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Thread: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

  1. #301

    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Grigson is VERY excited about getting T.Y. Hilton.
    video link

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Stupid. Take Hill/Upshaw/Glenn in the 2nd and Allen in the 3rd if that's your idea. Missed on some huge, huge value picks.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Like many of you, I don't quite know what to make out of this draft. It really caught me off guard with picks 3 and 4. Most of the analysts think that they've picked very well so far and that centering on Andrew Luck is the right call for now.

    Pros:

    + We can now run very solid dual TE sets
    + Luck will hopefully be more comfortable coming to Indy with his best receiving target from college. Chemistry is already there.
    + For the first time in forever we have someone that can return punts/kicks effectively
    + We have a valid deep threat/slot guy.

    Cons:

    - No secondary what so ever (We are going to be playing catch up all season)
    - Nose tackle?
    - O-line still has some kinks.


    O-line is simply going to have to wait till next year's draft. Hopefully we grab some CBs. As for the huge nose tackle we need for 3-4? Alemada? He could easily go in the 4th. We'll see what happens. It will be fun to watch the offensive unit develop next year. It will be painful though to watch the defense struggle as usual...

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Nic Jean Baptiste for NT pls

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    I don't really follow college ball so I'm not familiar at all with Hilton, but reading some other teams' and nuetral message boards everyone else seems to love the Hilton pick.

    A lot of fans seem to be upset their team didn't pick him up, and even more upset that he is going to be paired with Luck.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Our offense will improve and our defense will suck again but that's mean we
    Can draft the best defensive player next year

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Our offense will improve and our defense will suck again but that's mean we
    Can draft the best defensive player next year

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    My guess is the front office knows they aren't going to be very good next year. They wanted to show how deeply committed they are to getting Luck weapons, so he and the offense can hopefully score some points. It wouldn't shock me if next year we elected to receive kickoffs and aggressively tried to score early so we could "play from ahead." The defense sucks but we still have Freeney and Mathis, and they can still get to the quarterback, system be damned. The system will be more of a hybrid this first year anyway. If we can get early leads (again, probably a long shot, but not totally out there), we can sick Freeney and Mathis on the opposing QB when he drops back and make life hell on them. Same thing we did with Peyton. We have one veteran QB in our division (Schaub). Gabbert sucks and Locker is unproven. We can eek out some wins there. I haven't perused the rest of our schedule, but we finished in last place so we will play a lot of bad/mediocre teams. The front office has a blueprint of what they want to do for this year and in the future. You can nitpick the draft choices but I like the direction they are taking this thing.

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  12. #309
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    I also think the front office knows they won't be terribly good. Plus, they probably want another year of high picks to really help set up the team long term.

    I'm still hoping they grab a large receiver though. Marvin Jones/Greg Childs. Someone else that offers a deep threat to compliment our 2 TEs and Wayne, but also gives us another threat in the red zone. That will make us very deadly. A tall fast reciever, 2 really good TEs and Wayne. Not to mention our slot receivers.

    Almost there with the offensive weapons. O-Line help would still be nice.

    Defense needs a S, CB, LB, NT....just so many holes. I guess we can only hope that Thomas and Rucker step up. I still think Rucker should be moved to SS. I think he'd excel there.
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessen View Post
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    O-line is simply going to have to wait till next year's draft. Hopefully we grab some CBs. As for the huge nose tackle we need for 3-4? Alemada? He could easily go in the 4th. We'll see what happens. It will be fun to watch the offensive unit develop next year. It will be painful though to watch the defense struggle as usual...
    The o-line was addressed in the draft last year with Castonzo and Ijalana. Grigson made several moves to acquire additional lineman in Satele, McGlynn, and Justice. He clearly doesn't think the line is an area that needs to be addressed in the draft, at least not in the first three rounds.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Also, why would the Colts trade up for TY, when they just signed FA Donnie Avery, who's essentially the same player. A super fast, but undersized WR.
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierguy View Post
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    The o-line was addressed in the draft last year with Castonzo and Ijalana. Grigson made several moves to acquire additional lineman in Satele, McGlynn, and Justice. He clearly doesn't think the line is an area that needs to be addressed in the draft, at least not in the first three rounds.
    Those FA are piecework. Not much of an upgrade at all to what we had last year. I'd feel infinitely more comfortable creating an O-Line that's sure to protect Luck for years to come. Hope all those guys step up and improve over last season.
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparhawk View Post
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    Also, why would the Colts trade up for TY, when they just signed FA Donnie Avery, who's essentially the same player. A super fast, but undersized WR.
    Isn't Avery pretty injury prone? I think he is just a short term patch anyway.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparhawk View Post
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    Those FA are piecework. Not much of an upgrade at all to what we had last year. I'd feel infinitely more comfortable creating an O-Line that's sure to protect Luck for years to come. Hope all those guys step up and improve over last season.
    That will be a key and perhaps more free agents will be brought in. Some improvement could come from just getting healthy. It would be a waste to make all of these moves and getting Luck and have him at risk behind a make shift OL. I like this draft. Some will complain about taking two TE but that was definitely a need and we got the best two in the draft and didn't have to reach to take them. This is going to be a long slow process to get back to being competitive and one draft won't fill all of the holes. It will take years and I wonder how many fans will be that patient. They were not that patient with the Pacers and they never dropped to the depths the Colts have.......

