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Thread: Flopping

  1. #26
    @SteaglesPD Steagles's Avatar
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    I agree completely with the soccer/yellow card thing. If someone flops and it's brutally obvious then give them a T. Simple as that. Referees discretion. Of course superstars would still get calls, but it's a start.


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  3. #27
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I think if the NBA hired a committee to review for flops after the game is over, I think they would get it right more than they would get it wrong with the benefit of replays, slomo, multiple angles.

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  5. #28
    Denim Chicken duke dynamite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    JVG is kind of a homer for the Knicks still, but I agree with him. Flopping is stupid.

  6. #29
    Member Derek2k3's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I don't understand the "It's too subjective" argument.

    Pretty much every call is subjective. Block/charge, it completely depends on the angle of the ref/his opinion on what had happened. Goaltending. Traveling. All of it comes down to what the official believes he/she saw. Therefore, if an official feels a player took a dive, they should be able to call it a personal foul. Not a team foul, just a personal.

    The league could reserve the right to issue what would basically flagrant points, so if an official missed an especially egregious call the league could hammer the player.

    I think it's worth at least trying, because players like Chalmers who take dives all the time need to be punished.

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  8. #30
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    I think if the NBA hired a committee to review for flops after the game is over, I think they would get it right more than they would get it wrong with the benefit of replays, slomo, multiple angles.
    I agree with that as well. But they'd need to define it for the players so they know exactly what is a flop and what isn't.

    It'd be tough to call them real-time, but the league could fine them on replay, and suspend them for repeated incidents.

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  10. #31
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Derek2k3 View Post
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    I don't understand the "It's too subjective" argument.

    Pretty much every call is subjective. Block/charge, it completely depends on the angle of the ref/his opinion on what had happened. Goaltending. Traveling. All of it comes down to what the official believes he/she saw. Therefore, if an official feels a player took a dive, they should be able to call it a personal foul. Not a team foul, just a personal.

    The league could reserve the right to issue what would basically flagrant points, so if an official missed an especially egregious call the league could hammer the player.

    I think it's worth at least trying, because players like Chalmers who take dives all the time need to be punished.
    Odviously every call is subjective, my argument at least, is that it is EVEN MORE subjective...

  11. #32
    I have a Member xBulletproof's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    If done, it would have to be done post game. Imagine a guy getting a foul called because someone stepped on his foot when he went to move and fell, and it was called a flop. The refs have enough hard calls to make in a game, you want their job to be easier, not harder.

    More importantly, could we make this the officials signal for a flop call if they get one ....... ?


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  13. #33
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    Default Re: Flopping

    These are the types of plays that could clearly be fined:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWRjyUzPX70

  14. #34
    Go Paytherth! rel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by xBulletproof View Post
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    If done, it would have to be done post game. Imagine a guy getting a foul called because someone stepped on his foot when he went to move and fell, and it was called a flop. The refs have enough hard calls to make in a game, you want their job to be easier, not harder.

    More importantly, could we make this the officials signal for a flop call if they get one ....... ?

    We'd have to get permission from Al Harrington , since he is the president of Al Harrington's Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Men Emporium and Warehouse :P

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  16. #35

    Default Re: Flopping

    I love JVG. Always keeps it real.

  17. #36
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by xBulletproof View Post
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    If done, it would have to be done post game. Imagine a guy getting a foul called because someone stepped on his foot when he went to move and fell, and it was called a flop. The refs have enough hard calls to make in a game, you want their job to be easier, not harder.

    More importantly, could we make this the officials signal for a flop call if they get one ....... ?

    In theory I agree. However, in practice I don't see this as any different than flagrant fouls. How many times have you seen a flagrant issued when it shouldn't have? 2 shots and the ball, potential game changer. I think you put the onus on the official to make the best possible call, and accept that they won't be perfect.

  18. #37
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Pingu View Post
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    As an element of comparison, flopping is punished by a yellow card in soccer (I know, it's hard to believe)
    Why is that hard to believe?

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  20. #38
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I think the flopping problem is just another side-effect of the poor state of officiating in the NBA. Just because a guy hits the deck, doesen't mean the refs should look for the nearest opponent and whistle him. Unfortunately this tends to be the case more often than not, so players use it to their advantage.

    In my opinion, if anyone should be fined for flopping, it should be the ref that made the call.

