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Thread: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

  1. #51

    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    People don't get on DJ because he's "off" people get mad at him because he does the same thing over and over again, consistently a black hole, and his defense has also declined.

    21 year olds are expected to be inconsistent, DJ is very, very much set in his ways.
    i don't understand the dahntay hate. like you said, dahntay is what he is. he does what he does. the coaches know what to expect when they play him. the reason he is in the game doing what he does is because vogel wants him in the game doing what he does.

    getting mad a dahntay for his play is like being mad at foster for not shooting well. these guys are NBA veteran role players. they do what they do. be mad at the coach for playing them if you want, but don't expect them to play any different. they are what they are. to expect any different is silly.

  2. #52
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    I'm a pretty big Dahntay supporter. I see a lot of good he does. I think he's a good teammate. I think he's a good intangible/bother the other team guy. I think he's intense and plays hard at all times and I'd like the younger guys to emulate those aspects of Dahntay.

    and sure, vets can have bad games. But Dahntay plays like this every game. He's a ball stopper. If he'd change that and play within his limits he'd be fine.
    My problem with Dahntay is his offensive mentality. In the 2nd quarter, two plays in a row mind you, he grabbed the defensive rebound, dribbled the length of the court and took it to the rim (and missed) without a single pass or even looking to pass. I'm not sure why he doesn't get pulled in these moments.

    He's a great defensive player and I love his intensity, but he shouldn't be allowed to run the offense or ignore our point guards. That should be on the coaches for not calling him out though.

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  4. #53
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    SO exciting we are 3-0! Was a great game to be at. New Years Eve tomorrow I and feel like I should take the fiancee out to dinner or something....but the Pacers are playing, why would I want to miss this game so I can wait an hour+ at some restaurant.

    Hard to come away from this game with much. Paul George picked up 2 early fouls and that basically took him out the game. Infact I think the whole team was picking up some really bad foul calls. I couldn't believe some of the crap they called. Hard to get into an offensive rhythm like that.

    I think the offense is gonna be okay, Guys are getting open shots. Tyler and West are just not hitting their open jumpers off the pick n pops. Lots of guys just missing good shots. Offense is clicking for the most part. Guards arent getting around the Picks very well though, and I think the picks are coming too late, and guys just aren't setting enough screens for each other.
    Last edited by graphic-er; 12-30-2011 at 11:39 PM.
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  5. #54
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    I will say that David West looks like the calmest guy on the court in crunch time. He's been there. Doesn't panic or take ill advised shots (ahem, Danny). I love him. His defense is better than advertised as well.

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  7. #55

    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Someone made a comment in the game thread how terrible Varejao was. He had what I consider an off game, yet he was

    5-10 FG... 4-7 FT... 13 REB... 1 BS... 1 STL... 14 PTS

    I was surprised at his #'s, and couldn't believe he had 13 rebs when the Pacers had 3 players in double digit rebs and 60 rebs overall.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    Infact I think the whole team was picking up some really bad foul calls. I couldn't believe some of the crap they called.
    I've seen JV game refs do a better job than the guys we had tonight. There was a reason Area55 broke out the Donaghy chant that got us in trouble!
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    I agree that Dahntay seems to believe that 'shooting guard' means he's supposed to shoot when the ball comes to him.

    But in his defense, he had the highest fg% of any of our wings last year, and the second highest Points-per-Shot on the team....so maybe this IS a guy you want to put the ball up??
    [~]) ... Cheers! Go Pacers!

  10. #58

    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    I was sort of upset with our defense tonight. I thought it wasn't that great. I'm sure it was mostly because of the stupid fouls/PG sitting.

    The offense still obviously needs fixing. I think we're going to need a shooter, unless Hill starts making jump shots. But I also think that offense tends to take longer than defense, we haven't had that much time to gell, and playing hard will often get the win.

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  12. #59
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Watching the end of regulation break on the TV replay. The guys are really tuned into and focused during that time out. Talk through their game plan. I did not see that the past 4 years.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

  13. #60
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    These officials were ****, Hill gets hit off the rebound in OT and does the freaking splits on the floor and no call.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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  15. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
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    i don't understand the dahntay hate. like you said, dahntay is what he is. he does what he does. the coaches know what to expect when they play him. the reason he is in the game doing what he does is because vogel wants him in the game doing what he does.

    getting mad a dahntay for his play is like being mad at foster for not shooting well. these guys are NBA veteran role players. they do what they do. be mad at the coach for playing them if you want, but don't expect them to play any different. they are what they are. to expect any different is silly.