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft...ons-rounds-2-3

    Mel Kiper seemed to like our second day choices:

    Three I liked

    Baltimore Ravens
    The picks: OLB Courtney Upshaw at No. 35, G Kelechi Osemele at No. 60, RB Bernard Pierce at No. 84
    Summary: The Ravens moved out of the first round but still managed to get a first-round player at No. 35 overall. Upshaw will seal the edge as a 3-4 outside linebacker in this system, and can immediately step in and fill the role vacated by Jarret Johnson, himself a former member of the Crimson Tide. Osemele isn't a remarkable value by any means, but he can move inside to guard after playing tackle in college, and guard is a big need. The Ravens also could use help at running back to take some heat off Ray Rice. They get pieces like they didn't skip the first round. Solid day.


    Indianapolis Colts
    The picks: TE Coby Fleener at No. 34, TE Dwayne Allen at No. 64, WR T.Y. Hilton at No. 92
    Summary: Hey, I'm sure I'll make some comment along the way that this defense really needs some help. But give the Colts some credit -- they've made it clear the No. 1 priority of the organization is to make Andrew Luck comfortable, to give him a chance to succeed early. He loves to use tight ends. Well, the Colts now have the two best tight ends in the draft, two guys who offer different looks. The Colts lack explosiveness at wide receiver. Hilton could work in the slot and be a tough cover. Yep, they need defense, but they've made a commitment to Luck beyond simply handing him the keys, and you can't blame them.

    St. Louis Rams
    The picks: WR Brian Quick at No. 33, CB Janoris Jenkins at No. 39, Isaiah Pead at No. 50, CB Trumaine Johnson at No. 65
    Summary: The Rams really needed to show something Friday. This is a team that once held the No. 2 pick in the draft, and as Jon Gruden noted, if you have the No. 2 pick and don't use it, you need to show something for not taking what you assume can be a star-level player. Well, I really like Quick and have been pushing his name for a while. Jenkins we know is a risk in some respects, but this is a top-10-level pick if it's talent alone we're talking about. If Pead had been the last pick in the first round, I wouldn't have been bothered at all. I like that pick. Johnson has a lot of talent to be there at No. 65. I like the haul for the Rams. And yes, having four picks helps.

    Notables: Tampa Bay gets one of my favorite players in the draft with Lavonte David -- and at No. 57! Worry all you want about his size; that's a pretty great value in my opinion, and he's a need fit. Huge couple of days for the Bucs. They're drafting starters. ... I thought Ryan Broyles to Detroit might have been a slight luxury pick, but he could be a total steal for value, and it looked better when the Lions got Dwight Bentley in the third round. Bentley is a corner and fills a big need; like the value. ... The Chargers also locked in a ton of value getting Kendall Reyes and Brandon Taylor. That's D-line and safety help. ... The Eagles got a perfect fit for that team in Mychal Kendricks; he can step in next to DeMeco Ryans. With those two and Fletcher Cox around, you feel better about Philly up the middle. No surprise Andy Reid added another QB, either. Nick Foles has starter potential. ... Cordy Glenn at No. 41 is a really nice get for Buffalo, and the Bills added some depth at wide receiver later on. ... Green Bay has to feel better about its defense after two days. Jerel Worthy is a good value at No. 51 overall. ... I called LaMichael James an "accent piece" in San Francisco. The 49ers have given Alex Smith weapons. Now it's Smith's turn.

    Three question marks

    Seattle Seahawks
    The picks: LB Bobby Wagner at No. 47, QB Russell Wilson at No. 75
    Summary: I'm not questioning Seattle's instincts or plan for the players it is taking. And I know some don't like the whole value discussion, but in two days, the Seahawks have taken three players -- each of whom I had lower on my board. That doesn't mean these guys won't succeed (Wagner certainly fits); it means if the Seahawks could move around the board a little more, I think they could still get their guys and perhaps add one or two more picks. John Schneider and Pete Carroll know what they are doing, but I have to evaluate on where I have players ranked. The Seahawks now have three guys I believe they could have gotten lower.

    New England Patriots
    The picks: S Tavon Wilson at No. 48, DE Jake Bequette at No. 90
    Summary: The Patriots actually filled some needs. And I think Bequette will be a solid player for them. His versatility is there, and I can see him as a stand-up pass-rusher. Wilson puzzles me a little on value. A month ago, when I released my draft guide, Wilson was the No. 26-ranked safety on my board. I know some coaches like him, but this is a player both I and colleague Todd McShay think could have been sitting there in the sixth round. These picks fit needs, but both are definite reaches to me.

    Jacksonville Jaguars
    The picks: DE Andre Branch at No. 38, P Bryan Anger at No. 70
    Summary: I don't mind the pick of Branch, but what are the Jags doing drafting a punter so early? There are a lot of useful players available -- wide receivers to add depth, another pass-rusher, help on the offensive line or at cornerback (where the team was decimated last season). If Anger isn't some kind of superstar at punter (he is No. 1 among my punters), the value is just a little absurd for me.

