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Thread: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by PurduePacer View Post
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    I was disappointed he got hurt too. I really wanted him to hit that one nice lay up attempt he had.
    It's gotta happen. We've taken all the slasher out of him and he's now looking to pass too much. The guy is a shooting guard. We are completely ruining whatever chance he has to be a valuable player for us just because Bird or Vogel or someone in the Pacers organization has a wet dream about a 6'5" point guard.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    Let me throw some dap to my lone bright spot tonight...Lance. I was very disappointed to see him get hurt, as honestly I thought his first stint tonight was the most under control he has played on both sides of the ball. He also looks a lot better to me when he gets to play off the ball, like he was tonight. If you noticed in Lance's short time on the floor, Hill was getting the team into the offense, and then we were letting Lance try and create off the dribble, once everyone was in the right place. And IMO, he looked at his best doing that. If he's going to succeed, it's time for the Lance as a PG adventure to end. Let him be a wing, and I think you'll see him vastly improve. My one criticism tonight of Lance? He had his man beaten off the dribble more than once and immediately looked up for the pass, even when he probably could have made an easier move for a score. I'm almost begging at this point...let Lance play SG full time...please, for the love of God.
    I have wanted Lance to play SG/SF his whole time here. I though/think the Pacers are doing him a disservice playing him at pg which isn't his position.

    my ideal Lance lineup

    George Hill

    Lance

    Paul or Danny or Lance(with Hill or someone else at SG I think he can play the SF JMO but it helps hide his lack of lateral quickness on defense. Which ever match up is best he should guard the 2 or the 3 based on that.)

    West or Tyler

    whoever at C

    Lance and Dantay should not play together IMO I just don't like how the offense flows with the 2 of them are in together.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Smith View Post
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    what the HELL happened???
    I think a few of our guys forgot to protect the promise

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    It was just a horrible performance on both sides of the ball. Honestly, one of the poorer performances I can remember in recent memory. It wasn't even that the team was missing shots (which they clearly were), they was just no continuity or teamwork between anyone which was compounded by a lack of effort and heart sans maybe Amundson. This team has to do the little things if they want to beat a team like Miami, and there was none of that.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Doddage View Post
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    No coincidence that our mini-comeback was thwarted when we took out DC.
    Agreed, offense is a garbage disposal when Hill or Lance (play them at the 2!) is running the point.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    3rd or 4th year? I don't think Vogel will finish the season if the next 20 games are no better then the last 6, let alone a 3rd or 4th year!
    So if Vogel is 13-7ish (our pace if we keep up this 4-2 start) Vogel's gonna get canned? That would surely be an interesting move by Larry.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    The only big, fat, positive * I would stick on all of this bad play is the effect of the lockout. It truly is devastating in terms of cutting off the staff from communicating with the players while they work/develop over the summer, we had a super condensed preseason/camp with a roster that wasn't even finished yet, and this is all with a new staff with a new system. That is BRUTAL. Especially since it's not a veteran head coach or roster.

    Then the lockout continues to hurt with this crammed schedule which basically forces real games to substitute for some of our would-be practice and rest time, and every game is more important than usual, which magnifies everything.

    I say none of that to be an excuse; it's not! BUT, it's a very valid, very real, partial, explanation for what is going on here, I think.

    It's almost tragic to me that it had to be this way instead of the usual summer and schedule.

    Oh well...

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    The only big, fat, positive * I would stick on all of this bad play is the effect of the lockout. It truly is devastating in terms of cutting off the staff from communicating with the players while they work/develop over the summer, we had a super condensed preseason/camp with a roster that wasn't even finished yet, and this is all with a new staff with a new system. That is BRUTAL. Especially since it's not a veteran head coach or roster.

    Then the lockout continues to hurt with this crammed schedule which basically forces real games to substitute for some of our would-be practice and rest time, and every game is more important than usual, which magnifies everything.

    I say none of that to be an excuse; it's not! BUT, it's a very valid, very real, partial, explanation for what is going on here, I think.

    It's almost tragic to me that it had to be this way instead of the usual summer and schedule.