    I noticed Dahntay hitting those 2 FT, the short jumper, or took a charge. I guess those don't count. Only the negative things he does counts. Yes, he makes mistakes, but he's what Bird wanted so complain about Bird signing him. Just keep in mind Dahntay wouldn't be here if it wasn't for Bird.

    I find it ironic that posters talk about how Jimmy's negative influence thwarted Rush and Mcbob, but who was in Jimmy's doghouse all last year. Maybe just maybe Jimmy's negativism has influenced Dahntay's game as well. Maybe Dahntay feels he has to immediately make an impact once in the game in order to get any playing time.

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  17. #62
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    Someone made a comment in the game thread how terrible Varejao was. He had what I consider an off game, yet he was

    5-10 FG... 4-7 FT... 13 REB... 1 BS... 1 STL... 14 PTS

    I was surprised at his #'s, and couldn't believe he had 13 rebs when the Pacers had 3 players in double digit rebs and 60 rebs overall.
    I actually lost respect for him, he hits the floor in the 1st like he broke his ankle, clutch and grimacing in pain. Then gets up and runs down the floor no problem.

    Then he lands on his back and acts he landed on a spike. I'm sure it hurt, but he is an actor if I ever seen one.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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  19. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I will say that David West looks like the calmest guy on the court in crunch time. He's been there. Doesn't panic or take ill advised shots (ahem, Danny). I love him. His defense is better than advertised as well.
    Plus he talking to the players constantly pointing things out... invaluable veteran leadership.

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  21. #64
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    And I must say what a relief it was to see Hill come alive, and actually look like he was happy and enjoying be back in Indy.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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  23. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    I noticed Dahntay hitting those 2 FT, the short jumper, or took a charge. I guess those don't count. Only the negative things he does counts. Yes, he makes mistakes, but he's what Bird wanted so complain about Bird signing him. Just keep in mind Dahntay wouldn't be here if it wasn't for Bird.

    I find it ironic that posters talk about how Jimmy's negative influence thwarted Rush and Mcbob, but who was in Jimmy's doghouse all last year. Maybe just maybe Jimmy's negativism has influenced Dahntay's game as well. Maybe Dahntay feels he has to immediately make an impact once in the game in order to get any playing time.
    great truth here. jmo, but way too many posters see what they want to see. i don't think JOB has anything to do with this, myself. dahntay is playing the way frank wants him to play. when frank doesn't want what dahntay brings, he takes him out.

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  25. #66
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Hill is turning out to be a very important component. He was used to guard Irving at times and did a good job. Roy was also playing more aggressively. Perhaps he read that trash about Varejao being the better player.

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  27. #67
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    ...Varejao has never had a season with a stat line as good as he had tonight. He had a very good game...

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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    i hate complaining about officials but i agree that they were just awful tonight.

    not sure why West and Hansbrough were missing all those jumpers they usually hit. oh well, West made up for it at the end.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    also the Pacers tweeted something very interesting

    "After losing 31 straight games in which they shot less than 40% from the floor, the Pacers have won all three such games this season."

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  31. #70
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    I actually lost respect for him, he hits the floor in the 1st like he broke his ankle, clutch and grimacing in pain. Then gets up and runs down the floor no problem.

    Then he lands on his back and acts he landed on a spike. I'm sure it hurt, but he is an actor if I ever seen one.
    Yeah, I noticed that too and I'm sitting at that end a few rows up, so I saw his "I've been murdered" twisting and thrashing. You'd have thought they were going to need a stretcher.

    That's fine if it slows you or you go to the locker room for a tape up or ice. But 2 minutes later you are running around like nothing happened. Sheesh, man up already.



    I agree CDash about West. Calm and in control, but also an incredible WILL TO WIN. Guys all want to win, but this is different. This is not getting mad or being calm, because he's neither really.
    West wants to win and knows what it's going to take to make it happen, so he just goes after it. I mean he almost lost the ball at the end before turning it into a great score so he's not just so good that he will win.

    It's more about the attitude that helped him recover when he did lose the ball with no timeouts, the team behind and time running out. The will and the calm are what allow him to recover and get it done. He's a winner, like it's a skill. He's going to be fully running this team by season's end.



    Hill was a beast, especially on defense. What a great game for him, overshadowed only by West's incredible plays down the stretch. Hill made a couple of incredible anticipation steals and got that late jump ball which became a "steal" when they won the jump.


