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The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

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Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

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  • #31
    Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

    i don't know about this...... i wouldn't do more than DC filler and 1st (filler someone like lou or price) for nash. saying that we would have 2 years to win a title.... then after nash is done we have to look for another PG when we could still have DC growing up in the system.... i don't know...

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

      Originally posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
      Steve Nash
      On the other end, he's scoring 21.9 points on 16.3 shots with a .580 eFG%, 15.2 assists, and 3.6 rebounds, for a PER of 21.4 on a per-48 minute basis.

      Chris Paul
      Offensively, he is scoring 22.2 points on 17.1 shots with a .528 eFG%, 11.5 assists, and 4.6 rebounds, for a PER of 23.4 on a per-48 minute basis.
      Something appears messed up, Mackey.

      Nash has the better offensive stat line (except for RBs), yet Paul has the better PER. Why?

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

        Originally posted by beast23 View Post
        Something appears messed up, Mackey.

        Nash has the better offensive stat line (except for RBs), yet Paul has the better PER. Why?
        http://www.basketball-reference.com/...lida01&y3=2012

        Per-36 Steve Nash: 16.8 points, 11.4 assists, 2.9 rebounds, 0.7 steals, 4.0 turnovers = PER of 23.1

        Per-36 Chris Paul: 18.2 points, 9.1 assists, 3.4 rebounds, 2.5 steals, 2.0 turnovers = PER of 25.9

        Per-36 Darren Collison: 12.0 points, 5.7 assists, 3.8 rebounds, 1.0 steals, 2.1 turnovers = PER of 14.1

        I used 82games for the first comparison, because it's the only site I know of that has solid defensive stats. I generally prefer Basketball Reference because it's always more up-to-date, and I like per-36 numbers more than per-48. For instance, using BR's numbers, the PER's for all three players is a bit improved.

        The reason Paul has a better PER this season, is mostly due to the differential in steals and turnovers between them, although the slight points and rebound differentials help as well. Steals and turnovers are a pretty big component in PER calculation, but I'm not even going to bother trying to explain all that. It's pretty overly technical, but use this link if you want to try to learn for yourself.

        http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/per.html

        Originally posted by Basketball Reference
        The Player Efficiency Rating (PER) is a per-minute rating developed by ESPN.com columnist John Hollinger. In John's words, "The PER sums up all a player's positive accomplishments, subtracts the negative accomplishments, and returns a per-minute rating of a player's performance."
        Last edited by Mackey_Rose; 02-06-2012, 12:47 PM. Reason: added Hollinger's basic explanation

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        • #34
          Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

          Some ESPN guy on twitter is comparing Nash numbers in his MVP year to this year and the numbers are similar.
          @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

            Originally posted by PacerPenguins View Post
            i don't know about this...... i wouldn't do more than DC filler and 1st (filler someone like lou or price) for nash. saying that we would have 2 years to win a title.... then after nash is done we have to look for another PG when we could still have DC growing up in the system.... i don't know...
            We'd still have Lance. Either way, as long as the Suns demands don't go overboard then you take Nash and run. They need to show mercy and send him to us anyhow. Were one of the few teams in the league that has a real chance to compete with little to no "star power". Adding Nash brings a spotlight to what's going on here in INDY. If Larry swings a deal for Nash then he is the obvious choice for an Executive of the Year Award.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

              I only do this if the Pacers brass really thinks they have a chance of winning it all in the next 1-2 years with Nash.

              I'm not really thinking that's the case.
              There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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              • #37
                Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                If we look to trade for Nash, please try to grab Lopez too.

                Lopez is barely getting playing time with Gortat and Frye eating most of the minutes.
                First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

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                • #38
                  Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                  Originally posted by Anthem View Post
                  So what's Pheonix looking for in terms of price?
                  The Suns have said repeatedly they won't trade Nash unless he asks to be traded... Nash has looked point blank at reporters and has said he's not that type of person that would ask for a trade, and he can't walk away from his teammates.

