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Thread: Off season Rumors and Speculation

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    Would easily take Ryan Anderson over George Hill. deadly shooter who hits the glass top 10 in the NBA last year in wins shared. Offensively would make us a much better team could play both the 3 and the 4 and at the end of games make our team tough to guard and help Danny and Hibbert along with others get easier looks. A guy you don't have to call a play for and will get 15 for you is pretty damn valuable in the NBA.
    Can we see one season of Ryan Anderson without Dwight Howard double and triple teams to help him clean up on the glass and hit threes? Playoffs were not encouraging. As a reminder, he averaged a scorching 9.6 pts and 4.5 rebs while shooting 34% from the field in our series against the Magic.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    @SInow: The @Bucks are nearing a deal with Ersan Ilyasova for 5 years $45 million. First reported by @hoopshype.
    great deal for ersan. i'm happy for him.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    I definitely think they can "afford" not to sign Hill. What we paid to trade for him is a sunk cost. Losing Hill, from that perspective, would be like losing Hibbert. Costly in terms of production on the court but ultimately not dire. I really, really don't think the "local boy" thing factored heavily into these negotiations. Fans care much more about Hibbert than Hill. If the front office was driven by a desire to please the fans, Hibbert would be a bigger concern than Hill.

    Ultimately, I think the front office re-signed Hill because of continuity on the court and because he's a good to very good player. You can live with the 4th or 5th best guy on your team making Hill's amount of money when you don't have three 15mil+ max guys.

    For the record, I think both guys are re-signed, probably at 1-2 million more than they are worth but not for the fans or for the PR but because we can't replace their talent and chemistry with our other main guys.
    You cant win with Hill as your 4th or 5th best player unless you have 1 or 2 max worthy superstars ala Tim Duncan and Tony Parker .

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by ESutt7 View Post
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    To be fair, I'm only going to get really concerned IF we let Hibbert walk and don't make a significant addition. Even if we just kept Hibbert I wouldn't be panicking by any means. If we get Hibbert and upgrade Barbosa's spot by getting Mayo or someone, I'll feel like we got better. If we can upgrade Tyler's spot I'll be happy with that.

    It's too soon to just panic. We haven't done anything yet, but there's plenty of time to improve what was already a good team. And assuming we do that, we could have a lot of attractive pieces at the deadline to make another move. We're a potential ECF team depending on matchups if everyone comes back. The right addition, internal improvement, or trade can take us to the next level. Let's calm down a little bit, at least until it's official that we don't match Roy.
    still not enough to compete for a championship.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    Can we see one season of Ryan Anderson without Dwight Howard double and triple teams to help him clean up on the glass and hit threes? Playoffs were not encouraging. As a reminder, he averaged a scorching 9.6 pts and 4.5 rebs while shooting 34% from the field in our series against the Magic.
    That is a fair point but

    If Hibbert is worthy of a max contract I am guessing he will open up looks for Anderson with a double team. If Hibbert cant command a double team than we really shouldnt be even consider paying him.


    But for the most part Hibbert in the future and now should demand a double team. If teams dont double team than let Hibbert go to work in the post and Anderson just helped the team by giving Hibbert an easy cover down low. A good stat sheet isnt the only way a player can be effective IMO it's misleading on most players ability and talents and impact on a basketball game.

    im not a big Anderson fan at all but if I had the optin of him or Hill that is a no brainier for me. Hill is easily replaceable adding a scorer like Anderson isnt.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 07-08-2012 at 04:46 PM.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    You cant win with Hill as your 4th or 5th best player unless you have 1 or 2 max worthy superstars ala Tim Duncan and Tony Parker .
    Is this a rule? I think you can win with Hill as your 4th or 5th best player. Your 1-3 guys have to be near-all-stars/all-stars. And you have to have 3-4 guys near/just below Hill's level.

    Isn't that basically the Pacers' plan? Granger-West-Hibbert as your top 3. Hill and George as the fourth or fifth best players, depending on what you think of Paul George and his potential to raise his game next year. And then guys like DC, Mayo, and Kaman to fill up the rest of your top 8. That's basically what our thinking is, as best I can tell.

