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Thread: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

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    Default Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/...or-celtics-win

    BOSTON -- Doc Rivers said it before the game. He repeated it after the game. The Celtics' coach looks at the Indiana Pacers and sees a younger version of the team he took to the NBA's promised land.

    "They've done a great job of adding pieces and adding them quickly," Rivers said. "It's amazing to me. It's like watching a young version of us. I know. I hate to say it. But they're young. They're scary. And they're good."

    Could you blame Doc Rivers if he'd rather have been patrolling the Pacers' bench Friday?

    That was before the Pacers went out and overwhelmed the Celtics 87-74, crushing them on the glass and pulling away down the stretch. You know, sort of what the Celtics have done every now and then to other teams over the past few years.

    "They were us," Rivers repeated afterward. "They knocked us off the block. They were the instigator the whole night, and all we did was whine and not retaliate."

    Rivers might be more prescient than he knows. Back in 2007-08, when Rivers was leading the Celtics to their 17th NBA championship, the Washington Wizards had a young scout by the name of Frank Vogel. From afar, Vogel watched how Rivers led the championship team, a team that used the word "ubuntu" to signify unity and sacrifice.

    Fast forward to Friday night at the Garden: Vogel is in his first full season as the coach of the Pacers. And after being told of Rivers' comments, he cracked a smile and said, "Well, we're trying to be them."

    He wasn't just blowing smoke. Before every practice and film session, Vogel said, he writes the word "togetherness" on the board. It's his version of ubuntu. And it's all because of Rivers.

    "One-hundred percent because of Doc," he said. "I don't know him very well, but the year they won the championship, I heard him use the word 'togetherness' about a million times. And what he did with that team was an inspiration to me, and I am trying my best to recreate that here [in Indiana]."

    Rivers loved what he saw Friday night -- from Indiana. His own group? Not so much. Paul Pierce made one shot from beyond 2 feet all night (he was 3-of-17.) The bench was brutal. The Pacers dominated the glass and had a 19-5 advantage in second-chance points.

    But what stuck out more than the individual stats was Indiana's resolve, determination and focus. The Pacers looked like an experienced, savvy, impervious-to-pressure group that wasn't afraid to throw its collective weight around.

    "They were in our air space," Rivers said, using a favorite term to describe inside advantage. "We always talk about owning the air space. That's who we are. And they were us -- for the entire game. I just thought they did it better than us."

    He's right. They did it much better. Indiana's penetration resulted in a lot of the second-chance opportunities, frustrating Kevin Garnett and Jermaine O'Neal. Even rookie Greg Stiemsma was, well, steamed.
    "It's tough when you play defense, and then something breaks down at the end and they get another shot," Stiemsma said. "But you gotta play through it. We just came up on the short end."

    What bothered Rivers as much or even more than his team's inability to rebound was his team's inability to generate anything more than a CYO-scale offense. The Celtics scored 14 points in the first quarter. They scored 25 in the first half, tying the franchise record for fewest points in a first or second half. They shot 39.4 percent for the game and had only 16 assists.

    "That is not us," Rivers said.

    Ideally, no. Of course it isn't. What Rivers yearns to see again might be a quixotic quest, but it is exactly what Vogel is trying to see on a regular basis from his Pacers who, by the way, are 5-2. Vogel is 38 but looks young enough to be carded at any bar. But if you listen to him, you hear Larry Brown or Red Holzman or, dare we say it, Doc Rivers, circa 2007?

    "Both last year [after replacing the fired Jim O'Brien] and this year, I have shown our guys what Boston Celtics selflessness is all about on tape, time and again," Vogel said. "They won a championship because of togetherness and teamwork. You play with physicality and toughness, and you win with defense and rebounding and sharing the ball."

    He paused and added, "That is what I want our identity to be."

    Friday night, the Pacers made the Celtics look old, slow and scattered. For one night anyway, it was exactly the role reversal Frank Vogel envisions -- and the one Doc Rivers hopes he doesn't see anymore.

    Longtime Celtics reporter Peter May is a frequent contributor to ESPNBoston.com.
    Last edited by docpaul; 01-07-2012 at 08:28 AM.

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    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Wow, that is a fantastic article.

    The Boston announcers last night said that Vogel talked to them about teaching Danny how to model his game after Paul Pierce; moving from being a "volume scorer" to a more efficient, better all-around player.

    Did anybody else hear that?
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    If we had an emoticon for "Schwing!", "Pitch a tent," etc., I'd be using it here.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Wow, that is a fantastic article.

    The Boston announcers last night said that Vogel talked to them about teaching Danny how to model his game after Paul Pierce; moving from being a "volume scorer" to a more efficient, better all-around player.

