I actually met some really nice bulls fans that were actually from Chicago that sat in front of me.. Had some nice discussions here and there.. They were very respectful and friendly which is all you can ask from an opposing fan! I was impressed. Was sure to wish them a safe trip back to chicago.
If Turkoglu plays, I would think he would start even if he's held to limited minutes for conditioning purposes. So Reddick would play a decent chunk of his minutes with the reserve unit, and the chase-around responsibility would fall to Barbosa or Jones if Barbosa sits out. If he's killing us, maybe in the third or fourth quarter Vogel puts PG on Nelson and has Hill chase him around. Hill seems to do a damn good job defensively whether he's on the ball or off.
What was up with the Hulk sighting (David Harrison)? Does he still live in Indy? Too bad they didn't get an interview with him that would have been interesting.
I think Bird should resign Lance just because of his improvement on the defense and attitude.
I do not expect Lance to shoot like he did last night, every night. Scorers do not find it hard to score, they find it hard to score consistently and score when their shot is not falling (going to the foul line).
I think that if Lance goes back with fg%/3pt% at 42/33, I would be happy. He could easily replace the scoring of Barbosa. But we need a 3pter in the second unit to stretch the defense. Jones has been good, but ideally DC needs to be a volume 3pt shooter. Or he needs to leave.
Effort wasn't bad, but I thought Lance was not so good defensively on Korver. Not an easy cover, but Korver definitely got it going on Lance. I also thought Rip missed a good number of open shots.
I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.
Don't get me wrong, I liked his effort on defense regardless of how well he worked the system (hard to be certain) and I couldn't ask much more than to have him draining shots last night. But let's not let one moment of HOT SHOOTING replace the other 95% of the game. He wasn't destroying all aspects across the board, he's still got a ways to go.
But it's a start.
The Bulls were hot (well, Boozer and Korver just couldn't miss), but the Pacers got their a****s handed to them ala the Spurs. I mean the games were identical. Both SAS and CHI kept the Pacers at a safe distance the entire time and both teams showed plays that just go deeper and deeper until they find their shot.
The Pacers would cover the first 5 stages of a Bulls play well, switching, rotating and closing out, and yet there was always another progression in the play for the Bulls to go to....just like the Spurs.
Last night showed why Pop and Tibs are better coaches than Vogel and better COY candidates. Frank has been a great rah-rah guy and a good basic plan of attack/consistancy guy, and this allows the guys to excel.
But Frank, Shaw, et al need to expand the plays next season and the players need to step up and match that need by proving they can execute a more sophisticated playbook. At least if they want to compete for a title.
As sunshiner as I've been, last night was cold water in my face specifically because it was so identical to the SAS game. Teams like Miami and OKC are vulnerable to the Pacers because they often break their systems and just go to 2 star players to do all the creating. I think the Pacers play good enough defense to cope with that.
And in a sense it's dumb to be too upset that the Pacers aren't CHI or SAS given their standing in the league, but my concern is that the Pacers are in the same mold as those teams (ie, TEAM oriented structure) and are clearly the junior version. Not because of raw talent but because of the lesser complexity and quality of what they do as a group.
The Bulls and Spurs just don't show many chinks in the SYSTEM armor. This is why the Bulls survived Rose and the Spurs move on as they get older. And they showed that they are much better teams, 7 wins out of 10 meetings type of better.
I have a small concern that with Dwight out and Hedo back that the Magic will return to running a true system themselves and be more dangerous, not less.
So why was David Harrison sitting about 10 feet away from me?
You know my feelings on this, and your reasoning is one of many that formed that opinion in my head.
Classic example of another issue, Lou was able to defend one layup (maybe got the block, I forget) and was able to go right back up with a quick 2nd vert to keep the rebound away from the Bulls (who had a shot at it).
It's that dual skill of both the high vertical near the rim paired with a quick repeat vert that makes Lou very valuable and kills Tyler because he lacks it. Classic Foster was like Lou, and in fact Jeff was one of the quickest verts off the floor I've ever seen. Bigs need to be able to get up above the rim and then go right back up almost as high quickly.
They also need to have post moves that don't involve a refs whistle (esp. in the playoffs).
Below the shoulders Tyler chases down the ball like nobody's business, but IMO that's just not enough for the NBA. You have to be able to bulldog for rebounds at rim level too.
To be fair West isn't exactly "hoppy" himself, but he's got one of the nicest sets of low post moves in the game and is a pretty sharp/smart passer.
If there were 4-5 games left I'd really want to see more Pendy/Lou in place of Tyler. If for no other reason than to explore that option and find their limits as a pair.
But on offense Lance gave you about the same shooting that Danny would have so that end didn't feel like a massive hole was there in a what could have been sense, and that concerned me given the output.
I mean LB hasn't been shooting it well himself and the bench scoring issues continued yet again. With DC coming off the bench and struggling (apart from 3 early jumpers) the bench offense looks like a train wreck lately.
