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Thread: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

  1. #351

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    not flawless you go bpa by tiers and Plumlee was a tier 6(I would of had him in 7 or 8) at best and there was a tier 4 guy on the board. Take the BPA and add a Plumlee in free agency DONT Fin DRAFT BY NEED.
    Nothing you've said here demonstrates any flaw in wintermute's logic, only that you've failed to grasp his point.

    His point is that Mackey Rose's reasoning is tautological. That is, it's true by definition. If you judge a player's draft stock by where he's ultimately selected, then no player's draft stock could be significantly higher -- or lower -- than the number they're selected at.

    We could apply this same reasoning to Perry Jones, III, and conclude that his stock was even lower than Plumlee's. After all, he was drafted after Plumlee. If teams were that high on him, he wouldn't have lasted until pick 28.

    Mackey Rose's attempted point failed in another way...

    Theoretically, any single-pick team, 1-25, could've had Plumlee as high as #2 on their big board (and two-pick teams, as high as #3, etc.), but as long as their top selection was available, would've passed on him.

    For example, New Orleans' top three could've been Anthony Davis, Austin Rivers, and Miles Plumlee, but, since Davis and Rivers were still available when the Hornets were on the clock, they were the selections at #1 and #10. I don't believe this, obviously, but you get the point.

    Anyway, all of this is just rhetoric. All I know is that, according to many reports, Plumlee was so impressive in workouts that multiple teams picking as high as the early 20's were giving him serious consideration. Knowing this, I don't see how anyone can say the Pacers reached for him at #26. You may not like the pick personally, and certain mock drafts may have been misinformed, but the 20's to 30's is where his draft stock had risen to, apparently.

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  3. #352

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownBearCoffee View Post
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    "10:04 — Instead of taking Miles Plumlee at no. 26, Indiana should have just walked over to Perry Jones and dumped a bucket of manure on him. That's tonight's first pick that elicited outright laughter from everyone in my living room. It's almost like they knew Larry Bird was leaving and wanted to take one last white guy in his honor, only all the white guys got taken and they still stubbornly stuck to the plan. Nope, we promised we'd do it for Larry … just take Plumlee, it will be fine …"

    http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...raft-diary-xvi

    Bill Simmon's take on the pick.
    I wonder if Mr. Simmons realizes that Plumlee becomes only the second white player on the roster, and that Plumlee is only the second white player Bird has ever drafted (non-international) in his 9-year tenure here.
    Last edited by Doddage; 06-29-2012 at 02:22 PM.

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  5. #353
    Play McRoberts and Price! BRushWithDeath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Doddage View Post
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    I wonder if Mr. Simmons realizes that Plumlee becomes the only white player on the roster, and that Plumlee is only the second white player Bird has ever drafted (non-international) in his tenure here.
    We still have Hansbrough.

    Unfortunately.
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

    -Lance Stephenson

  6. #354

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    We still have Hansbrough.

    Unfortunately.
    Ah, yes, I guess with his non-impactful play as of late, I forgot he was even on the roster.

  7. #355
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    With the second unit no we don't. Hibbert can only play 30 minutes and West will start so when the second unit comes are whole game plan changes for the worse. The second unit doesn't have a good enough backcourt to score without a good inside presence IMO.
    Which is why I want Hill to go back to that second unit backcourt and be our PG there and play some SG aswell depending on opposition and gameplan and be an aggressive scorer, while getting a better starting PG who is more of a natural PG who is at the very least better at getting our bigs involved at the best possible position and doesn't need tons of turnovers to just that. For us to be able to do this we also need to prevend Hill from getting a new contract that's starting at like 7+ mln and up, because together with that new PG that position would be taking too big of a chunk out of our total salary eventually.
    Last edited by Mourning; 06-29-2012 at 02:39 PM. Reason: grammar correction
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  8. #356

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by rm1369 View Post
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    It's playoff team building 101 - Hit as many singles as you can and never swing for the fences. I just wish they were studying championship building 101, cause what they are building isn't it.
    Its the 26th freakin' pick dude! MP is a championship caliber pick because he fits a need and will NOT be sitting on the pine next to Lance Stephenson! All championship teams have "ROLE PLAYERS". This was not a lottery pick. Bird picked from the crap that was left.