    Did anybody else hear that?
    Yeah. I heard that quote. I'm glad that Vogel DOES have an image that he's wanting for the Pacers. A youner version of the Boston Celtics...the thought gives me shivers.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Rivers has sooo much more knowledge compared to this Gundy guy.......
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by DEEman View Post
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    Rivers has sooo much more knowledge compared to this Gundy guy.......
    Haha ya i was gonna say the same thing. I always liked Doc, have a respect for him and its nice to see he has a respect for the Pacers.

    It also helps me like him that he went to a lot of IU games when his son played there.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    The celtics and how they play is exactly what we should be trying to recreate. Not sure we have the players, but we will see

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    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I like our team, but we just beat an old and tired Celtics team. Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Rajon Rondo and Ray Allen are all better talent than any of our players. Danny is our best player right now, and no one around the league would rank him as high as any of these players, except maybe Rondo. Perhaps now that they are old...but the Celtics aren't contenders now. We really still need more talent to be legitimate contenders.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    He talks about Ray Allen at the beginning but then gets into the part about the Pacers.


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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I loved the Celts D. Fascinating. It's like they threw a soft double at every single person who had the ball, and a triple when somebody got in the lane. But they never seemed to leave a man open. Great defensive rotations.
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Ainge needs to be blowing up the Celtics and start rebuilding. Their age is showing,. and they aren't going to win a championship with old players.

    Ray Allen coming off the bench as the scorer the Pacers need would be nice.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    Ainge needs to be blowing up the Celtics and start rebuilding. Their age is showing,. and they aren't going to win a championship with old players.

    Ray Allen coming off the bench as the scorer the Pacers need would be nice.
    Would be nice indeed if Allen also would choose for the 'money' in Indianapolis
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I'd kill to have Ray Ray finish his career here as a bench scorer and veteran presence. I don't doubt his ability to play at a super high level until he's at least 40, just like Reggie did.

    If he'd take the MLE to come star off our bench and add to our depth i'd take it and run, the guy is ageless, especially if you don't put the ball in his hands and force him to make plays. He'll be able to hit 3's running off screens until the day he can no longer walk.

    He is a Free Agent next year no? Hopefully by then we're looking like a team that could be a dark horse contender with a tweak or two, via PG, DC, and Hibby's continued improvement, D-West being back at full strength and DG breaking out of his ridiculously bad offensive slump.

    However given his comments about D-West who knows how he feels about signing with the little ole' pacers. Perhaps he'll join Miami or OKC and shamelessly ring chase.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I don't understand this, how we are a young version of them? a younger version of them together would have won at least 4 titles maybe more, KG,Ray and Pierce in their prime?

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    I don't understand this, how we are a young version of them? a younger version of them together would have won at least 4 titles maybe more, KG,Ray and Pierce in their prime?
    I believe he was more referring to style of play, but he also did stress that he sees us as a very good up and coming team. Vogel takes alot of inspiration from the way the C's played D in their hayday, and even though we're building a deeper team that has less star power and is more balanced it doesn't mean that we can't stylistically resemble the Celts championship squad.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I really want to play the Magic now.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Doc Rivers reminds me of Denzel Washington in Remember the Titans for some reason. I'm glad he isn't so ignorant that he can acknowledge talent when he sees it on another team.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    We better never have a punk like Garnett on our team that's all I know. I enjoy seeing a guy like him get old and become less effective with time. I like most of the rest of the Celtics, but him and JO both are on my list of players I hold disdain for. JO for admittedly quitting on us when we were paying him superstar money, and Garnett for sharing the dirtiest player in the league award with Noah.

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    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    This Frank Vogel thing just gets better and better.
    .

    .

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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    I fine with trying to emulate the Celtics as long as we don't duplicate the whining, cry baby, punk attitude act!

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    Much respect to Doc for acknowledging the Pacers. He's classy, unlike Van Gundy


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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Rivers isn't the only one from Bean Town to offer up praise for the Pacers. Bill Simmons has expressed his love of the Pacers, too.

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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    This Frank Vogel thing just gets better and better.
    "It won't last" -Flox






    Frank Vogel.

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  36. #24
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sleeze View Post
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    He talks about Ray Allen at the beginning but then gets into the part about the Pacers.

    Notice that Doc, though extremely gracious and diplomatic, in no way wanted to compare Granger to Pierce.

    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Doc Rivers: "It's like watching a younger version of us"

    Quote Originally Posted by Midcoasted View Post
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    We better never have a punk like Garnett on our team that's all I know. I enjoy seeing a guy like him get old and become less effective with time. I like most of the rest of the Celtics, but him and JO both are on my list of players I hold disdain for. JO for admittedly quitting on us when we were paying him superstar money, and Garnett for sharing the dirtiest player in the league award with Noah.
    Wait, what? That never happened.

    My beef with JO was that he was trying to do too much. When did he ever quit, let alone say so out loud? When he got to Toronto, did you see his play and think he was holding out on us?
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