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  22. #39
    You Did It Joseph!!!! AesopRockOn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I just hope that those of you who are advocating for in-game technical fouls aren't the same ones saying how terrible you think the officiating is. Putting another really difficult call to make on their plate may be asking too much, especially if the refs continue to get the same level of (i.e. no) support and transparency from the front office.

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  24. #40
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Wage View Post
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    I think the flopping problem is just another side-effect of the poor state of officiating in the NBA. Just because a guy hits the deck, doesen't mean the refs should look for the nearest opponent and whistle him. Unfortunately this tends to be the case more often than not, so players use it to their advantage.

    In my opinion, if anyone should be fined for flopping, it should be the ref that made the call.
    while i dont necessarily agree with your last sentence, I do agree that the refs are a big part of the problem. Officiating this year has been down right horrific. And I'm not even judging from Pacers games. Even watching random teams play, its down right comical. The whole swallowing the whistle until you see if the shot is made or not drives me insane. If its a foul, call it a foul, dont wait to see if he hits the shot and not call it.

    Officiating has been a really big problem this year. And it has gone beyond the typical superstar favoritism.

  25. #41
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    Default Re: Flopping

    can't we just...ignore the flopping and continue to play?

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  27. #42
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I completely agree that floppers should be fined when they flop. I don't think any in game action should happen other than just ignoring them if they do happen.

    As much as I would want to fine the refs who call flops, I know this would not be a good idea because it might cause them to swallow their whistle if it was actually a foul and the player just sold it a little. That is an important distinction to make in my opinion. Overreacting to a foul to make it more obvious while most of the time taken to the extreme at the NBA level shouldn't be punished as a foul did actually happened.
    Last edited by Eleazar; 04-16-2012 at 02:30 AM.

  28. #43

    Default Re: Flopping

    If the referee ignore the flopping and continue, the defensive end loses some edge because of it become 5 to 4, and will likely lose 2 points.
    Isn't that enough punishment for the flopping?

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  30. #44
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherlock View Post
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    If the referee ignore the flopping and continue, the defensive end loses some edge because of it become 5 to 4, and will likely lose 2 points.
    Isn't that enough punishment for the flopping?
    I think this is the bottom line. I wasn't saying I think the refs should actually be fined for calling flops, just that IF anyone were to be, it should be the refs and not the players.

    Just stop blowing the whistle because someone falls down and the problem takes care of itself.

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  32. #45
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    Default Re: Flopping

    How about this flop by Tony Allen that was so bad that it ended up on "Shaqtin' a Fool". I just love how after Tony "gets hit" he actually switches hands because he covered the wrong side of his face when he went down... Good stuff!

    #2 :58
    ...Still "flying casual"
    @roaminggnome74

  33. #46
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by BornReady View Post
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    can't we just...ignore the flopping and continue to play?
    I think there may be a more positive effect with disincentivizing it rather than just ignoring it. See also: raising children.

  34. #47
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    Default Re: Flopping

    I think I have a better punishment than simple fines.

    Flops are reviewed during the game and determined whether or not there was real contact. Any player who flops must pay the fine directly to the player they flopped on in a publicized press conference posted in a special section on nba.com directly following the game. Players may not care about losing $50k, but I bet they sure as **** don't want to pay another player they just spent 2 hours fighting with their money.

  35. #48
    Member TinManJoshua's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by AesopRockOn View Post
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    I think there may be a more positive effect with disincentivizing it rather than just ignoring it. See also: raising children.
    If teen mom has taught me anything, it's that we should definitely disincentivize child rearing. I keed. Sort of.

    With regards to flopping, as an avid soccer fan I have accepted its role in sports. That doesn't mean I like it, but I really feel like there is absolutely no way you can stop everyone from doing it. Even with the threat of punishment the act will exist, much like punishing flagrant fouls only minimizes their effect on the game.

  36. #49
    Member Derek2k3's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flopping

    What if charges were simply turnovers, ala going over and back?

    Not saying it works, just interested what you guys think.

    It wouldn't eliminate it, but at least guys wouldn't end up racking up personals off of flops.

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  38. #50
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    Default Re: Flopping

    Quote Originally Posted by TinManJoshua View Post
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    much like punishing flagrant fouls only minimizes their effect on the game.
    I doubt it, if there was no such thing as a flagrant foul you would see many times more fouls that would qualify as a flagrant than we do.

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