    Notables: Chicago got a wideout it can use in Alshon Jeffery, but I just don't have the faith in the Bears' offensive line they seem to, and in three rounds, they didn't get one piece up front. ... A little surprised Carolina hasn't taken a defensive tackle yet. ... The Jets added a receiver, but I think Stephen Hill has some serious developmental work to do. Can they wait on him?

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    I thought the Colts had a solid draft. Fleener may be a TE but he will be able to kick out wide occasionally because of his deep speed. Dwayne Allen was a stud at Clemson and while he isn't as explosive as Fleener, he's a better true tight end (blocking and using his body to box out defenders for catches). I don't know much about Hilton, but it turns into a crapshoot after the 2nd round a lot of the time anyways. I think the Colts would do very well if they nabbed Brandon Boykin from Georgia today. Had he not broken his leg in the senior bowl, he would have been a 2nd rounder. The guy can return kickoffs, punts, and is an excellent cover corner. He reminded me a lot of Antoine Winfield.

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    Last edited by Moses; 04-28-2012 at 10:36 AM.

  21. #317

    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparhawk View Post
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    Also, why would the Colts trade up for TY, when they just signed FA Donnie Avery, who's essentially the same player. A super fast, but undersized WR.
    You can't look at size and 40ty time and conclude they are the same player.

    Ty is much more of elusive runner and his ability to return kicks and punts far exceeds Donnie Avery's.

    Here are their college stats.

    TY
    Career Receiving: 229 Rec, 3531 Yds, 15.4 Avg, 24 TD
    Career Kick Returns: 105 Ret, 2855 Yds, 27.2 Avg, 4 TD
    Career Punt Returns: 49 Ret, 614 yds, 12.5 avg, 2 Td
    Career Passing: 2 Cmp, 2 Att, 38 Yds, 1 TD
    Career Scoring: 37 TD, 222 Pts

    Avery
    Career Receiving: 210 Rec, 3289 Yds, 15.7 Avg, 19 TD
    Career Kick Returns: 40 Ret, 896 Yds, 22.4 Avg, 1 TD
    Career Scoring: 20 TD, 120 Pts

    Also Ty rushed the ball for 7 tds in 4 years.

    I really believe Grigson was going for a DeSean Jackson type that could be game changer in the return game.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 04-28-2012 at 11:35 AM.

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  23. #318
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    You can't look at size and 40ty time and conclude they are the same player.

    Ty is much more of elusive runner and his ability to return kicks and punts far exceeds Donnie Avery's.

    Here are their college stats.

    TY
    Career Receiving: 229 Rec, 3531 Yds, 15.4 Avg, 24 TD
    Career Kick Returns: 105 Ret, 2855 Yds, 27.2 Avg, 4 TD
    Career Punt Returns: 49 Ret, 614 yds, 12.5 avg, 2 Td
    Career Passing: 2 Cmp, 2 Att, 38 Yds, 1 TD
    Career Scoring: 37 TD, 222 Pts

    Avery
    Career Receiving: 210 Rec, 3289 Yds, 15.7 Avg, 19 TD
    Career Kick Returns: 40 Ret, 896 Yds, 22.4 Avg, 1 TD
    Career Scoring: 20 TD, 120 Pts

    Also Ty rushed the ball for 7 tds in 4 years.

    I really believe Grigson was going for a DeSean Jackson type that could be game changer in the return game.
    Also T.Y. would be a solid 3rd string QB as well.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    we shoulda drafted a long snapper to back up Snow.

  25. #320

    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Today's paper said Fleener had back surgery after his sophomore year and missed all but 5 games his senior year due to back problems. I hope this is something the FO really checked out.

  26. #321

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coupe View Post
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    we shoulda drafted a long snapper to back up Snow.
    Between you and Olblue I get tired of explaining our roster.. I kid I kid..

    Matt Overton was signed from the Seahawks to be a backup long snapper. Grigson knows him because he scouted him in the UFL.

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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Still can't believe the Jags wasted a 3rd rounder on a P. LOL
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  28. #323

    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by speakout4 View Post
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    Today's paper said Fleener had back surgery after his sophomore year and missed all but 5 games his senior year due to back problems. I hope this is something the FO really checked out.
    Huh?

    Fleener played 13 games in 2011 or are you talking about highschool?

  29. #324

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    Huh?

    Fleener played 13 games in 2011 or are you talking about highschool?
    Correction: "Limited to five starts as a senior with back issues.Underwent back surgery after sophomore season". On page 5 of Star top of page.

  30. #325
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    Default Re: 2012 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

    Fleener played in every game last year. So... not sure if he "started", but he had significant playing time.

    Griff Whalen was Luck's favorite target "between the 20s", and Fleener was his favorite red-zone target. Fleener had 10 of Luck's touchdowns, the next highest receiver was their other TE at 4. He clearly favors TEs in the redzone, making the selection of Allen a pretty smart choice, it would appear.

    I do love that we have some redzone targets.... Fleener specifically is a "go up and get it" guy in the end zone.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 04-28-2012 at 12:42 PM.
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