They are kinda trying to figure out what they can do off of Lou's play, an option that nobody originally thought would be there, but in doing so I think they've asked a bit too much of him and he's struggled.
It wasn't for confidence. It was because Frank was keeping the same guys together as much as possible and just replacing the missing pieces with deep bench guys. He did the same thing Monday night.
Lance did well with the moment but don't look too deeply into the reasoning. It was a basic tactical decision based not on Lance but on the other guys who he wanted to keep on the same page and in the same roles.
I mean there is no debating that DC off the bench is still a work in progress. Hopefully due to injury but possibly not (I'm starting to think).
"Freedom is nothing else but a chance to be better." - Albert Camus
"Appreciation is a wonderful thing. It makes what is excellent in others belong to us as well." - Voltaire
Michael Pina, Red94: "There are so many different ways the Pacers can beat you. They have an All-Star scoring threat, imposing figures on the front line, steady point guard play, and most importantly, a defense that'll choke the life out of just about every offense that crosses its path."
Frank had to go with simple though. No real preseason and no real time for practice.
It's also a different game with Barbosa and Granger playing. On defense and offense.
We can beat those teams in a 7 game series. We're just unlikely to. That's how it's always been.
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I said it in the "Hill Is Keeping the Starting Job thread". DC's already shakey confidence was shook too much by losing his starting position. His poor play off the bench is not due to the injury or rust, he only missed what? 6-7 games I think? No his problem now is he has no confidence in himself.
I was not as critical as DC as others here, I thought he showed a lot of potential. But I could tell all year that he was playing in fear of losing his starting job. Now that his fear has come true, I think DC has lost all confidence in himself. I fear he might never be the same with this team again.
Another night, another backside-kicking. They just hit you from so many sides, now, in waves. It's like a cavalry, running down hill and trampling you underfoot. You have no tactical advantage, you're just swinging wildly in the mud, and the best strategy might be to play dead.
They are an absolute onslaught right now.
------------ Matt Moore, CBS Sports "Eye On Basketball", 11/12/13
Just like Pop and Tibs can't be faulted for not having lower team expectations since it's not their fault. Meaning that Frank has an advantage over them in that regard and they have an advantage of a vet team that knows the plays better.
Bottom line is that to me Vogel as #3 COY makes sense behind those 2 because those teams aren't just leaning on talent to be good. The Pacers aren't either, but until Frank can get them to that next level of play (unknown if he can yet) he can't be COY and they can't be elite title contenders.
However in the mold of the 90's team (to 2000) they are structured in a way to be headed toward being that time of team oriented group who develops and works well together.
True, but both SAS and CHI have OKC and MIA for expectation comparisons and honestly most people saw SAS as too old for the short season and unable to make this kind of elite team run. Tibs has the loss of the MVP to injury.
So even by perception standards those 2 are the leading candidates.
I mean think about this, the team improved this year. Was it due to adding players at an Executive of the Year level or was it due to coaching blah players at a COY level?
The two contradict each other slightly. The less Larry did to improve the team the more Vogel is COY, and vice versa.
Is it because the Bulls and Spurs offense and defense are based more around a "system" that is excellently executed no both ends?
I'm not sure if that is the right way to put it....but when I look at the how well both Teams play...it's more akin to playing a certain way ( how Pop and Thibs wants them to play on both end of the court ) that....as long as it is executed the proper way....both the Spurs and Bulls will continue to either keep up with your Team or dominate over the course of 4 QTRs on both ends of the floor until your Team simply makes mistakes while they simply advantage at the right time.
To me..that is the sharp contrast between the way the Bulls and Spurs play...compared to the Heat. Their offense is pretty much centered around....give the ball to Wade or LeDecision...and let them go to work by scoring on their own...or trying to create for others.
Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.
This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.
But there's a huge advantage in having veteran players who know how to play YOUR system. Meaning, yea, they're probably the "best coached" teams, but that doesn't mean those coaches did the best job this year. They just happen to have the best systems with veteran players who know how to run those systems.
Vogel hasn't even had a real opportunity to implement his offensive system. What Frank has done this season is honestly remarkable. And before anyone says I'm exaggerating, who thought the Pacers would have the fifth best record in the league, and the third best team in the East?
I think Frank has done the best job coaching this season. Not because we have the team that runs most like a machine in the league. We don't. But it would have been impossible to expect that from this team.
That said, I have no issues with Pop getting it. But, it seems like it'll be more like Kobe's MVP - a career achievement award, instead of what actually occurred this season.
executive of the year? Our biggest aquisition was West (supposedly) - an aging PF who had torn his ACL. Hill was a good trade, but the player drafted has been pretty good for Sass. Barbosa..once again, nice trade, but our second unit was doing darn well without him anyway. All positive acquisitions, but this doesn't take a team from 8th to 3rd without a heck of a coaching job.
Last edited by Sookie; 04-27-2012 at 07:14 PM.