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Thread: JOB's influence on Vogel

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    Member Merz's Avatar
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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    Why is Troy Murphy getting more minutes than Mcroberts in LA? Wasn't job fired for this same offense?
    Yes, JOB was fired LAST season (a season in which Murphy was not on the team) because he was giving Troy more minutes than McBob.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    The irony of this is that yesterday I had a post all written, typed and placed on the board but deleted before I hit send called "exercising the devil".

    It was a post that I was going to declare to be my last piece about JOB and although in the future I reserved the right to take pot shots at him I was pretty much done and was inviting others to join me. In it I listed out several things both good and bad about O'Brien. However at the end I decided against posting because I wasn't sure if it was to soon or even maybe it was to late.
    Pot shots get snide comments back sometimes, its all in good fun.

    It's the people who made the ," we can't judge these players because they are being destroyed by JOB's presence"" claims that compel me to point out that they used Josh Mcroberts greatness as there lightning rod for all that JOB did wrong. The original poster has tried patting himself on the back since JOB was fired, I just want to point out that a lot of the things they say JOB was horrifically wrong about, in reality didn't matter. This thread was obviously created to bait people who do not exist into an argument with people who were always just pretending that JOB supporters existed. Anyone who thought JOB was competent to tie his own shoes was treated as a supporter and therefore the enemy. The truth is JOB let players sit on the bench who ultimately weren't part of this franchises future, it didn't matter.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    I just want to point out that a lot of the things they say JOB was horrifically wrong about, in reality didn't matter.
    It did matter! Jim was talking about how the Pacers weren't good enough to even make the playoffs last season.

    Them making the playoffs, and then competing with the Bulls even for that short of a series completely changed the course of this franchise. The results that we were hoping to see in a couple of years happened overnight. Literally.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    Pot shots get snide comments back sometimes, its all in good fun.

    It's the people who made the ," we can't judge these players because they are being destroyed by JOB's presence"" claims that compel me to point out that they used Josh Mcroberts greatness as there lightning rod for all that JOB did wrong. The original poster has tried patting himself on the back since JOB was fired, I just want to point out that a lot of the things they say JOB was horrifically wrong about, in reality didn't matter. This thread was obviously created to bait people who do not exist into an argument with people who were always just pretending that JOB supporters existed. Anyone who thought JOB was competent to tie his own shoes was treated as a supporter and therefore the enemy. The truth is JOB let players sit on the bench who ultimately weren't part of this franchises future, it didn't matter.
    Yep only players like Hansbrough, Roy and DC guys that were never Part of the future.... Oh wait.........

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    The truth is JOB let players sit on the bench who ultimately weren't part of this franchises future, it didn't matter.

    Yup, you're right. Completely agree. Paul George, Tyler Hansbrough, Darren Collison, and Roy Hibbert are NOT part of this franchise's future.

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    The Doctor's In The House TheDon's Avatar
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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Well other than allowing Vogel to get his foot in the door obie also managed to suck hard enough everywhere he went to allow Vogel to progress up the ladder to where he is today. So....yay obie

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    I didn't say nothing mattered. Troy Murphy playing over mcroberts didn't matter. Ford playing over Aj didn't matter. Vogel getting his shot mattered a great deal. Our young guys developed just fine.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    Our young guys developed just fine.

    Only because they actually got consistent playing time once Obie was ****-canned.

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    OK so it took two months to cure rehabilitate, and grow our youth. our guys have worked a lot harder and longer than that. Larry deserves a lot more credit than that.

    vogel deserves more credit than that as well.

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    Last edited by spazzxb; 12-29-2011 at 05:02 PM.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    OK so it took two months to cure rehabilitate, and grow our youth. our guys have worked a lot harder and longer than that. Larry deserves a lot more credit than that.

    vogel deserves more credit than that as well.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
    I don't know why your scoffing at the notion. Jim is the one who told us that the Pacers weren't good enough to even make the playoffs last year.

    Clearly, he was wrong in his assessment of how good/bad the Pacers actually were.


    It just amazes me that anyone can still defend the man and pretend like he was doing a good job.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I don't know why your scoffing at the notion. Jim is the one who told us that the Pacers weren't good enough to even make the playoffs last year.

    Clearly, he was wrong in his assessment of how good/bad the Pacers actually were.


    It just amazes me that anyone can still defend the man and pretend like he was doing a good job.
    I'm condemning the vague all-ecompasing hate. i am not defending anyone. Job hate is not a license to be wrong. Lol

    Edit: I did defend Bird and Vogel.


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    Last edited by spazzxb; 12-29-2011 at 05:23 PM.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    OK so it took two months to cure rehabilitate, and grow our youth. our guys have worked a lot harder and longer than that. Larry deserves a lot more credit than that.

    vogel deserves more credit than that as well.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
    It took longer than two months for Roy to put some of the weight back after losing a bunch of weight so he could get some playing time.

