing myself to be disappointed in free agency again.

  2. #27
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I really thought things were going to change with Bird gone but is starting to look like everything is going to stay the same, draft safe picks, keep the same pieces together and keep bringing role players to complement our role players, I'm starting to agree with some people here, that Simon is just happy to make the playoffs and is not willing to go the extra mile to win a championship, I'm preparing myself to be disappointed in free agency again.
    Unless Walsh is just a mascot with no real power or influence, this FO will make Bird look like a never satisfied, wheelin' dealin', tradin' machine.

    Of course we just have to wait and see if KP exerts a different influence on Walsh.

    But seriously, if not then we'll be overpaying our own, staying out of FA, and the only substantial moves we'll make is to maintain a spot in the playoffs. If there's a problem and the wheels come off, once the playoffs are in jeopardy or missed THEN you can expect a move of some substance.

    Hibbert's agent might've felt worried about not seeking an extension last season as Roy took his annual slump. But he has to be absolutely schoolgirl giddy now with Walsh back in the FO. Back up the Brinks truck...

    And George Hill won't be far behind.
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I really thought things were going to change with Bird gone but is starting to look like everything is going to stay the same, draft safe picks, keep the same pieces together and keep bringing role players to complement our role players, I'm starting to agree with some people here, that Simon is just happy to make the playoffs and is not willing to go the extra mile to win a championship, I'm preparing myself to be disappointed in free agency again.
    What do you need, a signed and notarized statement that this was Bird's pick? Everyonje has reported this was Bird's pick. Pritchard said he was working with Bird and this was Bird's pick. All the media have said it was Bird's pick. Donnie wasn't allowed to be with the Pacers draft night because he was still under contract with the Knicks.

    But, fine, this was all the new front office and Bird had nothing to do with it. That way you can start *****ing about Donnie and Pritchard with how much they sucked BEFORE DONNIE WAS EVEN ALLOWED TO WORK FOR THE PACERS.

    Whatever.
    BillS

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    What do you need, a signed and notarized statement that this was Bird's pick? Everyonje has reported this was Bird's pick. Pritchard said he was working with Bird and this was Bird's pick. All the media have said it was Bird's pick. Donnie wasn't allowed to be with the Pacers draft night because he was still under contract with the Knicks.

    But, fine, this was all the new front office and Bird had nothing to do with it. That way you can start *****ing about Donnie and Pritchard with how much they sucked BEFORE DONNIE WAS EVEN ALLOWED TO WORK FOR THE PACERS.

    Whatever.
    Whoa, I know it was Bird's pick all I'm saying is that for what I'm reading from the new FO is not giving me the confidence that things are going to get better, it looks to me like they want to keep doing things the "Larry Bird way" meh.

  5. #30
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Donnie wasn't allowed to be with the Pacers draft night because he was still under contract with the Knicks.

    That way you can start *****ing about Donnie and Pritchard with how much they sucked BEFORE DONNIE WAS EVEN ALLOWED TO WORK FOR THE PACERS.

    Whatever.
    Wasn't Walsh attending workouts for the Pacers? Perhaps in an unofficial capacity with a wink and a nod, but he wasn't there for the Knicks. The contract timing is merely a formality. I'm sure the pick was Bird's but I have no doubt DW knew exactly who Bird was choosing and could've chosen to informally redflag it if he'd wanted... or if he felt strongly enough against it he could've refused to rejoin the FO. In fact I seriously doubt Walsh wasn't consulted about the pick. It might have been as simple as "This is who we are drafting, what do you think?" but I think it's naive to think Walsh was out of the loop on this draft.
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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  6. #31
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Whoa, I know it was Bird's pick all I'm saying is that for what I'm reading from the new FO is not giving me the confidence that things are going to get better, it looks to me like they want to keep doing things the "Larry Bird way" meh.
    You will be pining for the "Larry Bird way" if we return to the "Walsh way".

    Hopefully the KP wildcard changes that but I don't see it. I see a frustrated KP heading for greener pastures with more control sooner rather than later.
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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  8. #32
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Whoa, I know it was Bird's pick all I'm saying is that for what I'm reading from the new FO is not giving me the confidence that things are going to get better, it looks to me like they want to keep doing things the "Larry Bird way" meh.
    I'm just not sure what the new FO has or has not done at this point that gives you a feeling one way or the other. Free Agency doesn't start until tomorrow. Trading before the draft (without the new President in place) would have been somewhat premature.