  9. #357
    Member BigAndy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvAP3KGYBpQ

    I take back everything I've said. Dude is talented.

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  11. #358
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by BigAndy View Post
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvAP3KGYBpQ

    I take back everything I've said. Dude is talented.
    If only he could have been there last night to ride up to Stern on stage. That would have been perfect.

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  13. #359

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    This discussion is ridiculous. He is the 26th pick in the draft! There are very few players that are drafted after the 25th pick that amount to any more than a rotation player (I know go ahead and post a list of 50 people that have been drafted later that were all-stars I will list more that werern't). The point is its a crap-shoot in that position. If he pans out great if not okay. UncleBuck has it right. Relax and see how it plays out. Nobody at 26 was going to get us next years nba championship.

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  15. #360

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
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    This discussion is ridiculous. He is the 26th pick in the draft! There are very few players that are drafted after the 25th pick that amount to any more than a rotation player (I know go ahead and post a list of 50 people that have been drafted later that were all-stars I will list more that werern't). The point is its a crap-shoot in that position. If he pans out great if not okay. UncleBuck has it right. Relax and see how it plays out. Nobody at 26 was going to get us next years nba championship.

    Probably the most intelligent quote since the pick was made!

  16. #361
    billbradley
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
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    This discussion is ridiculous. He is the 26th pick in the draft! There are very few players that are drafted after the 25th pick that amount to any more than a rotation player (I know go ahead and post a list of 50 people that have been drafted later that were all-stars I will list more that werern't). The point is its a crap-shoot in that position. If he pans out great if not okay. UncleBuck has it right. Relax and see how it plays out. Nobody at 26 was going to get us next years nba championship.
    The last time a team fan base freaked out like this over the team's 26th pick was probably George Hill...

  17. #362

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    It's not whether he deserved to be 26th or 56th. It's whether there were guys who had a greater probability of helping the team. Plumlee may turn out great and the 2 or 3 guys behind him who had yes more potential could be duds. The argument that we needed a big man is worthwhile but we could have had a big man from FA. It's a bit hard to believe that his stock rose during the two week draft period but didn't move much during 4 years of actually playing college ball.

    Is Plumlee going to be better than FES?

    My take is that someone in the FO is afraid we will lose Roy to FA.

  18. #363

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Could you find a FA center that will make the money that he will. I think all 7' are overpaid just because they are 7'. A FA center would have hurt our flexibility against the cap.
    I look at it this way. He is cheap labor for the 15 minutes per game compared to what we would pay a FA center.
    Last edited by Coach; 06-29-2012 at 03:16 PM.

  19. #364
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by rm1369 View Post
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    It's playoff team building 101 - Hit as many singles as you can and never swing for the fences. I just wish they were studying championship building 101, cause what they are building isn't it.
    Picking with the 26th pick, and swinging for the fences, is like having an 0-2 count and just trying to sit on a fastball, since we're going to continue with baseball analogies.

    Sure, you might get a HR every once in a while, but most often you're going to strike out.


    If this was the 10th pick in the draft, or even the 15th, then yeah, I get your point. But not the 26th pick.

  20. #365

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
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    Could you find a FA center that will make the money that he will. I think all 7' are overpaid just because they are 7'. A FA center would have hurt our flexibility against the cap.
    A safer pick and a more experienced FA would make sense. Will he be better than Fes?

  21. #366

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    I don't know. Even the experts don't know. Only time will tell. Then there will still be debate. lol

  22. #367

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Picking with the 26th pick, and swinging for the fences, is like having an 0-2 count and just trying to sit on a fastball, since we're going to continue with baseball analogies.

    Sure, you might get a HR every once in a while, but most often you're going to strike out.


    If this was the 10th pick in the draft, or even the 15th, then yeah, I get your point. But not the 26th pick.
    The question is whether this is a single or a pop fly to the infield.

