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Thread: Bird press conference

  1. #26
    Flipped Off The Refs Larry Staverman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    That sounds to me that the Pacers will offer Roy a 5 year non-max deal, say 5 year $60-65m, as opposed to the 4 year $58m max he can get from another team. Would Roy go for the security of an extra year?

    Actually the max this year will be 5 yrs @ $78.6 million or 4 yrs @ $60.7 million from the Pacers
    or 4 yrs @ 58.5 from another team

    I think they have a ceiling and don't plan to go above it. Roy may very well have a choice to make

  2. #27
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    He didn't do either. They had both cap space and open roster spots. Signing Fez in the middle of the season should make that pretty clear.
    Money and a roster spot are not the only resources the Pacers wasted on Foster. He also used up potential minutes that could have been used to entice a legitimate player before the season started, rather than some last resort late in the year.

    There is no way that re-signing Foster can be considered anything but a blunder. It was foolish when it happened, and that did not change in hindsight.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I really like Bird the person but he sounds to me like he is to in love with his own players to make anything happen(Lance, Tyler, DC, Hill, Pendergraph, Danny) now it looks like he wants to show the world that Pendergraph is better than people think.

    I also don't understand his obsession in having the best bench ever, why not try to have the best starters possible and worry about the bench later?
    IMHO....the next best way to improve the Team is to have the deepest bench that you can have to wear down the opposing Team.

    The problem wasn't with our Starters in the Heat/Pacers series....it ( obviously ) was the 2nd unit. I think that we could have done much better against the Heat if we had a much better 2nd Unit that could come in, produce on both ends of the court....or at the very least, not lose any leads or make any deficit worse than it is.... and actually allow us to be competitive.

    I'm not saying that improving the Starting lineup isn't a start.....getting a new Starting PG would make a world of difference....I'm just saying that having a deep bench to go to that can help the Team for the entire game....is as important.
    Last edited by CableKC; 05-30-2012 at 01:02 PM.
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  5. #29
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    I love Larry Bird, but this damn no RFA rule that Simon has really pisses me off.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    If you can't beat a Team with Superstars ( something that we won't be able to do in the near future ), then the next best way to do it is to have the deepest bench that you can have to wear down the opposing Team.

    IMHO....the problem wasn't with our Starters in the Heat/Pacers series....it ( obviously ) was the 2nd unit. I think that we could have done much better against the Heat if we had a much better 2nd Unit that can come in, produce on both ends of the court and actually allow us to be competitive.
    The problem was our starters Danny jacking up shots and getting loss on D, Hill not playing well, Roy playing scare, West disappearing and Paul George turning the ball over and not hitting shots, those problems are bigger than anything a bench player did or didn't do.

  8. #31
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by croz24 View Post
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    Jalen was the best player my ***. Jalen hurt us as much, if not more than he helped us.
    Far be it from me to defend Jalen, but I think you're letting how things ended cloud your memory of that season. Reggie stepped it up in the playoffs, as always, but Jalen was pretty dang good on both ends of the floor that year.

    Besides, I think Larry's talking about talent in this instance. Jalen without question had the most pure basketball talent of anyone, he just never had the head to put it all together. Don't know if that's the best aspiration for Lance, but shoot, if he could show a quarter of Jalen's production I'd be happy.
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    Money and a roster spot are not the only resources the Pacers wasted on Foster. He also used up potential minutes that could have been used to entice a legitimate player before the season started, rather than some last resort late in the year.
    There were still roster spots open, meaning there were still minutes available to anyone that could have been signed. He didn't waste up any potential minutes, because they still had plenty of unused minutes available.

    The blunder is not signing someone else at the beginning of the season, not re-signing Foster.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    There were still roster spots open, meaning there were still minutes available to anyone that could have been signed. He didn't waste up any potential minutes, because they still had plenty of unused minutes available.

    The blunder is not signing someone else at the beginning of the season, not re-signing Foster.
    The only reason they felt they didn't have to sign someone else, was because they re-signed Foster. Blunder.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    The problem was our starters Danny jacking up shots and getting loss on D, Hill not playing well, Roy playing scare, West disappearing and Paul George turning the ball over and not hitting shots, those problems are bigger than anything a bench player did or didn't do.
    And yet with all those problems the starters routinely outscored the Heat when they were on the floor.
    Do you not remember your complaints when I used +/- from the series?