    Were you expecting Pritchard and Walsh to slam Bird's pick or something?
    BillS

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Wasn't Walsh attending workouts for the Pacers? Perhaps in an unofficial capacity with a wink and a nod, but he wasn't there for the Knicks. The contract timing is merely a formality. I'm sure the pick was Bird's but I have no doubt DW knew exactly who Bird was choosing and could've chosen to informally redflag it if he'd wanted... or if he felt strongly enough against it he could've refused to rejoin the FO. In fact I seriously doubt Walsh wasn't consulted about the pick. It might have been as simple as "This is who we are drafting, what do you think?" but I think it's naive to think Walsh was out of the loop on this draft.
    OK, so you are saying the old "Walsh really had control" line? It seemed pretty clear this was going to be Bird's last draft choice, and I don't think Donnie was empowered to veto it.

    But, fine, whatever, it was a mistake and therefore it HAD to be Donnie's fault.

    Everything is back to normal at PD now. Nothing to see here.
    BillS

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I'm just not sure what the new FO has or has not done at this point that gives you a feeling one way or the other. Free Agency doesn't start until tomorrow. Trading before the draft (without the new President in place) would have been somewhat premature.

    Were you expecting Pritchard and Walsh to slam Bird's pick or something?
    Well for what I've been reading of Pritchards interview with Wells he sounds to me like the FO is going to stay the status quo and just ad few role players, I expected that from Bird but not from this new front office I hope I'm wrong though.

  11. #35
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    I am fine with this post but I wonder why Hicks decided to allow it but took my post down reporting what was said about the pick and the Pacers in Atlanta?? Do we have a double standard here? I don't really care about my post being deleted, I was only the messenger of what was said. This post says about the same thing but without any bet being involved.......
    A comment you made while you pasted the Simmons snippet triggered an unwanted discussion among multiple posters about racism in Indiana, so that chain of posts was deleted. This isn't a forum for that kind of a topic.

    In the future, consider showing me a little more respect on the board instead of trotting out accusations at me, especially considering I'm the only reason you're even still able to post at all.

    Frankly, I think you slipped up and exposed yourself the other day as a troll after all, with your Plumlee/McRoberts double standard, so I'm not entirely sure why I still defend you at all. I suspect you just enjoy being a contrarian in order to get under people's skin.

    You may want to try harder to adjust your reputation, otherwise I'm giving up.

  12. #36
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    I'm just not sure what the new FO has or has not done at this point that gives you a feeling one way or the other.
    Rehired Donnie Do Nothing Walsh
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    OK, so you are saying the old "Walsh really had control" line? It seemed pretty clear this was going to be Bird's last draft choice, and I don't think Donnie was empowered to veto it.

    But, fine, whatever, it was a mistake and therefore it HAD to be Donnie's fault.

    Everything is back to normal at PD now. Nothing to see here.
    I'm not blaming the pick on Walsh. I'm just saying it was a pick Walsh would be fine with. And I'm saying Walsh surely wasn't blindsided by the pick. So the new two-headed monster is operating just as it did before. Bird can take plenty of blame for the pick. And Walsh gets no credit for standing on the sidelines and doing nothing about it or any of us thinking he was out of the loop on the pick. The both get the blame if it proves to be as bad as it looks as far as I am concerned... and so does Simon and Pritchard. ...or the credit if it turns out they were smarter than everybody else.
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  14. #38

    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    How could Walsh stop Bird, who was in control of the draft, when Walsh is still employed by the Knicks until 12:01 tonight? Walsh has no power to veto Bird's pick as he wasn't an employee of the Pacers during the draft. Walsh has no fault in the Plumlee pick. That pick is ALL ON Bird.

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    How could Walsh stop Bird, who was in control of the draft, when Walsh is still employed by the Knicks until 12:01 tonight? Walsh has no power to veto Bird's pick as he wasn't an employee of the Pacers during the draft. Walsh has no fault in the Plumlee pick. That pick is ALL ON Bird.
    There is a big difference between what should be true and reality. I would bet a lot of money that Walsh was very involved and that he agreed with the pick.......

  16. #40

    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Since 2008 Larry Bird's draft style has netted us: Paul George and Roy Hibbert. Also it must be included that George Hill came draft day trade. Add in the trades for West and Collison and it should be obvious that we will probably be missing Bird's drafting style! Was he perfect? No way, but all GM's have misses but he has as many hits as any GM in the league. We will miss you Larry!!!!!!

