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Thread: Off-Season PG options

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    Default Off-Season PG options

    It would appear that a starting PG and another C/PF with more size to back Hibbert up would be our main concerns in the off-season. I don't despise Collison like many here seem to but I just don't think he is the long term answer as the starter. A lot of folks are clamoring for Deron Williams or Steve Nash…….while both are great and I don't think I need to go into why….Williams unfortunately isn't coming here and Nash, while he would have a solid impact I think is too old to be part of the long term…….

    The guy I am really intrigued by is Goran Dragic…..I'm sure someone else has talked about him already and if so and its redundant I'm sorry. He is 25 years old, playoff experience, good size @ 6'3. He is the guy I really hope we look at in the off-season. If you have him as your starter and are able to bring in Collison off the bench as more of an offensive minded PG I think it would be a nice tandem……

    Of course Collison could really blow up over the last 10 games and play-offs and change everyones opinion……but I doubt it

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    1. Deron Williams
    2. Steve Nash
    3. Goran Dragic

    I could live with any of the three, but right now I kind of like Dragic myself, because he would probably be cheapest.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    You might have to go for Lowery. I think Houston would fight tooth and nail to keep Dragic.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    You might have to go for Lowery. I think Houston would fight tooth and nail to keep Dragic.
    Are you kidding!? Hou has a total hard-on for Lowry, they didn't want to trade him for PAU GASOL!

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDavisBrothers View Post
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    Are you kidding!? Hou has a total hard-on for Lowry, they didn't want to trade him for PAU GASOL!
    Plus Dragic is a UFA.

    He makes a reasonable target.
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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Plus Dragic is a UFA.

    He makes a reasonable target.
    Yea Lowry has 2 years/ about 12 mil still left after this year. That is a great contract and you don't trade a great contract like that away...

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    I think I'm actually higher on Dragic now than Nash, for the simple fact that he would be here longer than 3 years. Dragic would allow us to continue to compete even after we use up our cap space.

    If you can get Dragic to agree to an offer here, you may as well see if we can sweeten the deal by offering to bring him in as a sign-and trade. Maybe grab a first round pick + Dragic for Collison (as Dragic would be leaving anyway). Or maybe see what their thoughs on Dalembert are. As he would be their only center under contract, they would prolly want to hang on to him, but you never know.

    If you just outright sign Dragic, you have a very deep backcourt with better size. And you would have either Hill and Collison or Hill and Dragic coming in off the bench; that means we have better PG play in both units. And Hill has played with Collison very well.

    With the S&T, we would be able to give Hill 25-30 minutes a night of the bench, and still leave 10 minutes to go to Lance or AJ. I have a feeling that Lance will come back from the summer a VERY improved player.


    Because if we go out and sign a point guard, there is really no need to keep both Collison and Hill. And if you keep Hill because he is the better basketball player, you may as well allow the players you want long term to get more minutes, and maybe even get something back for Collison.

    Also, I would still rather have D-Will than Dragic...but who wouldn't? lol

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    I do think it is funny some of you are so high on Dragic, considering how similar Collison is in terms of numbers to him this season. Granted, Collison plays 7 mpg on average more than Dragic, but they average the same ppg, the same apg, while Collison rebounds more and is a better free throw shooter and 3 pt shooter.

    Dragic has been hot and had a good game against us and some of you act like he is some long term answer. Sorry, I have to disagree. If you are unsatisfied with Collison I am not sure how you can justify Dragic as being a major upgrade.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    I do think it is funny some of you are so high on Dragic, considering how similar Collison is in terms of numbers to him this season. Granted, Collison plays 7 mpg on average more than Dragic, but they average the same ppg, the same apg, while Collison rebounds more and is a better free throw shooter and 3 pt shooter.

    Dragic has been hot and had a good game against us and some of you act like he is some long term answer. Sorry, I have to disagree. If you are unsatisfied with Collison I am not sure how you can justify Dragic as being a major upgrade.
    Dragic also has 3 inches and 30 pounds that Darren Collison will never be able to match. Also, I am usually satisfied with Collison's play. Also, while h has averaged only 7 mins left per game, Dragic has only started 19 games this year, so his stats are influenced by 38 games of scoring with and assisting Rockets bench players. So based on numbers alone, I still agree Dragic is an upgrade.

    However, numbers don't tell the whole story, do they? Dragic is a stronger and more creative passer than Collison. He is bigger and longer and more able to get passes off around defenders. He shoots a ridiculous percentage on his drives to the basket. (The rocket announcers said he makes like 70% of his attempts at the rim). And he is one of the top 5 fastbreak PGs in the league, in no small part because he can finish so well.

    Collison is a nifty ballhandler and a very very good mid range shooter. Dragic is a better penetrator and passer.

    But even if we're sticking with the fact that they're the same player....Dragic is 3 inches bigger and takes away the size disadvantage.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    I do think it is funny some of you are so high on Dragic, considering how similar Collison is in terms of numbers to him this season. Granted, Collison plays 7 mpg on average more than Dragic, but they average the same ppg, the same apg, while Collison rebounds more and is a better free throw shooter and 3 pt shooter.