    Oh well...
    I don't see how anyone could argue with this. Just ask the Celtics or Mavericks or heck the slow starting Lakers, how about the Knicks who just let Boris Diaw hang 27 on them? However, this is also what the players deserve when they decided to make their little stand.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Also, I wish Wade would have played tonight.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Here is an odd stat to lighten the mood after getting ran out of the building. This was Tyler's 3rd career game making 10 or more FT but the second time its happened in Miami and is now 30 of 32 or 94% career in FT against them.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    If you watched the first five games of the season, you probably thought this kind of game was coming sooner rather than later. As much as I hate to lose (to the Heat; by 35; to a team missing it's best player), I think this is exactly the result this team needed at this time.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Are Granger and George the poorest dribbling 2 and 3 tandem in the league? Seriously, it's like someone coated the basketball with soap suds tonight.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    I'm having serious questions about Granger and whether his game has hit some wall or whether he has some issues with the team in some way and it's affecting his game.

    I lost a lot of respect for Granger last season when at the end of a clock after a timeout he clearly was pissed about something and not even trying to be involved. Some Granger defenders defended him saying he was just a decoy for the play and his role was to force someone out to cover him. Well, if he was a decoy he should've at least acted like he was going to get the ball in a position to shoot or attack the basket. ...Instead he looked like he was waiting for the clock to hit zeros so he could go watch TV or something.

    This was with Vogel as coach.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    One other thing tonight showed us, it's so sad from a legacy stand point that Lebron decided to try and buddy cop it up with Wade in Miami. He is amazing when he gets to constantly have the ball in his hands and create, I know he's kind of a prima donna or whatever, but jeez, is there a skill this guy doesn't have? I mean really, tonight was a crescendo of a performance by him. 33 points on 21 shots, 13 assists, 8 boards.

    I know Miami probably has a boner for Wade, but god I'd Herschel Walker trade his *** to some other team. I firmly believe that the "Lebron isn't clutch" theory would get blown out of the water if he didn't have to share the ball with another ball dominant perimeter player, but alas, Le King sold that down the river. Too bad...he could have had something magical in New York with Amare.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
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    If you watched the first five games of the season, you probably thought this kind of game was coming sooner rather than later. As much as I hate to lose (to the Heat; by 35; to a team missing it's best player), I think this is exactly the result this team needed at this time.
    Wade is not better than Lebron.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    I can't think much more about the unmitigated disaster that was this game. I'm going to bed and in the morning I'm placing an embargo on myself from talking about anything related to this *****-tastic performance. However, if we come out flat against Boston...so help me God, fire may rain from the sky.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    The sky is not falling, we had a horrible night but I always say never get too high on the ups and never get too low on the downs. It was only one game to one of the best teams in the league on the road. Let's see how they come out against Boston. If it were me I'd come out there with a chip on my shoulder and a bit pissed off about tonights game.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    One other thing tonight showed us, it's so sad from a legacy stand point that Lebron decided to try and buddy cop it up with Wade in Miami. He is amazing when he gets to constantly have the ball in his hands and create, I know he's kind of a prima donna or whatever, but jeez, is there a skill this guy doesn't have? I mean really, tonight was a crescendo of a performance by him. 33 points on 21 shots, 13 assists, 8 boards.

    I know Miami probably has a boner for Wade, but god I'd Herschel Walker trade his *** to some other team. I firmly believe that the "Lebron isn't clutch" theory would get blown out of the water if he didn't have to share the ball with another ball dominant perimeter player, but alas, Le King sold that down the river. Too bad...he could have had something magical in New York with Amare.
    I had thought Chicago was his best option... And that was before DRose was a MVP candidate... That would have been his magical option... They were the 2 best players in the league last year... I think the Bulls sending him a pair of Jordan's with a note asking him if he could fill those shoes scared him off... When it comes to an everyday challenge LeBron is as head strong as the come... But when his legacy is on the line he seems to choke... Especially in big Playoff series sans Detroit in I believe his 3rd year...

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    I don't expect us to look good against Boston. They've been looking pretty solid since Pierce came back and I doubt they let us end their winning streak. Hopefully we can show some effort and make it competitive.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    No, they are about par, just played a better offensive team that the defense couldn't stop. offense was par.
    Nope... Not par... Season lows in FG% (34.8) Assists (12) and Turn Overs (23) seem to indicate otherwise... And Miami is not even that great of a defensive team... We just had no flow to our offensive game... And I was hoping we were getting on track there after our last game... There were so many errant passes and poor dribbling choices from many of our players (not just Paulie and Danny) that I thought I might throw up...

