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Thread: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

  1. #51
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by MTM View Post
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    I have come to trust Simmons' NBA judgment over just about any other 'expert' that ESPN throws out there. I agree with your analysis of his knowledge. I also know, however, that he predicted the Pacers would be a 40 win team before the first game of the season when nobody else, including many of us, would have thought so.
    Seriously? I can't believe anybody would value Simmons opinion over even a casual fan. His evaluations are usually completely wrong

  2. #52
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    I'd bet my life you're wrong about the bolded part.
    I agree. And Bill loves the Pacers as a big up-and-comer. He was talking top 4-5 during pre-season, not after the fact.

    But Roy DOES NOT DOMINATE. He doesn't. He produces, and it's different. The most impressive part of his game that would make you think all-star has been his shot blocking, which is at times pretty dang bad-***. If he was hitting his hooks and post moves consistently he'd be averaging 25 and things would look a lot different.

    The Pacers have one guy that looks like an all-star = Paul George. His massive inconsistency continues to be his road block, but it seems like he will mature and get there.

    Roy and Danny (and West/Collison too) are set to be like the 2004 Pistons where they are getting the job done, have decent numbers, but don't come out as the clear threat every single night in a way that NORMALLY demands all-star respect.

    The talent level is spread about as evenly across all 5 positions as any team I can think of. No guy will face a lesser opponent more than 55-60% of the time. But every night 2-3 Pacers will clearly have an advantage. It just shifts from player to player.



    And people shouldn't be p*****d about this, this is the kind of team you should want. For chrissake, you've had TWO all-stars come from the #17 pick. TWO. On the same roster, from the same era.

    That happens never.

    It's a brilliant assembly of team role players who function well together and share the load from night to night. It doesn't lend itself to lots of all-star players but it does lend itself to a lot of winning, and that's what we are here for.




    PS - maybe it's a youth thing because when I was younger I was way more concerned with the Pacers getting their just due. Now I couldn't care less.

    Just win baby, let the recognition drag slowly along behind it if that's the way it has to be.


    His evaluations are usually completely wrong
    Like when he said the Pacers were a nice up and coming team that should finish ahead of the Celtics BEFORE the season started. What an idiot, he knows nothing...unless you agree with it. Sheesh. Same ol', same ol' from PD.
    Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 02-11-2012 at 03:23 PM.

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  4. #53
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Like I mentioned in the other thread, don't look now but Roy's season trajectory is starting to look frighteningly like last season, outside of his rebounding numbers.
    I was thinking that myself last night, and it sucks to see that it's not just me noticing because it probably makes it less paranoid and more reality.

    Of course the good news is that last year he shook it off. We just blamed it all on the JOB/Vogel switch when maybe there is also a weather/usage/exhaustion factor at work.


    I freaking love Roy, but I recognize the limitations. We've all called him Smits (well a lot of us) and right now I can't think of it being any more Smits-like than for him to make the AS team kinda by default while his output sometimes thrills us and other times frustrates us. Smits almost always had that "if only he would..." factor to it.

    Now everyone remembers the good games, but if you could log onto PD 1992 you'd see a lot of "trade Smits" threads. TONS.

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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Tyler Hansbrough — Developed into a momentum-swinging bench player for Indy, as well as the runaway leader of Bill Laimbeer Memorial "Player Most Likely to Get Punched in the Face at Any Point of Any Game" Award.
    This alone shows that Bill follows the team enough to have some sense of it. He's been my leading candidate for the award for about 2 seasons now. Many nights it's felt like that kettle was starting to boil over, it's only a matter of time.

    And when it happens - just hit the FTs Tyler.

  7. #55
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    My favorite part of Roy's game is definitely his improved defense and rebounding. He definitely plays like a big guy in the middle, that's for sure. Much more than I think Smits ever did.

