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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

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B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

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  • #16
    Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

    Originally posted by Really? View Post
    I know Wayne will be gone pretty soon, but I am not sure there is a true #1 receiver available at 34, some are close, but all have some key weakness, all I hope is if we go that route we choose well.
    True #1 WR like Calvin Johnson or Fitz, no, but a lot of #1 wideouts come out of the 2-4th rounds. Mike Wallace, Greg Jennings, Anquan Boldin, Desean Jackson, Vincent Jackson, Stevie Johnson, Brandon Marshall, Steve Smith, etc. Hakeem Nicks and Roddy White were late first. I don't see why we can't get a very good WR at #34, especially when he's going to be paired with Luck.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

      Originally posted by CooperManning View Post
      True #1 WR like Calvin Johnson or Fitz, no, but a lot of #1 wideouts come out of the 2-4th rounds. Mike Wallace, Greg Jennings, Anquan Boldin, Desean Jackson, Vincent Jackson, Stevie Johnson, Brandon Marshall, Steve Smith, etc. Hakeem Nicks and Roddy White were late first. I don't see why we can't get a very good WR at #34, especially when he's going to be paired with Luck.
      True, I mean a guy that is ready to step in right away and be a #1 WR, there are two of those guy coming out next year though. With these guys they happened to be lucky picks for the most part besides a few. Nicks and Roddy were known to have #1 receiver type talent, Jackson fail because of size, Bolden because of speed, etc.

      But for all those guys drafted there are a bunch that did not make it, rarely do you see receivers drafted in the top 10 not produce on a high level, besides Rodgers and Warrick.

      But yes we can find someone but it will not be a guy that we expect to be a #1 WR, but hopefully he grows into one.
      Why so SERIOUS

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

        TROY WILLIAMSON.

        Haha, nah, you make good points. We'll see what happens. Pagano is a defense guy, so maybe he won't be able to help himself from improving our fairly terrible D.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

          Originally posted by CooperManning View Post
          TROY WILLIAMSON.

          Haha, nah, you make good points. We'll see what happens. Pagano is a defense guy, so maybe he won't be able to help himself from improving our fairly terrible D.
          yeah for got about him, add him to the list too..
          Why so SERIOUS

          Comment


          • #20
            JJ stokes? I know it was 1995 but he Wasn't good...also Darrius heyward bey...

            Comment


            • #21
              Also mike williams,Reggie Williams and Ted Ginn Junior.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                Originally posted by Dgreenwell3 View Post
                Also mike williams,Reggie Williams and Ted Ginn Junior.
                Stokes was not to bad, he had TO and Jerry Rice to compete against though, Ginn was never supposed to go that high, lol Reggie Williams, idk, Mike Williams wellhe had problems with taking a year off and should not have been taken that high because of that.

                But for the most part they are pretty good, lol besides those exceptions.

                Hayward Bay was another guy no one thought should go that high, and it was only due to Al Davis liking speed, no other team had him that high on their board.
                Why so SERIOUS

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                  Originally posted by Really? View Post
                  True, I mean a guy that is ready to step in right away and be a #1 WR, there are two of those guy coming out next year though. With these guys they happened to be lucky picks for the most part besides a few. Nicks and Roddy were known to have #1 receiver type talent, Jackson fail because of size, Bolden because of speed, etc.
                  Really,
                  I am not sure you used the best examples there to prove your point. Nicks and Roddy took 2-3 years to develop and DeSean had the most productive first year. Marvin Harrison was no exception either.

                  AJ Green was probably the best recent example but most WR take atleast 3 years to develop into a true number one.

                  This draft has clear number 2 WR's in the second round which will be crtical to the Lucks development going forward. ALso alot of these WR don't need top end speed as they are big and strong enough to over power DB's for the ball. This is exactly the type of player Hakeem Nicks is but the team will need a deep post threat to stretch the field and keep the safties honest.

                  OF the top 5 wide receivers all of them have ran a 4.4 in the combine or on their pro day and of those 5 two could slip to our second round pick. I hope either Randle or Hill will be there with our pick and they would be match up problem for most NFL CB's.

                  If we decide to even wait till the third round we should still be able to get a good WR. Marvin Jones would be a sure third round steal in this draft so I am hoping that the FO atleast addresses the WR in the first 3 rounds.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Really? View Post
                    Stokes was not to bad, he had TO and Jerry Rice to compete against though, Ginn was never supposed to go that high, lol Reggie Williams, idk, Mike Williams wellhe had problems with taking a year off and should not have been taken that high because of that.

                    But for the most part they are pretty good, lol besides those exceptions.

                    Hayward Bay was another guy no one thought should go that high, and it was only due to Al Davis liking speed, no other team had him that high on their board.
                    Looking back of course vision is 20 20 but at the time this is what was projected.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                      Originally posted by Gamble1 View Post
                      Really,
                      I am not sure you used the best examples there to prove your point. Nicks and Roddy took 2-3 years to develop and DeSean had the most productive first year. Marvin Harrison was no exception either.

                      AJ Green was probably the best recent example but most WR take atleast 3 years to develop into a true number one.