    Dragic has been hot and had a good game against us and some of you act like he is some long term answer. Sorry, I have to disagree. If you are unsatisfied with Collison I am not sure how you can justify Dragic as being a major upgrade.
    18.2 and 8.7 as a starter this year is why everyone is excited about him. I mentioned before that DC put up similar numbers in his rookie year as a starter. With that said, I do think he is an upgrade, though not neccisarily a "major" upgrade, over DC, as he's a better pure point guard and his size is a lot better. I would like to take a flier on him if we don't get Deron or Nash.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    About Dragic....I'm going to ask the same thing that I asked in one of the Post Game thread when we played the Rockets.

    Is Dragic more of a "solid Backup PG that is capable of being a Starting PG on an average to slightly above average Team" instead of a "Quality Starting PG on a Near Elite or better Team?

    Dragic put up very high quality Starting PG numbers when he was given the chance to run the Team as the Starting PG when the Rockets regular Starting PG went down with injury. As most of us are well aware of.... DC pretty much did the same thing a few years ago with the Hornets when CP3 went down and was able to show that he's capable of being a decent Starting PG. I'm not saying that DC isn't a Starting quality PG.....he is.....but I think that he's a Starting PG on an average to slightly above average Team...but not the type of PG that we need in order to make it to the next level simply because he has enough flaws in his game that leaves a lot to be desired. IMHO...I think that DC would be a much better high-quality Backup PG that is capable of stepping in to be a Starting PG on an "emergency basis".

    What I'm trying to determine is if Dragic is in the same catagory as DC is.....if he's a real "diamond in the rough" that has simply been stuck behind Lowry and Nash for the entire length of his career.....or even if he is a DC level type Player if he has enough facets to his game on the offensive end ( such as running the offense and scoring ) to make up for any deficiencies on the defensive end.
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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    1. Deron Williams
    2. Steve Nash
    3. Goran Dragic

    I could live with any of the three, but right now I kind of like Dragic myself, because he would probably be cheapest.
    What other PG options are there?

    Felton?
    Sessions?

    I don't recall who else are possible options. Although Lin is an option...I don't think that the Knicks will let him go ( but that's why I just want to offer him some really overpaid / outrageous offer and force the Knicks to match but I know that it's something that I don't think that the Simons will permit that ).
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    What other PG options are there?

    Felton?
    Sessions?

    I don't recall who else are possible options. Although Lin is an option...I don't think that the Knicks will let him go ( but that's why I just want to offer him some really overpaid / outrageous offer and force the Knicks to match but I know that it's something that I don't think that the Simons will permit that ).
    Andre Miller, though he is another old guy. Still a very good PG and good defensively.
    Last edited by aamcguy; 04-11-2012 at 02:54 AM.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Yeah, there will be a bunch of older guys in the market, including Nash, Miller, Billups, Kidd, Terry, Davis. Not sure how much gas some of them have left though.

    There's also Arenas, who's having a nice little comeback with Memphis. But I don't think we'd want to deal with his baggage.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Dragic is not your answer at PG, not any more than Darren is at any rate.

    If you want a PG that will make a you a contender for years to come then it's Deron Williams or bust this offseason. I love Kidd, Nash, and to a lesser extent Dre Miller, but if you're thinking long term then they just don't qualify.

    And if you're thinking about getting a PG who'll get you over the hump, then Lowry, Sessions, Felton, or Dragic don't qualify either.

    It's Deron Williams or bust.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    We are last in assists. How much better would we be if we just moved up to 15th?

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    We talk of Dragic as a consolation prize, a fallback option, but in truth the competition for his services will be quite stiff too.

    http://blog.chron.com/ultimaterocket...t-to-keep-him/

    Dragic nails his Portland audition as Rockets beat Blazers. Can the Rockets also win the fight — will they fight — to keep him?
    Posted on April 10, 2012 at 1:34 am by Jonathan Feigen in Analysis, General

    So this is what it is like to be the LeBron James of Slovenia.

    You win Player of the Week in the morning, key a win at night and then answer a bunch of questions about becoming a free agent and what matters to you most. Money? Team? Minutes? A short drive to Nike headquarters?

    Goran Dragic even has a collection of plaid shirts in case he wishes to sit down with Jim Graycic to announce The Decision on Slovenian cable. It turns out, this really is the Year of the ‘Dragon.’

    “It was a little bit different,” said Dragic after the Rockets knocked off the Trail Blazers, a team desperate for a point guard and with the cap room for a spending spree. “Before, they never asked me this type of questions. ‘Are you going to come to Portland?’ Still, all the doors are open. We’re going to see what is going to happen this summer. I feel great in Houston. Hopefully, I’m going to stay in Houston.”

    Earlier, he did say something about “I want to be a starter.” Still, he seems very open to staying in Houston if things work out.