  17. #41

    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    There is a big difference between what should be true and reality. I would bet a lot of money that Walsh was very involved and that he agreed with the pick.......
    This time next year everyone on this board will be "agreeing" with this pick!

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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    This time next year everyone on this board will be "agreeing" with this pick!
    I also believe that will be true even if some of the later picks excell. Plumlee fills a big need and I look for him to be real crowd pleaser with highlight reel dunks.......

  19. #43
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Call me naive but I'm not automatically assuming that Walsh will come in and make the exact same mistakes he made in the early/mid 2000's... people DO evolve, adjust, grow, and learn from adversity sometimes. Donnie isn't stupid, he realizes what happened to this franchise between 04-10 or so, with the Murphleavy trade, JO and Tins' contracts keeping us in cap hell for years. If not I'm sure Simon and Bird might have mentioned it to him once or twice ;-).

    It is entirely possible that Donnie will resume his old ways, playing it safe, paying too much to re-sign our own guys, etc etc. However I do not think this is automatic, and in fact I think there is reason to hope for a somewhat different approach with Pritchard here, with our recent past and how we dug ourselves out, and with the unique situation we have THIS summer, with cap room and in a position to move things to the next level in a way we haven't been able to for a decade now...

    And yes, this is Bird's pick. All of the available evidence points overwhelmingly in that direction. No reason whatsoever to assume otherwise unless you're being purely conspiratorial.

  20. #44
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    How could Walsh stop Bird, who was in control of the draft, when Walsh is still employed by the Knicks until 12:01 tonight? Walsh has no power to veto Bird's pick as he wasn't an employee of the Pacers during the draft. Walsh has no fault in the Plumlee pick. That pick is ALL ON Bird.
    Walsh coming onboard was already a done deal except for the time when the ink could go on the contract. He gets to share in this pick, good or bad, just as Simon and Pritchard does. It's not like this is not the kind of pick Walsh wouldn't have taken. I don't believe for one second he couldn't have stopped it if he really wanted to. He could've called Simon and put the kibosh on it. You're not going to tell me that the FO monster was working with Walsh in the dark about the draft... yet Walsh officially announcing his coming onboard before the draft all happened with no discussion of the impending draft??
    Last edited by Bball; 06-30-2012 at 04:39 PM.
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  21. #45

    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Walsh coming onboard was already a done deal except for the time when the ink could go on the contract. He gets to share in this pick, good or bad, just as Simon and Pritchard does. It's not like this is not the kind of pick Walsh wouldn't have taken. I don't believe for one second he couldn't have stopped it if he really wanted to. He could've called Simon and put the kibosh on it. You're not going to tell me that the FO monster was working with Walsh in the dark about the draft... yet Walsh officially announcing his coming onboard before the draft all happened with no discussion of the impending draft??

    The only person who could have stopped that pick was Simon. It would smell to high heaven if Simon had stopped Bird from picking Plumlee when Simon doesn't know Plumlee from Tyler Zeller. What reason would Simon have, b/c Donnie said it was a poor pick? The finger would have pointed right at Walsh who couldn't legally even be involved in the draft.

    As much as I don't like or want Walsh back in the FO, I can't give any credit to Walsh for the Plumlee pick. The Plumlee pick is all on Bird until Walsh writes his memiors saying differently.

  22. #46
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    The only person who could have stopped that pick was Simon. It would smell to high heaven if Simon had stopped Bird from picking Plumlee when Simon doesn't know Plumlee from Tyler Zeller. What reason would Simon have, b/c Donnie said it was a poor pick? The finger would have pointed right at Walsh who couldn't legally even be involved in the draft.

    As much as I don't like or want Walsh back in the FO, I can't give any credit to Walsh for the Plumlee pick. The Plumlee pick is all on Bird until Walsh writes his memiors saying differently.
    I agree the pick was all Bird... I just have few doubts Walsh not only knew about it but was fine with it. I doubt he said or thought "Plumlee??? Are we sure about this?"

    It's just so disappointing to follow the Bird era with a return to the Walsh error....
    O'Brien has been fired! Yay! What took so long?

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  23. #47
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    Default Re: Saying Goodbye To Bird's Drafting Style

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    I agree the pick was all Bird... I just have few doubts Walsh not only knew about it but was fine with it. I doubt he said or thought "Plumlee??? Are we sure about this?"

    It's just so disappointing to follow the Bird era with a return to the Walsh error....

    Were you around from 1990-2003 when Bird took the reigns?

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