    We aren't going to get those max superstars so we build a team a slightly different way, which requires us to have several Hill-level guys. In this case, Hill is especially nice to have because he's a proven hard worker/good chemistry guy and we already have him in the fold so we overpay by a million or so.
    Last edited by rexnom; 07-08-2012 at 04:50 PM.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    That is a fair point but

    If Hibbert is worthy of a max contract I am guessing he will open up looks for Anderson with a double team. If Hibbert cant command a double team than we really shouldnt be even consider paying him.


    But for the most part Hibbert in the future and now should demand a double team. If teams dont double team than let Hibbert go to work in the post and Anderson just helped the team by giving Hibbert an easy cover down low. A good stat sheet isnt the only way a player can be effective IMO it's misleading on most players ability and talents and impact on a basketball game.

    im not a big Anderson fan at all but if I had the optin of him or Hill that is a no brainier for me. Hill is easily replaceable adding a scorer like Anderson isnt.
    You make a good case. I just think that a four year/36 million dollar contract would make me think about more than a little. It definitely wouldn't be a no-brainer.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    By how much did we overpay George Hill, in your estimation?

    Would you rather have had Ilyasova, Anderson, or Green at about a million more/year?
    Not sure which Green you are referring to, but I wouldn't want any Green in the league for that money.
    Ilyasova, I wouldn't mind having, but that isn't where the Pacers focus should be.
    Anderson does not fit into Pacers system.
    Hill got paid 10 mil to much. But Pacers are a small market and they want to show stability, so, if they think 40 mil is ok, I have no problem with it as long as they don't deprive improvement to the team because of salary issues. Which, I think they will deprive the growth of the team in salary. With that said, we will all regret the signing of Hill at 40 million.
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    I'm sorry, but Ryan Anderson=Troy Murphy....how soon we forget.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by mildlysane View Post
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    I'm sorry, but Ryan Anderson=Troy Murphy....how soon we forget.
    No doubt and he doesn't fit the "smashmouth" approach!
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Anderson has a lot more fight in him. I've seen him scrap for a lot of tough points inside people don't notice.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Anderson has a lot more fight in him. I've seen him scrap for a lot of tough points inside people don't notice.
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Anderson has a lot more fight in him. I've seen him scrap for a lot of tough points inside people don't notice.
    You wouldn't know it by how poorly he played in the first round series against us, but I agree. He's a better and tougher player than many think.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Anderson has a lot more fight in him. I've seen him scrap for a lot of tough points inside people don't notice.
    He also good at fighting for rebounds, he is not as weak as people think.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    You make a good case. I just think that a four year/36 million dollar contract would make me think about more than a little. It definitely wouldn't be a no-brainer.
    No doubt it isn't a no brainier if we are talking about just paying Anderson and not choosing between Hii and Anderson. But Hill at 8m a season makes me cringe and is way overpaid . You cant get a Ryan Anderson caliber player for cheaper than what they paid. However getting a combo guard who is good on both offense and defense can be attained for 3-5m a year pretty easily.


    Ryan Anderson isnt Troy Murphy lets get that straight right now also. Anderson helped his team win and his teams are much better with him on the floor. But Jeff Green and Troy Murphy throughout their careers have made their teams worse Anderson doesn't. Anderson is like Dale Davis compared to the soft Troy Murphy.


    Again not a huge fan of his game or even wanted him(although I do think he would really help the team and make other better by just being on the floor he would help Hibbert) but I would take him over Hill for the reasons I listed at their current salaries and # of years on the deal and future upside Anderson is barley 24 It's a no brainier between the 2 of them.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 07-08-2012 at 05:11 PM.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Why are we discussing Ryan Anderson in relation to the Pacers? Looks like he isn't coming here.

    I have seen the Pacers mentioned in relation to Brand and Mayo. Recently anyway.

    Anyone heard any more about those two?

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    There really isn't a possible rumor to Brand, only a list of interested parties. high bid wins.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    No doubt it isn't a no brainier if we are talking about just paying Anderson and not choosing between Hii and Anderson. But Hill at 8m a season makes me cringe and is way overpaid . You cant get a Ryan Anderson caliber player for cheaper than what they paid. However getting a combo guard who is good on both offense and defense can be attained for 3-5m a year pretty easily.