    That might be tough. The Rockets have to want him back, but they do have Kyle Lowry locked up for two more seasons. All the excitement over Dragic since he stepped in when Lowry went out is no greater than when Lowry carried the team early in the season, including with an even more thorough beat-down of the Blazers. The Rockets run tons of point guard pick-and-roll. Good point guards will look good.

    Having been given the opportunity, Dragic looks like the real deal. As a starter, he has averaged 18.2 points on 51.9 percent shooting and 44.2 percent 3-point shooting, along with 8.7 assists. More than that, he seems at his best when his best is needed (which makes him more the Slovenian Manu Ginobili than LeBron James.)

    “I told the guys,” Portland interim head coach Kaleb Canales said, “I think he’s kind of playing a little bit like how Ginobili looks out there to me.”

    All that Jeremy Lin backlash in February, when Daryl Morey tweeted that it was a mistake to let Lin get away, seems forgotten considering the point guards he has and the moves he made to get them. If Dragic turns out to be special, as he appears to be, and is allowed to walk, the heat would be much greater.

    The problem is with timing. The Rockets have spent years retooling the roster to have the cap space they would have this summer. It is not likely to be filled with a max-contract free agent, but could be extremely valuable in a trade for the kind of star player the Rockets have lacked.

    That kind of deal does not come quickly. Free agent decisions will likely move much faster. The Rockets would have to decide whether to keep that space or fill it with Dragic and Courtney Lee.

    A good case could be made for bringing back the free agent guards, especially the way the Rockets are coming together and both are playing. But the Rockets would have to decide that they can live longer without that signature star. It’s still possible to make such a huge trade with the trade pieces they have, but it’s tougher when teams might only make that move to cut costs before the heavier luxury taxes kick in.

    That kind of deal is far from a sure thing – or even likely – in either circumstance, but if it is difficult with loads of cap space, it is brutally tough without it, as the Rockets have seen the past two seasons of coming close but coming up short.

    All things considered, the Rockets should give themselves until the free-agent signing date to make that kind of deal. If they can’t by then, keep what they have and keep trying.

    Even if the Rockets do decide to keep their free agents, Dragic would have to decide to stay with them. (Lee will be a restricted free agent.) A team like Portland can offer him big money and tons of playing time. Dragic might not be thinking about it now, but he will. He likes Houston, his teammates and coaches. But someone that came all the way to Slovenia to play ball, against the advice of many that said he was not ready, Dragic could be enticed to move again.

    “It’s going to be a crazy summer for me,” he said. “Still, I have to get every game, try to be focused, play hard and try to make playoffs with Houston Rockets. What is going to happen after the season, we’ll see.”

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Is Dragic gonna make us contenders - No.

    Is Steve Nash - Yes.

    deron williams wont come here so

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Lou tweeted this a couple hours ago....

    Louis Amundson ‏ @LouAmundson17
    Hello Twitter world! Overwhelmed by all new followers! Thanks to the BigDog @Hoya2aPacer and my spiritual advisor @SteveNash for the love.

    Do you think his relationship with Steve Nash could benefit us in trying to bring Nash to Indy??

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    I have a feeling that we are going to end up with Andre Miller, he has Larry Bird written all over him, two year contract, old and reliable, not going to make us contenders.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by ejwallace View Post
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    Lou tweeted this a couple hours ago....

    Louis Amundson ‏ @LouAmundson17
    Hello Twitter world! Overwhelmed by all new followers! Thanks to the BigDog @Hoya2aPacer and my spiritual advisor @SteveNash for the love.

    Do you think his relationship with Steve Nash could benefit us in trying to bring Nash to Indy??
    Nash tweeted this:
    Steve Nash ‏ @SteveNash
    @louamundson17 Lou Dooo is now on twitter!!! Follow the poet laureate of UNLV and power forward of the Pacers!
    Somebody replied and told him "Only if he joins Lou next year in Indiana"

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I have a feeling that we are going to end up with Andre Miller, he has Larry Bird written all over him, two year contract, old and reliable, not going to make us contenders.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    I think DW is out of reach for us. If he decides to go to Dallas this is my idea. If we could get one of these guys I think it may not make us contenders, but it makes us a scary opponent in the playoffs next year that teams would not want to face in the second round.

    Nash
    Kidd
    Billups
    Dre

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    1. Deron Williams
    2. Steve Nash
    3. Goran Dragic

    I could live with any of the three, but right now I kind of like Dragic myself, because he would probably be cheapest.
    He's also most likely to be the next "Wow, we got POINT GUARD X? FOR HOW MUCH? SCORE!! WHAT A DEAL!!" only to be followed up by "Man, point guard X has really not panned out the way I thought he would back when we got him."

    If we're going to get a PG, let's REALLY go get a PG that we know will absolutely bring something bigger/better to the table than Dragic may or may not.

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    Default Re: Off-Season PG options

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    We are last in assists. How much better would we be if we just moved up to 15th?
    30th to 15th is a huge jump, though. I don't think many guys are capable, by themselves, of doing that for us. If anyone is.

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