    Roy, Tyler and Danny were all great in ways that normally would stand out were it not for what Hill and West did. Danny in OT was huge and both Roy and Tyler had several hard fought tough plays that came just when they were needed.



    The win was ugly, it was the kind of defensive team, physical, tough win that playoff teams pull out. They've got to figure out the offensive inconsistencies and Vogel is going to have to expand the plays to go deeper than 1-2 attack points deep. But having a low post attack, defense and rebounding is what allows them to have these chances to win despite dry spells on offense.



    It's nice that DC and Paul can have modest games (though both had great moments too) and the team can get by pretty well anyway. I don't think they have great depth, but they do have great balance among the main 7 (DC, Hill, George, Danny, West, Tyler, Roy).




    Sorry Sookie, can't agree on DJones. I mean I do see him make some plays and I don't expect big talent output from a bench guy, but the freaking full court drives into blocked or missed shots without even looking for help (as others mentioned) is not acceptable. He's vet enough to know better. If he would just get over the "I must take it to the hole now that I've touched it" offensive approach his game would be dramatically better. He does draw some fouls but he turns it over or comes up empty more than he draws fouls, and he kills the flow by not getting others involved.

    I could actually become a fan if he could fix this issue, but it seems to be a running theme.

    The difference here vs other JOB-effect players is that he's never shown any other offensive mentality. Rush, Josh, Roy, Tyler, George - these guys did things and you wondered what JOB was looking at when he complained or benched them, and then that got into their heads.
    Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 12-31-2011 at 12:23 AM.

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  33. #71
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Irving is going to be really really good. In two years he'll be mentioned with Chris Paul and Derrick Rose as the best point guards in the nba.

    I think George Hill is our best defensive player, especially off the ball he is great
    Hill and West seem to have the 2 highest awareness factors on the team. If West had his shot dialed in he'd be putting up huge numbers, and much of what he is doing is based on purely reading the floor.

    Hill is going to push DC for playing time/starts, but we suspected this might be the case. Mostly it should help push DC to be his very best, which is a good thing.

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  35. #72

    Exclamation Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    Sorry Sookie, can't agree on DJones. I mean I do see him make some plays and I don't expect big talent output from a bench guy, but the freaking full court drives into blocked or missed shots without even looking for help (as others mentioned) is not acceptable. He's vet enough to know better. If he would just get over the "I must take it to the hole now that I've touched it" offensive approach his game would be dramatically better. He does draw some fouls but he turns it over or comes up empty more than he draws fouls, and he kills the flow by not getting others involved.

    I could actually become a fan if he could fix this issue, but it seems to be a running theme.

    The difference here vs other JOB-effect players is that he's never shown any other offensive mentality. Rush, Josh, Roy, Tyler, George - these guys did things and you wondered what JOB was looking at when he complained or benched them, and then that got into their heads.

    Well really, that's what I mean. I get annoyed at him. His faults are unacceptable. But I like him. I appreciate him, and see what Vogel probably sees. But I like him even more when he's doing that cheerleading thing on the bench.

    And obviously I'd prefer Dahntay sit. The alternative to Dahntay playing is Price playing. Clearly I prefer the latter.

  36. #73
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    I'm a pretty big Dahntay supporter. I see a lot of good he does. I think he's a good teammate. I think he's a good intangible/bother the other team guy. I think he's intense and plays hard at all times and I'd like the younger guys to emulate those aspects of Dahntay.

    and sure, vets can have bad games. But Dahntay plays like this every game. He's a ball stopper. If he'd change that and play within his limits he'd be fine.
    I totally agree with you on what Inferno does.....as I have continually said....he's the type of Player that Bird looks for to have on the Team for the very reasons that you listed above.......he knows what he's capable of on the defensive end.....however, I think that Inferno sometimes doesn't know his own limitations ( he's not that great on the offensive end most of the time ). Earlier in the 1st half....he tried to do his imitation of Kobe and it resulted in at least 2 lost possessions. After awhile, I don't think that he tried to create on the offensive end on his own....but took shots that were passed to him ( which I'm okay with ).

    As you said..as long as he plays within his own game and limitations on the offensive end...he's fine.....but when he doesn't, he has to "police" himself and Vogel has to reign him in.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    And I must say what a relief it was to see Hill come alive, and actually look like he was happy and enjoying be back in Indy.

    Yeah, George doesn't want to be here. Hopefully tonight is the end of that whole discussion. He's coming out of his slump.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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  39. #75
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    Default Re: Pacers/Cavaliers postgame thread

    I thought Hill was our best player tonight

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