  23. #368
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    This whole fan reaction thing is understandable. PJIII and Moultrie were projected to go higher and were on the board with others, PJIII was talked about as an early lottery pick last year. Add that MP is a role player and projected to go lower, it makes sense. If Miles Plumlee is your back up rotation center by the end of this year, its a good pick. I say that quickly, cuz well, he's not getting any younger.

    I do guarantee you this, there will be someone picked after 26 who is better, there ALWAYS is. People will use that to say what a bad pick it is, which is nonsense, imo.

    I am warming to the concept of how this team is looking more than the Plumlee pick. You've got grown A men at the starting and back up spots across the board. If you want a physical identity, you really can look at George Hill, Granger, DWest, Hansbrough, D Jones, Orlando Johnson, Pendegraph, Plumlee, even Lance is a big guy. All just physically strong types, I'm guessing no fun to play against. Even the more slender guys like DC and Paul George are just all over you defensively, reaching and poking, when things are going well. Then you have a 7'2" guy waiting for you at the rim, just can't be a fun time. I can see why teams get pissed at them, no joy for oppenents. Thanks gawd the soft days are over!!!!

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  25. #369
    Member PR07's Avatar
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Everyone keeps asking if Plumlee is better than Fes, I think the real question is, is he better than Amundson because that's who the Pacers are likely hoping he replaces. He certainly has him beat in the size and over offensive ability categories. The rest remain unclear. I never watched a Duke game and came across thinking Plumlee was a scrapper.

  26. #370
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    Its the 26th freakin' pick dude! MP is a championship caliber pick because he fits a need and will NOT be sitting on the pine next to Lance Stephenson! All championship teams have "ROLE PLAYERS". This was not a lottery pick. Bird picked from the crap that was left.
    This is all fine and good, if you're Miami or OKC. But we're not a championship team, and most of our players are already "role players." We need more "talent" to become a "championship team." MP doesn not bring this.
    Danger Zone

  27. #371

    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
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    Everyone keeps asking if Plumlee is better than Fes, I think the real question is, is he better than Amundson because that's who the Pacers are likely hoping he replaces. He certainly has him beat in the size and over offensive ability categories. The rest remain unclear. I never watched a Duke game and came across thinking Plumlee was a scrapper.
    Your forgetting about Pendegraph on the depth chart. RIght now I think Miles has to out play Jeff to land in the second unit which is why I think the pick is bad.

    No rookie (26tth pick) is going to be Jeff FOster overnight and it may take till his 3rd year to make a great impact off the bench. This is why signing a vet is more important to me than drafting a replacement for a vet. The transition will take longer than most care to admit.

  28. #372
    The Doctor's In The House TheDon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by TOP View Post
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    I'm sure it's already been posted but I don't have time to go through the entire thread.

    Did anyone see Bill Simmons comment on the Pacers drafting Plumlee??


    Welcome to Draft Diary XVI



    Sweet.... even writers on ESPN are making fun of our franchise and the fact that Larry Bird is obsessed with bad white players.
    CALLED IT!

  29. #373
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    Your forgetting about Pendegraph on the depth chart. RIght now I think Miles has to out play Jeff to land in the second unit which is why I think the pick is bad.

    No rookie (26tth pick) is going to be Jeff FOster overnight and it may take till his 3rd year to make a great impact off the bench. This is why signing a vet is more important to me than drafting a replacement for a vet. The transition will take longer than most care to admit.
    When did Pendergraph become a stalwart?

    I know reports are promising so far for him, but I would expect my 24 year old first round pick to be better than him.

  30. #374
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    People are pissed cause we need to get better and we want to see potential. We want hope that we stole someone in the draft who is actually going to help take the team to the next level. Chum doesn't do that. This is a guy who played 4 years at Duke, will be 24, and is considered a raw prospect with limited upside and who is supposed to be mentally soft and checks out of games. Will the guys taken after him prove to be any better? Probably not. But do we need a soft 7-footer with no offensive game? probably not.
    Danger Zone

  31. #375
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    Default Re: Let's talk about Miles Plumlee

    I have a feeling that we are going to pull a James White on him.

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