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Thread: How would YOU fix the offense?

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    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
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    Default How would YOU fix the offense?

    We all can agree that the offense has been bad this year, or at the very least underwhelming. This isn't a thread to criticize the coaching staff or say they are doing things wrong. This isn't a thread where we preach patience and that in time, the offense will get better once we get more time together, etc. It's simply a thread where we throw out a few ideas that we think would jumpstart the offense a little.

    Personally, I think I'd like to see more cuts and movement without the ball. Say what you want about Dunleavy's defense, but his movement without the ball gave us a fair amount of easy baskets and imo, was the best part of his game. No one on this team seems to move well without the ball or make cuts. So I'd like to see us set up a few backdoor type of plays and see if we can't land a few easy buckets to get some confidence and rhythm going. Also, I know we aren't built to run, but I'd like to see us push the tempo on occasion to try to get some transition buckets. Anything to give the offense a little jolt. Anyone else have any thoughts?

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    Let PG Fly Again Soon! ECKrueger's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Never play Dahntay.

    Kidding. I think movement and passing certainly need to be emphasized. Also, I think a few days off and a few practices to actually get some offensive plays in would be helpful.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I would have the players constantly moving. Whether it be making cuts, setting a pick, or whatever, just move, and move with purpose. I would also have the team study angles.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Run it through West and Hibbert 80 percent of the time up the floor. Paul George can create with the other 20. Tell Danny Granger never to shoot off the dribble. Emphasize him moving without the ball, and get him open looks.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Some cuts would be nice, it seems like we fail to pass on quite a few of them when available in these first 6 games. The biggest thing will be hit some wide open shots we have had countless missed wide open jumpers and tons of bunnies roll off.

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    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Another problem I think we have is that we really don't have many good passers on the team. DC isn't a great passer, Hill isn't either. Hibbert is pretty good for a big man. Really, our best passers were McRoberts and Dunleavy last year, and obviously they are both gone.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Another problem I think we have is that we really don't have many good passers on the team. DC isn't a great passer, Hill isn't either. Hibbert is pretty good for a big man. Really, our best passers were McRoberts and Dunleavy last year, and obviously they are both gone.
    This is what I was most worried about with this team. We got rid of all of the players who were good at the complimentary aspect of basketball, in favor for individual players.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I don't think the offense is the issue a lot of the time. We're getting open looks, or maybe more appropriately people are getting open, but we're bobbling passes, missing layups, short on our open jumpers. The shots and the open men are there, we're just not executing IMHO.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Get a better floor general that can better run the offense, create for others and is a dead-eye passer.....trade DC+1st for Nash
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Let me tell you this, everyone that said they didn't want Rajon Rondo on this team should re-examine whether they really like basketball or not.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Little to no movement without the ball way to often is their main problem.
    Nobody slipping the baseline.
    Need to slip the key more often.
    Very few Pick & Pops.
    Need more defined Pick and Rolls, just weakly performed leaving DC with no executable pass.
    Almost no multiple rotations, double screens to create slips.
    Also, their angles are not good at times when they do pick and roll which causes problems for DC to get the pass off in time, sometimes it's just good defense that causes the problem.

    I know if they could implement, increase, precisely execute basic basketball plays that they will get better opportunities. The way they play causes to many post ups and one on one situations that they can't perform at a good rate. They get plenty of jump shots but can't hit at a high rate. The more plays they can implement the more opportunities for easier, closer shots.
    Last edited by Pacer Fan; 01-05-2012 at 12:21 AM.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I'd trade for Steve Nash and give him the ball.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I'd be drilling the **** out of how to properly and quickly feed the post, for starters. I'd do everything possible to stop anyone from keeping their head down while they dribble. Ditto for just making basic read and reacts within our sets. Ditto for setting GOOD picks on PnRs and off ball.

    Otherwise, I'd look over the tape at every major way opposing defenses disrupt our action, then drill like crazy reading and reacting to them.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I would make a rule that if you look to make a post pass and hesitate or pull it back, that you have to run laps. Honestly, turning it over would be better than this, "Am I gonna pass it to Roy/David? I dunno, should I? What do you guys think?" BS, we currently seem to do.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Also, I'd basically look up Sacramento's greatest hits with regards to plays they ran to get Peja open shots off the ball... and run them all for Danny. Sometimes for Paul.

    Also, keep practing various pick and roll/pop scenarios.

    Fine Roy Hibbert every time he chooses to take it up softly instead if strong.