    Going into game 6, the starters all had positive numbers the bench had negative numbers. You win with postive numbers, you lose with negative numbers. The starters problem is that they didn't outscore the Heat enough to compensate for the bench.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    The only reason they felt they didn't have to sign someone else, was because they re-signed Foster. Blunder.
    So that's why they traded Rush to get more big man help, because they put all their faith into Foster playing through the year. Makes sense.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    So that's why they traded Rush to get more big man help, because they put all their faith into Foster playing through the year. Makes sense.
    That was never the main reason they traded Brandon Rush. Ever.

  16. #37

    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Other than a possible I'm retiring declaration, no info of any consequence ever comes from a Bird presser. Anyone who thinks Bird is going to open up n spill are in for a great disappointment. Bird basically said nothing.

    Disappointed with the bench in the playoffs.
    Barbosa wasn't real productive during the playoffs.
    JP is better than many people realize.
    RFA are off limits from Herb.
    Core needs to get better.

    ALL REAL NEWS FLASHES!!!

    If Bird didn't see what others saw in the playoffs and doesn't go about remeding those things, I'll be extremely disappointed.

    He surely realizes to take the next step the following has to happen:

    A better stronger bench.
    A realistic b/u Center.
    Hansbrough isn't the b/u PF of the future.
    Barbosa isn't the off the bench scorer this team needs.
    A true PG. Not a combo guard masking as a PG, or a small PG with poor "D" who can't get his fellow players involved in the game.

    With this being said I believe Bird realizes this and will move to correct a good part of this. I appreciated Bird's comment last off season about what the Pacers needs were... scorer and PF. He got West and took a chance on Barbosa. Bird addressed missing Foster, especially in the playoffs. I just wish Bird had better anticipated Foster's health issues. He took a gamble and lost. Hopefully, he learns from his mistakes.

    "I really am looking forward to watching how Bird improves this team for next year." I just don't agree at #26 the Pacers are going to get a good player. The chances of getting an Ibaka or Gibson isn't very realistic. I'd rather package that pick and move up in the draft to acquire a player who can be part of the core, or trade out of the draft for an established player or future assets.

    It will be an interesting off season. I just hope it plays out well for the Pacers!

  17. #38
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    It's great to see that Larry Bird is hinting towards coming back.

    Also, an interesting take on Barbosa. I, for one, wouldn't mind seeing him back at a highly reduced price. Yes, he had a bad series, but guarding Wade will have that effect on people. Maybe we can reunite him with his old Phoenix buddy Nash?

    Also, I don't think it's fair to play Monday Morning Quarterback and say the re-signing of Jeff Foster was a mistake. At the time, it clearly wasn't. Even with his balky back, the Pacers were likely saving Foster for the playoffs where we could've sorely used him, and it's not like there weren't a handful of suitors aiming for his services.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    That was never the main reason they traded Brandon Rush. Ever.
    For a big man, not a guard. The Pacers acquired 5 new players from the season prior. 3 of them were big men. If you're saying that they put all their eggs in the Foster basket, then why was the majority of players they acquired players who played the same position as Foster?

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    And yet with all those problems the starters routinely outscored the Heat when they were on the floor.
    Do you not remember your complaints when I used +/- from the series?

    Going into game 6, the starters all had positive numbers the bench had negative numbers. You win with postive numbers, you lose with negative numbers. The starters problem is that they didn't outscore the Heat enough to compensate for the bench.
    Or that Miami was playing Lebron and Dwade full time, please tell me what bench is going to have a net positive against those two guys? I'll be here waiting for the answer............

  20. #41
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    The problem was our starters Danny jacking up shots and getting loss on D, Hill not playing well, Roy playing scare, West disappearing and Paul George turning the ball over and not hitting shots, those problems are bigger than anything a bench player did or didn't do.
    So what is your solution then?

    Blow the entire Team up since the Starters were the problem?

    I recognize that there were times that the Starters weren't playing up to par throughout the series.....but I don't see how you don't recognize the very opposite throughout the series when they were the only ones keeping us in games. I was scared to death when Hibbert and West left the floor and we had to rely on Hansbrough and Amundson to defend the paint.....or when PG or Granger wasn't manning the SF spot cuz Barbosa was left to guard either Wade or LeDecision.