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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    No. His numbers have tailed off a bit, but they're not close, at all, to the swings we saw last season. Unless we're using one game sample sizes or something.
    FWIW, I'm using a 5 game sample size. During the past 5 games, Roy is shooting 39% from the field, for the month of February, he's shooting 45% from the field.

    That 39% over the course of 5 games is a pretty big dip from what we've seen from him through January. It tracks very closely to the large swings we saw from him last year.

    Even more disconcerting (for me at least), is that Roy has gone the past two games without a block. Also, his fouls have also gone up by nearly a FPG over the past 5 games. Again, maybe he comes out tonight against Denver and corrects that, but it will be tough.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Like I mentioned in the other thread, don't look now but Roy's season trajectory is starting to look frighteningly like last season, outside of his rebounding numbers.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

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  11. #58
    You Did It Joseph!!!! AesopRockOn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
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    Seriously? I can't believe anybody would value Simmons opinion over even a casual fan. His evaluations are usually completely wrong
    So are you hoping that he's wrong about this?:

    But my favorite of the three picks? Indiana. Here's how much I love this year's Pacers team: I even ogled their Central Division odds (+800) and NBA title odds (75-to-1) for a few minutes before thinking, "Wait, this is getting crazy." Just know that, if the Pacers don't crack 40 wins this season, I'll give you a refund for this column.
    TJ, I also cry when I go back and read your posts.

  12. #59
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    FWIW, I'm using a 5 game sample size. During the past 5 games, Roy is shooting 39% from the field, for the month of February, he's shooting 45% from the field.

    That 39% over the course of 5 games is a pretty big dip from what we've seen from him through January. It tracks very closely to the large swings we saw from him last year.

    Even more disconcerting (for me at least), is that Roy has gone the past two games without a block. Also, his fouls have also gone up by nearly a FPG over the past 5 games. Again, maybe he comes out tonight against Denver and corrects that, but it will be tough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Thank you for this. When we "hate" on certain players, we don't derive pleasure out of it. Seeing Roy fall back down to earth is not something I enjoy.

  13. #60
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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    TJ - Blocks perhaps most indicative of his slump. Blocks & rebounds indicate activity and intensity. Plus they support the defensive end, so this correlates to our defensive drop off.

    Have opponents started to force Roy into P-n-R and other schemes to take him away from paint on D? If so, can he adapt/adjust? Or is it just Roy's motor of late? Or both? He has never shown in his career good ability on the P-n-R defense. His agility, quickness, footwork are major drawbacks.

    Offensively - why has his post-up positioning suffered? He seems to generally be farther off the block and just weaker in his leverage. Are teams just getting more physical with him? Compressed schedule and increased minutes? You would not have expected Denver's bigs to do this which as much success/as easily as they did.
    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    I love Simmons, but he always does stuff like this with teams other than the celtics. Since mid last season through now he has said in most of his NBA columns that he would love for the celts to trade for Roy. He said the pacers remind him of the celtics a few years ago.
    LoneGranger33 said
    Agreed. As the members of Guns and Roses once said, "every rose has its thorn".

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    Default Re: Bill Simmons: Not high on Roy

    I love Roy, but you can't say he is not the last All Star selection for the East. He deserved it, absolutely.

    He's been a huge reason for our success.

    BUT- as has been said, he doesn't dominate. Partly because the staff refuses to run the ball through him consistently, and partly because his conditioning/asthma limit his availability. He has a tendency to finish with 12/10, but you'd never know because it wasn't very impactful. For example, in the loss to Denver he was a non-factor...yet put up decent numbers. But anyone watching that game knows he didn't make any difference, for the most part.

    I think that's why he gets an odd look when he's announced as an All-Star. He "looks" different than your prototypical dominant center.

    And, to people that mentioned this scary looking "fade" he seems to be going into, I know what you mean. The numbers don't back it up, but each of the last 4 games its been in the back of my head that he is fading...PTSD from the JOB years, I think


    NOTE: As has been said before, I think this stupid condensed schedule has/will affect Roy more than the others.

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