    Sent from my iphone from my house and not a galaxy.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    I think people get a notion in their head of something being a certain way and then instead of simply admitting that they might be wrong or just agree to disagree they'd rather defend it to the bitter end.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    You're doing both. You're telling us what Jim did and didn't do, doesn't matter.

    The Pacers weren't a playoff team with Jim as the HC.
    The Pacers were a playoff team with Frank as the HC.

    What was the difference between the Pacers Jim coached and the Pacers Frank coached? Jim and Frank. Exact same players and team. Different coaches.

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    Roy lost bad weight then added good weight. Both needed to happen.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Sent from my iphone from my house and not a galaxy.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Merz View Post
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    Yes, JOB was fired LAST season (a season in which Murphy was not on the team) because he was giving Troy more minutes than McBob.
    No, he got fired last season for giving Posey more minutes than Tyler or McBob depending on which one he decided to sit that night. Go back and listen to Bird's presser when he got fired. That was definitely a part of the reason he was removed.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    You're doing both. You're telling us what Jim did and didn't do, doesn't matter.

    The Pacers weren't a playoff team with Jim as the HC.
    The Pacers were a playoff team with Frank as the HC.

    What was the difference between the Pacers Jim coached and the Pacers Frank coached? Jim and Frank. Exact same players and team. Different coaches.
    Oh God someone is going to get on here and talk about strength of schedule, this was a big twitter thing last year for the last few remaining O'Brien supporters and the rare (but out there still) Vogel haters.

    They would tell you that Frank took over at the weak part of the schedule & while there is a ring of truth to that it doesn't tell the entire story.

    I tried to get them to explain to me if the only difference was the caliber of opponet how did we beat both the Bucks & the Hawks after Frank took over when Jim's teams hadn't beaten either in years.

    However all you have to do to know the one single difference between Vogel & O'Brien is know this. The day Jim was fired the person who had played the most min. for us at the power forward position till that time in the season was not Josh was not Tyler it was James Posey. The moment Vogel took over James went to the bench, played a couple of complimentry min. here and there and then was done for the season and did not come back this year.

    The day that Blake Griffen scored 47 points against us, Tyler played two less min. that Posey and Josh did not play at all due to coach's decision. That's right you have a young energetic jack rabbit power forward so to counter him let's make sure to put old out of shape small forward who we will call a power forward.

    But only thing worse was the time that he had James guard A. Staudimire for three straight possesions in N.Y. only to have him score at will on him three straight times. That is the day I lost my mind and that is the day he should have been fired.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by DonSwanson View Post
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    There is an irony to all of this that many overlook...
    I liked your comparison of JOB 10 years ago vs. Vogel now. I have to admit I've never really thought of it in that light.

    I do have one comment. A lot of folks will miss out and not read your post because there is no white space.

    Seriously, paragraphs are your friends.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    The day that Blake Griffen scored 47 points against us, Tyler played two less min. that Posey and Josh did not play at all due to coach's decision. That's right you have a young energetic jack rabbit power forward so to counter him let's make sure to put old out of shape small forward who we will call a power forward.
    Until the day I die, I will swear that Slick was almost ready to go down and punch out O'Brien's light and take over the reigns that game.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    ...However all you have to do to know the one single difference between Vogel & O'Brien is know this...
    In response to your original post of this thread, I think we should all realize why you subconsciously chose not to post your JOB thread.

    It was too soon. Not too late. There is still a lot of anger and emotion there.

    By the way, I am the pot calling out the kettle.

    Edit:

    I recognize the emotion very well, because that is exactly how I felt watching Jalen Rose not play defense. And, after the Phoenix game, that is exactly how I felt every time I saw Tinsley in a Pacer uniform.
    Last edited by beast23; 12-29-2011 at 05:55 PM.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Yeah I remember the time when the strategy was to leave Melo open by the 3 point line because his shooting porcentage from there was low



    edit: Or the day he decided to watch up with the Lakers by playing Murphy at center and Dunleavy at power forward
    Last edited by vnzla81; 12-29-2011 at 05:55 PM.

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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Here is a video of Roy when Jim got fired, he looks so happy.



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    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman21 View Post
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    No, he got fired last season for giving Posey more minutes than Tyler or McBob depending on which one he decided to sit that night. Go back and listen to Bird's presser when he got fired. That was definitely a part of the reason he was removed.
    I was being sarcastic...but anyway, there was plenty of reasons to fire JOB not just that one as the previous poster was stating.

  33. #50

    Default Re: JOB's influence on Vogel

    Peck, you should post it, I always enjoy your insight.

    The biggest difference between the two coaches is the positive enthusiasm Frank brings. Look up the last few post game interviews Jim had before he was fired. He was a miserable, beaten man. They are hard to watch. Jim had no feel for chemistry and he always negated the identity of the team.

    Frank saw the team's players wanting to play "smashmouth" and has been spot on so far in being able to implement that style.

    Unlike some of you guys, I don't think playing Troy 36mpg gave us the best chance to win. He consistently led the team in +/- with emphasis on the -.

    We saw time and time again whenever Troy was out from injury, the team played much better!









    Five Game Win Streak... just sayin!

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