You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....
Tough decision for Larry. Obviously Roy's past performance does not indicate that he can be consistent at this level of play. But my gosh if Larry decides to wait until the season is over he will for sure have to max him out. Tough gamble, do you try and offer him a couple million per year below the max on an extension? What if he falls off the face of planet again after 20 games?
You can't get champagne from a garden hose.
And wasn't nearly half of this board wanting Gasol over Hibbert before the year started? Hibbert was our most valuable player last year and is again this year. Any time you have a big with his skill set, you MUST be patient and allow him to develop.
Put 5/60 on the table right now and then cross your fingers Roy signs it.
"They use a different cap calculation to determine the maximum salaries, which is based on 48.04% of projected BRI (instead of 51%). For example, even though the actual salary cap for 2005-06 is $49.5 million the 0-6 year maximum salary is $12 million, not $12.375 million."
I'll wait to see Larry Coon's new FAQ before treating anything as definitive though.
Interestingly, Marc Gasol didn't get a max deal as some have reported. His starting salary is $12.9m, which is below both the $14.7m and $13.6m figures.
By the new rules, we can only offer a 4 year extension. If Roy doesn't get extended, we can offer him a 5 year deal next year.
So our choices are: 1) Sign him to a 4 year extension before Jan 25; 2) Sign him to a new deal when free agency opens next year (with a max length of 5 years); 3) Match another team's offer sheet for him (with a max length of 4 years).
I agree. At the rate he's progressing, he could be averaging something like 17/11 next season. There will be several teams willing to offer him the farm next season if he stays an UFA. I wish we could lock him up.
Just counting the teams that will have cap space for one MAX player:
Dallas, Boston, Houston, New Jersey, Cleveland, New Orleans, Sacramento, Toronto, Philadelphia (if they amnesty Brand), Washington (if they amnesty Lewis)
That's a third of the league, and I'm probably missing some teams (like Minny and Denver, which will have their own RFA's to sign). What's more some of those teams (like Dallas and NJ) could probably get space for TWO max players.
CP3 is already off the board (he picked up his option year with the Clippers), once Dwight and Deron goes (possibly to the same team), who do you think teams are going after next. One way or another, Hibbert's getting paid.
That's why I favor an extension now rather than wait-and-see. Even if we keep our cap space open for next season, the amount is going to be piddling compared to most of these other teams. Cap space is valuable when it's a scarce resource - however, that doesn't appear to be the case for the near future.
There is one more consideration on offering him an extension, even to the max you can do perhaps but at least at a very high amount/exception 5th etc
It shows Roy you want him.
Not doing that makes you just one of the bidders next year, with a bloody asterix at your name for not offering a reasonable extension.
So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.
If you've done 6 impossible things today?
Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!
Gasol did receive a max starting salary and max annual raises, but not the max length.
This is what the max structure will (likely) look like this year and next:For purposes of this Section 7 only, the Salary Cap shall be calculated in accordance with Article VII, Section 2, except that the percentage of Projected BRI to be utilized for such calculation shall be 42.14% for all Salary Cap Years. Notwithstanding the foregoing, (i) the Salary Cap for the 2011-12 Salary Cap Year for purposes of this Section 7 only will be $51.689 million, and (ii) the Salary Cap for the 2012-13 Salary Cap Year for purposes of this Section 7 only will equal the greater of (x) the Salary Cap as calculated pursuant to this Section 7(f), and (y) $54.675 million.
(In order for the Max cap to be higher than $54.675 next year, the league would have to do somewhere around $4.2 billion, which is possible, but unlikely.)
Last edited by count55; 01-13-2012 at 09:15 AM.
Thanks count. Nothing beats having our own resident cap expert
I'm quite thrilled that Roy is proving me wrong. I love Roy, always have. His personality is irresistable.
However, he still needs to prove two things:
- that he doesn't drop off the second half the season like last year
- that he shows himself to be solid in the final minutes of games
If he proves to be able to accomplish those two things, I will gladly eat large plates of crow.
"I like our group of people," Ainge told USA Today. "I'm trying to teach them about basketball, and they're trying to teach me about analytics."
"Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel
"And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca
In todays paper the article on Hibbert said no discussions are taking place on Roy's contract extension. I see four reasons why.
1--Maximum cap flexibility
2--RFA(Pacers can match anything and will)
3--Next year can offer a 5 year deal which ties Roy up longer at a lower rate for an additional year
4--Possible block buster trade this year
Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.
"A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."
The rest of the article probably deserves its own thread. Interesting stuff about Hibbert's mindset change and strength training.The Pacers have until Jan. 25 to offer Hibbert a contract extension. He will be a restricted free agent if the sides don't agree to a deal by then. Pacers president Larry Bird said earlier this week the team has not begun talking about a new deal with Hibbert.
I have broken down the teams before and the reason why I think Hibbert won't have a huge market to get a max contract from another team. I'll post it again but its in the Hibbert extension thread.
Guess we just read the market differently though.
Dallas will certainly have enough room. They plan to go after Deron and Dwight. They'll salary dump one of Marion or Haywood, and amnesty the other. Of course, they'll go after a UFA first, but failing that? Agreed on Celts and Cavs as other major threats.
GSW can't amnesty Biedrins because they already used up their amnesty card on Charlie Bell (which was stupid). Rockets will certainly cut Dalembert though - he's been awful. Raptors desperately need a C - they're counting on their rookie Valanciunas but who knows how fast he develops. You didn't mention the Sixers, who would have max cap space if they amnesty Brand (and frankly I think they should), and they really need a reliable C more than anything else (unless they decide Hawes is their guy). Don't sleep on the Wiz - they badly need a culture change, and Hibbert is a Georgetown guy.
Just look at this past offseason when there were 3-5 teams going after the 3 major C's on the market. All three ended up with contracts starting at over $12m, and even DeAndre Jordan ended up with a nice payday.
I give Roy a lot of respect when he said that he didn't want to discuss the contract extension right now and will prefer to do this after the season. It just shows that he is focused on his playing performance rather than worrying about how much money her will make in the future.
The counter argument to this point is that the 2011 class was one of the weakest ever. The 2012 class with its RFA and FA is one of the stronger classes overall.
I mean look at it... Does Roy Hibberts name stand out among this list?
In the 2011 class it was..
I think Roy will get paid but I have looked at the teams in detail and many have pretty big holes to fill outside of the center position and their own RFA to resign as well.
Last edited by Gamble1; 01-13-2012 at 03:44 PM.