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Thread: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

  1. #101
    Over the pond ballism's Avatar
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    Bird has indicated he wants to keep the core together, that's not spectulation.
    True, but when someone goes from "Bird said it" to "Like it or not, this is how it's going to be, I know it for a fact so stop the discussion", it's quite a jump.

    Bird also said Jasikevicius could be a star and reminds him of himself. He seemed to invest more time and effort into getting him than some GMs spend chasing proven superstar free agents. And then he gave it a year, he didn't like what he saw, and his pet project was gone.

    If anything, we know that Bird is always calculating and evaluating, and that he's patient and doesn't disclose more emotions and info than he thinks is necessary.
    If at some point during these playoffs (or at some point in the future) he decided that some core piece doesn't really fit, he will likely never say it publicly and just take his time finding the best solution.

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  3. #102
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    Bird has indicated he wants to keep the core together, that's not spectulation. Some of you just think you have better idea's, and that's most of the time! In reality we don't actually know what trades Bird has been offered or tried.

    Really I don't have any problem with people disagreeing with the majority, but some do so nearly all the time which makes me think they are either dumb or just like to argue.
    Yep he is saying that he wants to keep the "core" together, but how do you know who he think are the "core players"? For all I know Lance and Pendergrahp are part of the "core" have you talk to Larry personally to know who are the players? If the answer is no, then stop complaining about people wanting to trade somebody because nobody knows who are the untouchables.

  4. #103

    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by tadscout View Post
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    We had the 5th best record in the NBA...

    I wish people would quit beating this to death. "That is now in the past!" You can't live in the past. This team staying the status quo isn't going to have the 5th best record next year. I have no delusions this team will even have the 3rd best record in the EAST next year.

    After having said this, I'm not advocating trading Granger, BUT Granger isn't unreplaceable. You have to look to the future and staying stagnant while other teams are improving over the off season isn't going to get this team where they want to be. What I'll say is in order to get something of value you have to give up something of value. 29 other GM's are NOT looking to give the Pacers anything w/o getting something good back to help their team improve.

    I'm very impressed with the Spurs organization. They traded Hill for Kawhi Leonard who became 1st team Rookie, and cap. Took the cap and applied it towards getting Boris Diaw who Charlotte waived. They acquired Jackson and Patty Mills as well. They don't even have a #1 pick this coming year! Pop has 4 Championships and RC Buford doesn't have a Exec of the Year award, but he does have 3 Championships as GM.

    They didn't go out and bring in a Garnett and Allen or a LeBron and Bosh.

    Ginobili 57th pick
    Parker 28th pick
    Blair 37th pick
    Splitter 28th pick
    Not to mention Green and Neal

    They and OKC have basically built their teams thru the draft, and I'd I'd much rather see either team win the nba championship than the bought and paid for Heat.
    Last edited by Justin Tyme; 06-01-2012 at 04:19 PM.

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  6. #104
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy View Post
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    This would be perfect but I don't think Golden State would go for it. Maybe if we added a pick and Hansbrough.
    If the Warriors trade Klay, Curry and the 7th, they're very likely giving up 3 quality starters (and probably 3 of their 4 best assets). They're going to want a very good return back the other way.

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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by ballism View Post
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    True, but when someone goes from "Bird said it" to "Like it or not, this is how it's going to be, I know it for a fact so stop the discussion", it's quite a jump.

    Bird also said Jasikevicius could be a star and reminds him of himself. He seemed to invest more time and effort into getting him than some GMs spend chasing proven superstar free agents. And then he gave it a year, he didn't like what he saw, and his pet project was gone.

    If anything, we know that Bird is always calculating and evaluating, and that he's patient and doesn't disclose more emotions and info than he thinks is necessary.
    If at some point during these playoffs (or at some point in the future) he decided that some core piece doesn't really fit, he will likely never say it publicly and just take his time finding the best solution.
    Can I thank this a million times?

  8. #106

    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Lateral moves are still worth doing if it means the talent going out was not as good of a fit with the rest of your roster as the talent coming in.

    Absolutely! The player coming in brings aspects that the player being traded doesn't have... reb, better "D", better handles, better to the rim game, etc.

  9. #107

    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I disagree, he won't get anything more then and MLE offer from any other team. Maybe not even the full MLE. Market value for good combo guards was only about 5 mil last year and teams are going to use more caution this year as the grace period for the LT comes to an end with the 2013/14 season.
    I am not saying he will get overpaid just that we could probably have gotten him for 6.5 and kept the pick.

    The 7 million number is what I think Bird would walk away from and let him go.

