I'd consider if it the deal were Roy+Tyler+DC OR Hill+picks. I'm not giving up George, and if you give up Granger that defeats the purpose of winning this year. I actually think if we somehow landed Howard without gutting our team that we could be successful enough for him to maybe, possibly, consider wanting to stay. West, Granger, George, DC/Hill is as good as any supporting cast he had in Orlando. That said, it's too risky.
The Tyler+Roy+DC for Howard+Nelson works on the trade machine
This just made me throw up in my mouth. If this was Shaq in his prime, sure I'd consider it. Because odds are Shaq in his prime would win us a championship or at least get us to one. As good as Howard is, he is nowhere even close to the league of Shaq, and never will be. Sure maybe his defense and rebounding are close to Shaq's, but his offensive game will never even be close.
Dwight Howard just really isn't that dominant. He can't win in Orlando, and he won't win here. He is nowhere near the level of Shaq and never will be. Only a big man the caliber of Shaq would be worth it, and there are none in the NBA today that are that good.
So we trade away all of our talent for 22 games and odds we really wouldn't be much better of a team. Orlando would want to rob us. They can keep their greedy asses in cap/lottery hell. SVG said last year we are a sub .500 team because JOB was a good coach and our players suck basically. I really called him out. JOB was holding our players and team back, and not the other way around. So I really hope they burn down there for that smart *** comment.
I also HATE how last year after their first meeting, Dwight wouldn't even give Roy a slither of love for improving his game either. This dude is everything what is wrong with the sport and I hope that any player that makes millions of dollars and thinks they can just muscle their way to a big market fails. I hope he never wins a ring and I sure don't want it to be here.
Big middle finger to this idea. Please no more trade our good young talent for a Howard rental, or Granger and Hansbrough for EJ or whatever it is people are talking. Seriously, every trade idea I have seen lately makes us worse. Mayo is not that good, Nash should just retire, I would take Paul George and Granger 10 times out of 10 over EJ, and trading our young core for 22 games of Howard and being left with a huge gap in talent for years to come are the worst ideas ever.
i think we are a championship team without him. I think it all matters on the chemistry. We are going to surprise a lot of people this year.
Orlando has to be willing to accept a low ball offer from a possible rental team. From us, that's Hibbert, a future first, and anyone not named Paul George. If they want more, they can move on to the next team.
Just a thought: We could lower the price of what we would have to give up if we were willing to take back Hedo Turkoglu in the deal.
Edit: Maybe lower the value would be the better way of putting it.
Last edited by cdash; 12-30-2011 at 02:12 PM.
It's an interesting philosophical question for small market teams, really. The question is: since you know you are small market and only get a shot at the title every once in awhile, do you go "all in" with a big move like this, or hope your "building from within" plan works over the long term? It's the Florida Marlins question, right?
I agree with the earlier comment that it would be better to have a team that is good enough to compete for EC Finals over a 3-5 year stretch, than to have one big year and another stretch of rebuilding.
However, if there is a way to combine the two ideas - make a "big splash" without necessarily trading away so much that it would result in rebuilding, then you do it. Or... you only do it if Howard stays for at least one more year - to make the Howard/West combo a 2-year plan.
We should be able to agree that the NBA is primarily a star-driven league. Teams with stars win, and teams without stars don't - and the Pistons were no exception - Billups, Hamilton and Wallace were all very good players in their primes (equivalent to Miller, Jackson and Smits in theirs).
We have a semi-star (Granger), a budding star (George), and a few very nice complimentary pieces (West, Hansbrough, DC, Hibbert). I think the goal in the NBA is to have at least two stars, preferably three. A Dwight Howard deal (assuming we keep Granger or George) allows us to have two. This would be an improvement, at least over the short term. Long term, it might disrupt everything. I would be excited about it though, if it happened, and so long as we didn't give up every piece we need to go forward.
You have to figure that their best current offer is for Lopez and five late first round picks. That is the problem I think with the Magic trying to trade him. All the teams that he is supposedly interested in going to only have very late first round picks, which might as well be a bunch of second rounders in terms of value.
I just think that the Magic will not end up getting enough value to warrant trading him, unless they can drop a bad contract or two along the way, which we can offer them as well.
"Your course, your path, is not going to be like mine," West says. "Everybody is not called to be a multimillionaire. Everybody's not called to be the president. Whatever your best work is, you do it. Do it well. … You cease your own greatness when you aspire to be someone else."
Silly idea. Financially, you want to build a team that competes for years. A team that buries the Malice in the Palace. One that brings back attendance and increases value.
The Sheed example is plain wrong. He wasn't a rental. This, however, would be seen as exactly that. Your title chances would be 20% at best. The media would not be kind, to put it mildly.
It's a fantasy basketball trade.
I wouldn't gut our team for howard when we can just offer him or deron williams a max contract in the offseason and if he comes here great, and if not then oh well. I think we'd be at least considered depending on how this season shakes out I think we'll do better than the nets or the magic end up doing.
Yeah I was trying to use the trade machine but is not letting me do a 3 team trade, the idea was like this:
Indiana trades: Roy+DC+picks to Orlando for Howard and Lance+pick for Nash
Nash,PG,Danny,West,Howard should do it leaving a bench of Hill,Price,DJ,Tyler,Lou,Foster.
Dwight will get more in return and Nash would get a lot more in return.
I would rather let Nash retire a sun than get Lance and picks. You seem to forget the only reason people go see the Suns play is to see Nash he is a money maker even if the Suns suck.
The interesting thing is that ROy and DC are up for paydays anyway. If you could promise me a Howard would get us into the Finals then sure but my guess is that Howard would be sitting the bench in foul trouble against the Heat.
No way. These superstar demand/team-ups are very specific. They want (1 to play with at least one other superstar and (2 to play in a big market and/or warm climate. If the Pacers do trade for Dwight and even if they somehow make the Finals (very unlikely), even then Dwight will bolt for Dallas or Brooklyn in the summer.
Besides, if Orlando is fine with trading Dwight to a team not on his wishlist (New Jersey, LA, Dallas), Chicago will be able to outbid everyone.
I think Larry, David and Kevin have decided to build a team based on depth, not superstars. They're not going to risk trading pieces they like for a rental.
WE ARE NOT GETTING ERIC GORDON
The rumor was that NJ was offering Lopez+3picks for Howard, Roy+DC+picks> Lopez+picks in my opinion.
Regarding Nash and Phoenix, he is going to leave next year and according to some rumors it looks like Phoenix is willing to trade him, Nash is 37 and nobody is going to offer much for him I don't think.
If Nash were to be traded, they could get more for Nash that than ****** offer you presented. No one loves Lance's talent as much as Larry Bird. Which means his value isn't high.
It used to be said that the team that trades a superstar always was the loser in the trade.
I would argue that Denver got the best of the Anthony trade, Utah got the best of the Williams trade and New Orleans got the best of the Paul trade.
As far as Howard no way you give up major assets for a rental. If you lose that gamble it sets the franchise back 2-3 years.
Again Lopez (with a broken foot by the way) and 5picks< Roy+DC+picks, Roy is equal of better than Lopez and DC is a least worth few picks right? if DC and Roy keep looking the way they are looking now I don't think is crazy to think that Orlando would take the deal.