                      This draft has clear number 2 WR's in the second round which will be crtical to the Lucks development going forward. ALso alot of these WR don't need top end speed as they are big and strong enough to over power DB's for the ball. This is exactly the type of player Hakeem Nicks is but the team will need a deep post threat to stretch the field and keep the safties honest.

                      OF the top 5 wide receivers all of them have ran a 4.4 in the combine or on their pro day and of those 5 two could slip to our second round pick. I hope either Randle or Hill will be there with our pick and they would be match up problem for most NFL CB's.

                      If we decide to even wait till the third round we should still be able to get a good WR. Marvin Jones would be a sure third round steal in this draft so I am hoping that the FO atleast addresses the WR in the first 3 rounds.
                      Yeah, I'm liking Randle or Sanu.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                        Past 10 yrs WR's that have been taken in the top 10

                        Charles Rodgers, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitz, Roy Williams, Reggie Williams, Braylon Edwards, Troy Williamson, Mike Williams, Calvin Johnson, Ted Ginn Jr., Darrius Hayward Bay, Micheal Crabtree, AJ Green, Julio Jones.

                        I will add that in most years their aren't WR's that deserve to go in the top 10 of the draft. At the time they were drafted the only one that was a consensus top 10 pick that busted was Charles Rodgers, and possibly Crabtree, but he is still young and a lot of that was due to him not going to camp or the first how many ever weeks of the season, and then having the foot injury.

                        Originally posted by Gamble1 View Post
                        Really,
                        I am not sure you used the best examples there to prove your point. Nicks and Roddy took 2-3 years to develop and DeSean had the most productive first year. Marvin Harrison was no exception either.

                        AJ Green was probably the best recent example but most WR take atleast 3 years to develop into a true number one.

                        This draft has clear number 2 WR's in the second round which will be crtical to the Lucks development going forward. ALso alot of these WR don't need top end speed as they are big and strong enough to over power DB's for the ball. This is exactly the type of player Hakeem Nicks is but the team will need a deep post threat to stretch the field and keep the safties honest.

                        OF the top 5 wide receivers all of them have ran a 4.4 in the combine or on their pro day and of those 5 two could slip to our second round pick. I hope either Randle or Hill will be there with our pick and they would be match up problem for most NFL CB's.

                        If we decide to even wait till the third round we should still be able to get a good WR. Marvin Jones would be a sure third round steal in this draft so I am hoping that the FO atleast addresses the WR in the first 3 rounds.
                        Not saying that speed is a necessity, but NFL #1 WR's need to be able to run atleast a 4.6 in my book, when I said Nicks and White had #1 type talent, that meant they had the potential to turn into #1 receivers, not that they were at the time, sorry for that confusion.

                        The guys you listed could end up turning into #1 receivers in time as well. Sanu, Randle, Hill all have the potential, but all big question marks as well. I think Hill has the highest potential at of the three followed by Sanu and then Randle, but only time will tell if they end up turning into #1 type guys.

                        Originally posted by Dgreenwell3 View Post
                        Looking back of course vision is 20 20 but at the time this is what was projected.
                        No one had Bay as a top 10 guy, no one had Gin or Mike Williams as a top 10 pick besides the team that drafted them, the teams were instantly questioned about those picks.

                        JJ Stokes had a pretty productive career, not all star caliber but still very productive and if he were on another team without as much depth he would have had the chance to have better numbers.
                        Why so SERIOUS

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                          Some interesting tidbits from a Star article on Avery by Phil Richards

                          Avery ran a 4.27-second 40-yard dash on the University of Houston's 2008 pro day. He had get-deep speed. "Blazing" was the word used to characterize him in the combine scouting report.
                          Donnie Avery was the 33rd overall pick in the 2008 NFL draft. He was the first wide receiver taken.
                          By the end of the owners lockout, Avery said, his speed was back. He said he ran 4.25 on grass.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                            Originally posted by travmil View Post
                            Yeah, I still think they take the best WR available at pick 34. Then next season they are going to take the best left tackle available with their top pick which should be pretty high. That way you give Luck a target for a decade and a guy to protect him while throwing to that target.
                            Honestly, I see them going BPA defensively after Luck.
                            Senior at the University of Louisville.
                            Greenfield ---> The Ville

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Colts sign free agent WR Donnie Avery

                              Originally posted by Really? View Post
                              Past 10 yrs WR's that have been taken in the top 10

                              Charles Rodgers, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitz, Roy Williams, Reggie Williams, Braylon Edwards, Troy Williamson, Mike Williams, Calvin Johnson, Ted Ginn Jr., Darrius Hayward Bay, Micheal Crabtree, AJ Green, Julio Jones.
                              So to summarize:

                              Andre, Fitz, and Calvin are indeed all-pro game changers. AJ Green will probably join the list, Julio might as well.

                              Rogers, Reggie Williams, Troy Williamson all busted.

                              Mike Williams and Ted Ginn essentially busted.

                              Braylon and Roy Williams have had their moments, but didn't live up to their potential.

                              Heyward Bey and Crabtree have some potential, but it appears both were drafted way too high.

                              So basically top 10 wideouts aren't very good unless you're getting a LOCK, which Andre, Fitz, Calvin, and AJ Green all were.

                              Comment

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