  10. #108
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by d_c View Post
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    I think it's unlikely Drummond falls past Portland at #6 and, if he did, I think the W's would probably keep him to themselves as he'd be excellent value at #7. Even if he wound up busting he'd still hhave value for at least a few years due to his perceived potential (see Anthony Randolph).
    Yeah I doubt he falls, that is why I say I doubt a deal happens, at this point I could not see trading up that far to get PJIII, Lamb, Barnes, or Lillard only guys worth trading up that high to get, for that cost would be Beal, Drummond and possibly MKG but I don't really love his fit on this team, he is basically a shorter PG, that plays more aggressive not can't stretch a defense.
    Why so SERIOUS

  11. #109
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    If G.S. can take on some cap, I say go for it.

    Trade Granger for Klay and the pick and open up cap space for deron williams. Then get a great pick at 7 and a decent pick at 26 in this deep draft and we'll be looking very very good

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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by tmhall11 View Post
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    If G.S. can take on some cap, I say go for it.

    Trade Granger for Klay and the pick and open up cap space for deron williams. Then get a great pick at 7 and a decent pick at 26 in this deep draft and we'll be looking very very good
    Until Deron Williams makes some indication that he would indeed play for the Pacers, I'm certainly not clearing any sort of additional cap space for him. It's just wishful thinking that he wants to sign here at this point.

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  14. #111
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    I'm just stating what should be obvious, Bird is not going to make some huge gamble trading away our best players just to shake things up. Bird's history and statements show this to be true, this isn't my attempt to play GM. Any deal we could make with our core players would be lateral at best at this point. The team we have already fits together perfectly, you trade your role-players to fit around the core, not the other way around. If you think core players means Pendergraph or Fez, then you certainly are in no position to be playing GM yourself. Obviously core means your top 2-3 players, and in the Pacer's case maybe 3-4.

    And yes, the fact this team was top 5 DOES matter. You don't start over from scratch every year. Obviously other teams are trying to improve and the Pacers will as well. But that doesn't happen by taking huge gambles trading away your best players on unproven risks, especially #7 draft picks. We are NOT in rebuilding mode anymore folks, stop pretending we are, or should be.

    Let me ask you this, what teams have went from near-contenders to contenders by trading away their best players, unless they got a hugely lopsided trade in their favor?

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  16. #112
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Yep he is saying that he wants to keep the "core" together, but how do you know who he think are the "core players"? For all I know Lance and Pendergrahp are part of the "core" have you talk to Larry personally to know who are the players? If the answer is no, then stop complaining about people wanting to trade somebody because nobody knows who are the untouchables.
    The core players have been listed before in the newspaper, and Danny was one of the core players. Look it up.

    However after you read it I don't expect you to change your negative view. After all you have probably argued with most all the forum by now and that hasn't stopped you.

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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.ThunderMakeR View Post
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    I'm just stating what should be obvious, Bird is not going to make some huge gamble trading away our best players just to shake things up. Bird's history and statements show this to be true, this isn't my attempt to play GM. Any deal we could make with our core players would be lateral at best at this point. The team we have already fits together perfectly, you trade your role-players to fit around the core, not the other way around. If you think core players means Pendergraph or Fez, then you certainly are in no position to be playing GM yourself. Obviously core means your top 2-3 players, and in the Pacer's case maybe 3-4.

    And yes, the fact this team was top 5 DOES matter. You don't start over from scratch every year. Obviously other teams are trying to improve and the Pacers will as well. But that doesn't happen by taking huge gambles trading away your best players on unproven risks, especially #7 draft picks. We are NOT in rebuilding mode anymore folks, stop pretending we are, or should be.

    Let me ask you this, what teams have went from near-contenders to contenders by trading away their best players, unless they got a hugely lopsided trade in their favor?
    Only Bird and Simon knows who are the guys he is going to keep stop pretending like you have some inside information, you are just speculating like everybody else, you like act like you are the only one that should be able to have an opinion around here, get off of that high horse.

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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    The core players have been listed before in the newspaper, and Danny was one of the core players. Look it up.

    However after you read it I don't expect you to change your negative view. After all you have probably argued with most all the forum by now and that hasn't stopped you.
    Yeah like Bird is going to tell people who he is going to keep and are the "core players" I remember when Rush was part of that core, or Mcbob or Jarret Jack........

  20. #115

    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    I doubt the Pacers are willing to part with Granger and Collison for Curry and the 7th pick. We were a couple games away from the Eastern Conference Finals. At this point, trading our captain and above average veteran backup point guard for Seth Curry and a rookie is rebuilding. Rebuilding doesn't seem like too bright of an idea at this moment.