    Also... That was the flat out worst game I've ever seen Granger play... Especially against the Heat... He killed us tonight... HORRIBLE shot selection...

    I also feel like some very tough calls were made on our two PFs tonight...

    Just an overall bad night... I don't think we could have beat Washington tonight...

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    The good news is this could be our slump during the season we typically have. Last year after Vogel took over we had a 6 game skid and even got blown out to the timberwolves. Everyone on this board knows that this Pacers team can play better and that they will play better. My theory is that were having our slump to start the season as oppose to later on, also having all these road games early doesn't help. But I believe soon this Pacers team will be back on track and play consistent good basketball. If a team is slumping and they go 4-2 while slumping you gotta be happy about that. Hopefully we bounce back Friday against the Celtics and play to expectations.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Nothing happened, we just could not hit our shots, everybody looked good and I don't think we need to worry about anything, Lebron was also playing out of his mind and that never happens so next time we should be ok
    To be honest, I have to agree with most of what vnzla has pointed out.

    We've been playing terribly throughout this young season. We could be 3-3 as well if not for Irving's missed layup at the buzzer.
    Actually, we've had one good game so far (Nets).

    The other wins were partly hard to watch and it often looked like two lottery teams were playing.

    West may certainly be a personality in the locker room, but I think his performance leaves a lot to be desired. Lots of turnovers, not a real one-on-one presence against his defenders, and especially when they double-team him, he (or the whole team) has problems to get the ball to the open man.

    I've never really liked Dunleavy but I think he'd be much more valuable to the team than Dahntay. Ball sharing, offensive flow has been horrible, if not non-existent so far.

    Well, I don't know. I understand the team needs some time and I'm definitely not in panic mode, but I'm also everything else than impressed by the Pacers' play so far.
    Thank you Jeff.

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Let's just say that Danny should never be driving to the bucket. The team just needs to learn how to pass the ball. You could see they were trying it at the beginning of the second half and it helped a bit. They just don't have it down yet. Guys who should be driving include GHill, Collison, Lance, DJ (when he's in), Price and maybe Paul at times. Danny really should be used to stretch the floor. I feel dirty saying that since I hate JOb ball.

    Really, I think Vogel is trying to go to the rack as much as possible but some players don't have that skill. Unlike Jim, I expect Frank to learn from that.
    I disagree here. Danny can make some impressive drives. He just needs to do it at the right times. It's not a talent problem or even a judgement problem. It's a discipline problem. Danny just stubbornly wants to drive when there's no opportunity. And he needs to stop.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    One thing I seriously wonder is if Collison can be "an extension of the coach" on the floor. Really, the issue with this team is its ability to execute the offense. This doesn't take a great amount of skill. It takes practice, a willingness to share the ball and simply a lot of hard work. This is the problem. It can be solved. But still, I do worry about our PG situation. It's not terrible but everything starts right there. We need to see if one of them can adequately get the offensive flow started.
    I am one of the biggest Collison critics on this board. But you have to give him credit for his performance last night. He was the only one bringing game to the floor, he hit some big shots, and he was the big key to an almost comeback in the 3rd quarter.

    That said, it is true that he can't stop his man on defense (and that may not be very fixable). It is also true that he is not a floor general and doesn't see the floor that well, although to his credit he has been very different so far this year in his clear focus on passing the ball around instead of looking for his own shot.

    We need a true playmaker/point guard. But Collison's effort and improvement so far this year is making the wait a little less painful.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: Heat/Pacers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    I'm having serious questions about Granger and whether his game has hit some wall or whether he has some issues with the team in some way and it's affecting his game.
    Granger's performance was troubling, in my opinion.

    Don't you have to figure that West's line about "no more going one on one" had to do with Granger? Because that's what Danny kept trying to do again and again last night.

    Danny clearly does not trust the rest of the team. Now, part of the reason for this is the rest of the team can't create a shot. TPTB either needs to acquire a playmaker or develop a better offense.

    Nevertheless, Danny Granger needs to be more mature than this. He needs to pass the ball, work the offense, look for true opportunities to score rather than force utter crap against two and three defenders early in the shot clock—which he did several times last night.

    Part of this was panic. We started getting behind and Danny starting throwing up crap in desperation. So his problems are not only trust, but also being mentally weak, not having the patience to grind out a comeback the correct way.

    Let's hope to God that David West gets in his grill and has some talks with him.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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