    Rather than bring the ball back top key when a wing post feed isn't available, run a pick and roll with said wing and post while the other 3 space.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Well it would help if we didn't take PG and D-West off the floor so early that they can't get any rhythm going.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac View Post
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    Run it through West and Hibbert 80 percent of the time up the floor. Paul George can create with the other 20. Tell Danny Granger never to shoot off the dribble. Emphasize him moving without the ball, and get him open looks.
    While I agree on Danny, have you seen PG handle the ball?

    I think the pick and roll is our most effective weapon, but when it is run the spacing is usually quite bad. I also think we could take some emphasis of always having Roy set up for three seconds, the passer take another two seconds to pass into the post, have the pass deflected right back to the passer, set Roy up again, pass it too hard, have Roy wait for the obvious-not-going-to-get-the-pass-back cut, and then make a predictable move. Roy isn't too bad at finishing on the move; I think moving him and Fluff around, setting up for 10-12 footers and cuts to the basket that could end in dunks or fouls would be good options too.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Call less pick and roll and have more picks off ball. Also don't have Hibbert come in on pick and rolls, have him stay down low someone set a pick for him to help him get to his spot and then dump it in. Also Dwest and Tyler should set some high screens to people offball so we have a chance to pass to that player cutting off the screen or we can just give it to Dwest or Tyler at the high post where they can be effective.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    how would i fix the offense?

    http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?t=67974

    hibbert and west should not be starting at the same time.

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    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Another problem I think we have is that we really don't have many good passers on the team. DC isn't a great passer, Hill isn't either. Hibbert is pretty good for a big man. Really, our best passers were McRoberts and Dunleavy last year, and obviously they are both gone.
    Yeah, this is the big one IMO. Not much the Pacers can do about it barring a trade. Playing AJ could help the second unit a bit. But as a team we really lack playmaking - doesn't help that Granger and Hans are below average passers (abysmally so in Hans' case).

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Also, I'd basically look up Sacramento's greatest hits with regards to plays they ran to get Peja open shots off the ball... and run them all for Danny. Sometimes for Paul.
    Not sure how well that would work. Both Granger and George strike me as better stand-still shooters than catch-and-shoot types. For Danny, I agree with Sookie that posting him up might be the best option.
    Last edited by wintermute; 01-05-2012 at 06:41 AM.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    As I said in the game thread, feed Hibbert the ball, tell George to attack the basket, and everyone else needs to wait for the pass. Personally, running the offense through Collison, George, and Hibbert if you DON'T have any set plays seems to be our best option. Most importantly...tell Granger to STOP chucking shots like he Superman. Everyone is chcuking shots here and there, but Granger is chucking them without any thought to the rebounding positioning of his teammates, or he unable to finish a play when he drives to the hole.

    Lastly....everyone needs to make 1000 jumpers at the next practice. I originally said 500, but our players are STILL missing shots BAD even when they're open.

    I'm still on the fence whether it's the offensive plays or poor shooting in general. Neither one seems to be more glaring than the other.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I would identify a legitimate NBA point guard whose primary skill is ball distribution, and go and get him, whether by trade, signing, whatever. Then, I think the offense will be significantly improved.

    Of course, that's how I would fix the offense, but making that change would have a significant impact on the defense, transition game, substitution patterns, and the future of the team. Don't ask me how to fix the offense and also take care of those things too.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I really don't think it matters. IMHO it comes down to the players right now. They're simply unwilling to move the ball to their teammates, or make the routine plays that NBA players should make.

    These are grown *** men, you can't force them or trick them into doing what you want them to do, if they don't want to do it.



    What would I do? Watch the game film without talking, and then have a big *** mirror and ask them to take a nice hard look.

    I would design a special spot just for Danny, with a bench chair sitting right in front. If he isn't smart enough to figure out his passing problems, then he should get comfortable in that chair.

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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    I think we do have a point guard problem....whenever DC goes to the bench. I don't think Hill is a point, and I would only give Lance garbage time minutes, or keep him as a wing.

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    Eating some cranbaisins The Sleeze's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would YOU fix the offense?

    Someone needs to tell Collison that when he comes of a pick he needs to rub shoulders with the pick setter's defender and angle towards the basket so that he has a good passing angle.

    Every ****ing time he comes off a pick he goes back towards half court, letting the defender easily stop him, giving himself no angle to pass, and allowing the pick setter's defender to recover. It's extremely frustrating. Not to mention they run one pick and then look surprised that it didn't work and seem lost after that.

    SO to summarize: better pacing, better angles, better spacing, more movement, more screens, more cuts, better passing.......and also can someone remind Roy that he is over 7 ****ing feet tall and he is allowed to dunk it.

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