    Curry Klay and the 7th for Granger and Collison is a little better I guess, but I don't know. I doubt GSW pulls the trigger anyway. Klay Thompson is good. That kid can score in bunches.

    I'd be down for Paul George and the 26th for Klay. I'd do that in the blink of an eye. If they want to throw in the 7th, even better. Highly unlikely though.

    I love you Larry

  21. #116
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Only Bird and Simon knows who are the guys he is going to keep stop pretending like you have some inside information, you are just speculating like everybody else, you like act like you are the only one that should be able to have an opinion around here, get off of that high horse.
    What inside information, its history and Birds own words. When has Bird ever made any crazy moves involving our best players? When has any winning GM done something like that?

    I don't get why this core players term is confusing you so much. Is it your blind hatred for Danny Granger that keeps you from seeing he's one of our top players?

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  23. #117
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    VNZLA Bird has said more then once DG wont be traded for reasons of loyalty, something that also binds people to a team, now i know it is something totally stange to you, seeing as you are trading our roster on a regular base, but there are also people who think the same way in ways of loyalty.

    I for one am with Peck, no need to trade granger, get a better player alongside him and until PG has proven he is better then DG it is not even in the discussion that he is hindered by position or not, DG got the same minutes and was a far better platyer at the ned of year 2

    It is the continuous beating of a totally dead horse you are doing that gets on people's nerve; we know how you think about granger, for the sake of humanity i ask you friendly to drop the stick and concentrate on another trick.
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

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  25. #118
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Yeah like Bird is going to tell people who he is going to keep and are the "core players" I remember when Rush was part of that core, or Mcbob or Jarret Jack........
    They were part of the foundation for building. Granger is and always has been part of the core.

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  27. #119
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Yes, we were 5th in the league this year... but this is the last year in a long time we will be able to go after free agents, and we could do a lot better than 5th. If that is a possibility, then I say you have to take it. What's the point in standing pat and trying to stay in the top 5 with the core we have now instead of giving ourselves a chance at being even greater.

    Also, I would much rather get rid of danny than paul. Paul's defense is huge in our scheme, and this team will not progress much further with Danny as the captain. We need a new captain. Whether that means trading Danny, or someone stepping up that is already on the team. He's a decent leader and a decent player, but without a new leader we will always be around 5th instead of around 1st.

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  29. #120
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by able View Post
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    VNZLA Bird has said more then once DG wont be traded for reasons of loyalty, something that also binds people to a team, now i know it is something totally stange to you, seeing as you are trading our roster on a regular base, but there are also people who think the same way in ways of loyalty.

    I for one am with Peck, no need to trade granger, get a better player alongside him and until PG has proven he is better then DG it is not even in the discussion that he is hindered by position or not, DG got the same minutes and was a far better platyer at the ned of year 2

    It is the continuous beating of a totally dead horse you are doing that gets on people's nerve; we know how you think about granger, for the sake of humanity i ask you friendly to drop the stick and concentrate on another trick.
    Larry said that in the past, before this season ended, again show me some prove that he is still thinking the same thing.

    I also think is funny that they guy who beast the "Tyler Hansbroug horse" or the "Larry Bird sucks horse" non stop is the one telling me to stop beating a dead horse.

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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    They were part of the foundation for building. Granger is and always has been part of the core.
    And you know that because?......

  31. #122
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    everybody here knows my position on tyler hansbrough (nice 10th man of the bench but not near worthy of his pick) and Bird (he's a Celtic and made a hell of a lot more mistakes than ppl give him credit for) but you don't see me posting that to the tune of 100 time a day like you do with Granger, on top if which i have a solid reasoning and foundation for my pet-peeves unlike your granger sucks motto for ife.

    Please don't even consider my peeves in the same class as your hatreds.
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

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  32. #123
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Larry said that in the past, before this season ended, again show me some prove that he is still thinking the same thing.

    I also think is funny that they guy who beast the "Tyler Hansbroug horse" or the "Larry Bird sucks horse" non stop is the one telling me to stop beating a dead horse.
    He could have said it yesterday and you would say, "How do we know he is still thinking that today?"

    Reason and logic, and words from the people in charge don't mean much to you when you have an opinion do they? That's why most of us think of you as a negative poster.

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  34. #124
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Larry said that in the past, before this season ended, again show me some prove that he is still thinking the same thing.
    Show me where he said he changed his mind, since his last state of mind known to us was the one where he said he would not trade, and YOU are suggesting he HAS changed his mind, the proof of the pudding is in YOUR sauce not mine
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

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    Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!


  35. #125
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    Default Re: Golden State targeting Danny Granger and other small forwards

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    And you know that because?......
    its ****ing obvious. if you can't see that, well not sure how to explain it to you.

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