    At the very least....I can agree that the only spot in the rotation that we can improve upon is the Starting PG spot while pushing GH back to the bench as the Starting PG.....but how else are we going to improve in the Starting lineup. Are we going to get a better SG, SF, PF or Center than what we have now?

    I agree that a Starting PG that can properly run the offense will make a world of difference for the rest of the Starting Lineup.....but let's not dismiss that having a Deep Bench isn't as critical......our Starters can't play the vast majority of the game for an entire Season, much less an entire Series without getting worn down physically and mentally.
    Last edited by CableKC; 05-30-2012 at 01:42 PM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  21. #42
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    We could have any roster in this league and there would be people on here *****ing about it. I wouldn't necessarily mind, but it's the ones who seemingly do nothing but criticize or complain that gets so tiresome. Balance it out, at least. Assuming that's even possible.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    And yet with all those problems the starters routinely outscored the Heat when they were on the floor.
    Do you not remember your complaints when I used +/- from the series?

    Going into game 6, the starters all had positive numbers the bench had negative numbers. You win with postive numbers, you lose with negative numbers. The starters problem is that they didn't outscore the Heat enough to compensate for the bench.
    Do you, or if not does some one else, have the +/- stats from the 2011 Finals, in particular Dallas' starters versus their bench? I'd be curious to know.

  24. #44

    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Our starters weren't perfect, but they absolutely were not the problem in the Heat series. The starters gave us leads in every game in that series except the dismantling in Game 5. The problem was when we went to our bench we had Lou and Tyler offering nothing on defense, Barbosa driving to the rim crazily every time he saw the ball and no offense outside of that. Collison can't shot, Dahntay can't shoot, our bigs can't post up off the bench --- we had nothing to offer the other team except decent perimeter defense with Collison and Jones.

    We still need shot blocking off the bench, some sort of scoring off the bench, and a PG that can pass the damn ball.


    Count me in the boat that if Roy wants a max deal, you move on. You don't build a championship team offering average-good players max deals -- that's how you end up like the Hawks paying Joe Johnson a max.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    So what is your solution then?

    Blow the entire Team up since the Starters were the problem?

    I recognize that there were times that the Starters weren't playing up to par throughout the series.....but I don't see how you don't recognize the very opposite throughout the series when they were the only ones keeping us in games. I was scared to death when Hibbert and West left the floor and we had to rely on Hansbrough and Amundson to defend the paint.....or when PG or Granger wasn't manning the SF spot cuz Barbosa was left to guard either Wade or LeDecision.

    At the very least....I can agree that the only spot in the rotation that we can improve upon is the Starting PG spot while pushing GH back to the bench as the Starting PG.....but how else are we going to improve in the Starting lineup. Are we going to get a better SG, SF, PF or Center than what we have now?

    I agree that a Starting PG that can properly run the offense will make a world of difference for the rest of the Starting Lineup.....but let's not dismiss that having a Deep Bench isn't as critical......our Starters can't play the vast majority of the game for an entire Season, much less an entire Series without getting worn down physically and mentally.
    I'm not saying to blow the team up, but there is not doubt that our talent level needs to upgraded, and yes having a deep bench is a nice thing to have during the season but normally teams go 7 or 8 deep during the playoffs, so in reality you need to have 5 really good starters and 2 or 3 good to really good bench players.

    To me the easiest way to upgrade our bench is to upgrade our starters in the first place.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Or that Miami was playing Lebron and Dwade full time, please tell me what bench is going to have a net positive against those two guys? I'll be here waiting for the answer............
    That doesn't matter. You said that the starters were a bigger problem than the bench. Telling me why the bench was outscored doesn't change the fact that they were outscored.

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Do you, or if not does some one else, have the +/- stats from the 2011 Finals, in particular Dallas' starters versus their bench? I'd be curious to know.
    JJ Varea was the one guy killing Miami in the pick and roll, Varea and Terry(a free agent by the way).

  28. #48
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    That wouldn't be a .... bench player, would it?

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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    That doesn't matter. You said that the starters were a bigger problem than the bench. Telling me why the bench was outscored doesn't change the fact that they were outscored.
    You still didn't answer my question but is OK I'm used to you not answering anything.....

  31. #50
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    Default Re: Bird press conference

    And remember a better bench doesn't have to outscore Miami's starters. They just need to (ideally) hold serve, or if nothing else... lose LESS than this bench did while our starters rest, so it's not as difficult for the starters when they come back in.

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