    Ryan Anderson isnt Troy Murphy lets get that straight right now also. Anderson helped his team win and his teams are much better with him on the floor. But Jeff Green and Troy Murphy throughout their careers have made their teams worse Anderson doesn't. Anderson is like Dale Davis compared to the soft Troy Murphy.


    Again not a huge fan of his game or even wanted him(although I do think he would really help the team and make other better by just being on the floor he would help Hibbert) but I would take him over Hill for the reasons I listed at their current salaries and # of years on the deal and future upside Anderson is barley 24 It's a no brainier between the 2 of them.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    No doubt it isn't a no brainier if we are talking about just paying Anderson and not choosing between Hii and Anderson. But Hill at 8m a season makes me cringe and is way overpaid . You cant get a Ryan Anderson caliber player for cheaper than what they paid. However getting a combo guard who is good on both offense and defense can be attained for 3-5m a year pretty easily.


    Ryan Anderson isnt Troy Murphy lets get that straight right now also. Anderson helped his team win and his teams are much better with him on the floor. But Jeff Green and Troy Murphy throughout their careers have made their teams worse Anderson doesn't. Anderson is like Dale Davis compared to the soft Troy Murphy.


    Again not a huge fan of his game or even wanted him(although I do think he would really help the team and make other better by just being on the floor he would help Hibbert) but I would take him over Hill for the reasons I listed at their current salaries and # of years on the deal and future upside Anderson is barley 24 It's a no brainier between the 2 of them.
    If Anderson was so good, why did his stats fall so drastically once D12 went out. I think Anderson is very overrated. He's better than Troy Murphy for sure, BUT he's not THAT much better skill wise. It's more like he's a tougher player with a bit of a higher motor.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
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    If Anderson was so good, why did his stats fall so drastically once D12 went out.
    ...because they lost Howard with what, 2 weeks left in the season? Kinda hard to adjust on the fly with that.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    like Ken Berger said OJ May and Lee are gonna wait to see if NOLA matches EJ. If they do OJ Mayo will be a very rich man in PHX Im guessing.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    PG showing Kobe who's boss (that's what we'll go with). Gordon looking sad.


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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    No doubt it isn't a no brainier if we are talking about just paying Anderson and not choosing between Hii and Anderson. But Hill at 8m a season makes me cringe and is way overpaid . You cant get a Ryan Anderson caliber player for cheaper than what they paid. However getting a combo guard who is good on both offense and defense can be attained for 3-5m a year pretty easily.


    Ryan Anderson isnt Troy Murphy lets get that straight right now also. Anderson helped his team win and his teams are much better with him on the floor. But Jeff Green and Troy Murphy throughout their careers have made their teams worse Anderson doesn't. Anderson is like Dale Davis compared to the soft Troy Murphy.


    Again not a huge fan of his game or even wanted him(although I do think he would really help the team and make other better by just being on the floor he would help Hibbert) but I would take him over Hill for the reasons I listed at their current salaries and # of years on the deal and future upside Anderson is barley 24 It's a no brainier between the 2 of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    ...because they lost Howard with what, 2 weeks left in the season? Kinda hard to adjust on the fly with that.
    I agree with the spirit of this post but still...the dropoff was dramatic. And the rest of the team didn't struggle as much as Anderson did. This, of course, makes sense, given how much of his game was built around Howard. The question is whether or not he can re-orient his game outside of Howard. I'm not sure either way. But I wouldn't want to spend $36 million to find out.

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    Default Re: Off season Rumors and Speculation

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    ...because they lost Howard with what, 2 weeks left in the season? Kinda hard to adjust on the fly with that.
    So it made him less of a tough guy with Howard gone? Cause I didn't see any toughness from him after Howard was out. Of course I have never seen that side of him in the NBA on any consistent level, so why would it have changed?
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    Great deal for Ilyasova.

    With the Anderson trade, I think we can declare the beginning of blowing it up. If there was any hope of Dwight resigning in Orlando they are gone now.


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