                  So unless one side does a 180, he isn't even available for a trade... the whole 'willing to consider' part from the suns isn't about if the price is right, it's about willing to do so to respect Nash if he wants to be traded.
                  "George's athleticism is bananas!" - Marc J. Spears

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                    Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
                    I only do this if the Pacers brass really thinks they have a chance of winning it all in the next 1-2 years with Nash.

                    I'm not really thinking that's the case.
                    Why do you think this?

                    Just because of the existence of the SuperTeams, is there no chance of winning a Championship over the next 2 seasons?

                    I'm looking at the next 2 seasons as the window to win it all...this is how long we have West and 1 year short of when Granger becomes a UFA.....before the both of them likely bolts for greener pastures.

                    Is it realistic?

                    Probably not with the current roster....but is it possible if we can continue to build upon the existing foundation that we have built?

                    I think so.

                    If there is a chance to even RENT Nash without costing a 1st AND Collison ( but one or the other )...I'd consider it. Getting Nash builds upon what we have and gives us a better chance to win in the near future.
                    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                      Here is the tweet I was talking about.

                      @tomhaberstroh
                      For example: Steve Nash in his 2 MVP seasons: 17.2 ppg, 11.0 apg, 22.6 PER. The 2 seasons after? 17.7 ppg, 11.4 apg, 22.4 PER.
                      @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                        Originally posted by tadscout View Post
                        The Suns have said repeatedly they won't trade Nash unless he asks to be traded... Nash has looked point blank at reporters and has said he's not that type of person that would ask for a trade, and he can't walk away from his teammates.

                        So unless one side does a 180, he isn't even available for a trade... the whole 'willing to consider' part from the suns isn't about if the price is right, it's about willing to do so to respect Nash if he wants to be traded.
                        I'm reading some posts from the Suns RealGM board about this...and it's pretty much what you say. If Nash said that it's best to part ways...then the Suns will accomodate him...I can see see the Suns even getting back less "trade value" in return if Nash asked the Suns to send him to a Team of his choosing....but at the same time...I can see Nash pushing the opposing Team to send back good value so that the Suns aren't totally left in a lurch.

                        The FO has essentially said that Nash has earned the right to decide his own destiny with the Suns. They are doing something similar with Grant Hill. It's part of the culture that the Suns FO is trying to build. If anything, this is commendable.....especially when you see Teams like the Knicks do anything to anyone in order to get the Players that they want. It sounds like the FO has likely fielded offers to gauge his trade value....deemed it not worth the few months that they'd lose Nash and decided to go the "safe and admirable PR route" to simply let Nash go for nothing in Free Agency.

                        Although I can see Nash leaving via FA to the Team of his choice...I am going to guess ( again ) that Nash's Agent will work out some better S&T deal that would net Nash more $$$$ and the Suns "something, anything" in return so that they don't lose Nash for nothing.
                        Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                          Originally posted by Sparhawk View Post
                          If we look to trade for Nash, please try to grab Lopez too.

                          Lopez is barely getting playing time with Gortat and Frye eating most of the minutes.
                          If I didn't care about Jared Dudley's contract being so long...I'd try to get Nash, Lopez and Dudley to fill out the roster.
                          Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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                          • #43
                            Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                            My issues are the same as before. He's 39 (or soon will be), and he won't come cheap. Pass, and maybe you take a stab at getting him next summer (though I doubt it).

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                              Please No. He has no future here and we need to create a team that can subdue the Bulls and Heat. Not blow the cap on a 38 yr. old that will get crushed by the Bulls and Heat in a playoff series.

                              He is a great player, but it's the wrong place, wrong time for him to be here!
                              Garbage players get 1st round picks, (WTF)! All of the NBA must hate the Pacers! LOL

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Report: Suns Willing To Consider Trading Steve Nash

                                If there's a chance to get him, if I'm one of the top guys at FO I'll consider it very well. The main question really is the asking price of the Suns. Nash is only one of the few who gets to fit into any coach's style, so in terms of how well he'll fit is not much of a problem. If the Suns ask for too much, or a big part of our current core, then that will be really risky considering that Nash will be just a "rental" this season should we trade for him.

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