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Thread: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

  1. #1

    Default Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    killers?

    Could it be that with the brawl still fresh in mind, our FO focused too hard on acquiring good character guys, while we all know that to be winner in this world you need to have a nasty side?
    Is it that why we miss Granger so much? Is it that why Hansbrough suddenly is our guy to carry us?
    Besides Tyler, David West and George Hill seem like the only guys with big enough balls.

    Roy, Paul, why don't they demand the ball more?
    Green, where is his confidence?
    DJ, Ian, where is the drive to show you have a place on this team?

    It is hard to dislike any of our players as persons, but I prefer a jerk who plays tough over a soft player that gangnams and has auditions for his own area.
    If u would ask fans of other teams which Pacer they hate, they would say Granger or West and yes even Tyler.
    Hibbert and George would hardly get any votes. I don't think that is a good sign.

    Before u say everyone likes Duncan. He has much more talent than Roy or Paul and with Manu "flop" Ginobili and Tony "cheating" Parker they do have some good players who don't mind drawing outside the lines and I wouldn't call Pop a saint either.

    Vogel seems like he has the balls but does he have enough insight?

    Thanks for reading.

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  3. #2
    Member adamscb's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    i'm sorry, but i don't want any killers on our team. strip club brawlers were bad enough.

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    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Can't say that I agree with any of this.

    We have David West, we have George Hill. We've fixed the team's softness problems.

    You don't have to be a jerk to lead a team. You do have to be mentally tough. We didn't have mental toughness two years ago and Bird went out and fixed it. We also didn't have mental toughness that last time we had a team full of loud mouthed, gun toting punks. They acted tough, but wilted under pressure. False bravado. I don't want any part of that.

    Now this team is currently missing its most talented player, and his return would help. Especially in the first three quarters (where he thrives) before the situation gets tough and then West and Hill get ready for the heavy lifting. Getting him healthy will help us more than getting a punk.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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  7. #4

    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    Can't say that I agree with any of this.

    We have David West, we have George Hill. We've fixed the team's softness problems.

    You don't have to be a jerk to lead a team. You do have to be mentally tough. We didn't have mental toughness two years ago and Bird went out and fixed it. We also didn't have mental toughness that last time we had a team full of loud mouthed, gun toting punks. They acted tough, but wilted under pressure. False bravado. I don't want any part of that.

    Now this team is currently missing its most talented player, and his return would help. Especially in the first three quarters (where he thrives) before the situation gets tough and then West and Hill get ready for the heavy lifting. Getting him healthy will help us more than getting a punk.
    It's a thin line really. Mentally tough people are often viewed as jerks, especially in competitive settings.

    Can't say I disagree with anything u said. You didn't mention Roy (our highest paid player) or Paul (our most talented player), who I think need to be mentally tough more than anyone else on this team.

    I think it's time to put the ghosts of the past behind us and be careful with "nice" guys just as much as with the so called punks. On the court, they need to be able to turn into something more evil, like the humble Derrick Rose and his crying for fouls.

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  9. #5
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    Can't say that I agree with any of this.

    We have David West, we have George Hill. We've fixed the team's softness problems.

    You don't have to be a jerk to lead a team. You do have to be mentally tough. We didn't have mental toughness two years ago and Bird went out and fixed it. We also didn't have mental toughness that last time we had a team full of loud mouthed, gun toting punks. They acted tough, but wilted under pressure. False bravado. I don't want any part of that.

    Now this team is currently missing its most talented player, and his return would help. Especially in the first three quarters (where he thrives) before the situation gets tough and then West and Hill get ready for the heavy lifting. Getting him healthy will help us more than getting a punk.
    I'm just glad to see you coming to grips with the fact that Danny Granger is the best player on our team & has been since his rookie year.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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  11. #6

    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Team has too many good players and no great players. Quality is always more important than quantity in the NBA.

  12. #7
    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Not having Danny Granger is the problem. All these other theories seem to conveniently leave that out of the equation. There is a reason that every basketball mind says that the Pacers best player is Danny Granger. That reason is because he is!

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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    I'm just glad to see you coming to grips with the fact that Danny Granger is the best player on our team & has been since his rookie year.
    I don't think Danny Granger is the best player on the team. I think he used to be that but Hibbert has taken over that roll.....

  15. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by OlBlu View Post
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    I don't think Danny Granger is the best player on the team. I think he used to be that but Hibbert has taken over that roll.....
    Well you can think that all you want, but it's not true. Granger is the best player on this team and Idk how anyone can question it after this start and he will likely continue to be until Paul takes over or we move him.

  16. #10

    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    If DG is the teams best player then we are screwed with the contract Roy just signed.

  17. #11

    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    We had two killers in DC and Dahntay. Two guys you could be confident to come in and be solid. Now we have Gerald Green and Augustine.
    "We've got to be very clear about this. We don't want our players hanging around with murderers," said Larry Bird, Pacers president.

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    Member Ace E.Anderson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Quote Originally Posted by rock747 View Post
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    We had two killers in DC and Dahntay. Two guys you could be confident to come in and be solid. Now we have Gerald Green and Augustine.
    Green?

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  20. #13
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    Quote Originally Posted by MvPlumlee View Post
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    It's a thin line really. Mentally tough people are often viewed as jerks, especially in competitive settings.
    I think that describes Hill and West.

    Can't say I disagree with anything u said. You didn't mention Roy (our highest paid player) or Paul (our most talented player), who I think need to be mentally tough more than anyone else on this team.
    Agree with you on Roy. If Roy had Zo's killer instincts alongside Patrick's skill set, he'd be the best Georgetown C of all time. But he doesn't. He's a very skilled C and those are rare enough that it commands a salary premium. You've got to separate the salary from the player when talking about centers, including Roy. He certainly needs to play better than he has over four games. But as a C, he's also depending on the little guys getting him the ball at the right time and the right spot, and that isn't happening yet.

    Don't agree with you on Paul George. He's raw and has upside, but he's not our most taleneted player. He's our fifth most talented starter (when Danny is healthy).

    = = = = = = =

    In other words, I do agree with you that this team historically has had a mental toughness problem. Looking at the Bulls playoff series, we had a talented team that could hang with them until mental toughness was required. Bird didn't think he could fix the mental toughness challenges of the individual players - Danny, Darren, Roy, Paul, McBob, so we went out and imported guys with proven mental toughness. I think that's probably going to continue. It would be nice if those guys - especially Danny and Roy - gained some toughness. But that's unlikely, and this is a team game. I don't think its coincidence that in all three close games (last night doesn't count), the two players involved with all the plays at crunch time are David and George. That won't really change when Danny returns. What will change is the nature of the game leading up to that point.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  21. #14
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    Default Re: Do we have too many good guys and not enough

    I'm not going to question this team's toughness after seeing their performance last year.

    I think too many people are panicking FOUR games into the regular season! It takes EVERY team at least ten games to gel.

    Seeing some ridiculous things like we need "killers" is complete malarkey to me. We have a very good team. Just be patient.

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