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Thread: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

  1. #26
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    George Hill is still rusty overall, but he makes great passes into the post. This could make a real difference for our team
    I agree. I think he is a better passer than Collison.

    The scouting I did on him are long forgotten, but I wanted no part of him coming out of UCLA because...he was all about his own dribble and not about running the court.

    He's better, yes, but his strongest passing is still working out of the PnR where he's leaning on his quickness with the ball to create a lane. If he has to spot a lane or make a tough feed with a clever pass, that's just not his thing.

    PnR with DC and West/Hans should be pretty reliable though.


    Hill isn't just rusty either, I think he's also still trying to feel out the roster and how he fits. He's younger than West and is coming off the bench with a less clear directive. West is the post scorer and stays out of the way on plays for Roy. Hill is being asked to be a PG dribble/attacker but also a true SG shooter and sometimes just a defender. He's got the classic "jack of all trades" type of bench role that can be tough for some players.

    As he learns the team and can identify what he needs to be on any given night I think we will see his game really step up. Right now it often feels like he's trying to stay out of the way.

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  3. #27
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    I agree. I think he is a better passer than Collison.

    The scouting I did on him are long forgotten, but I wanted no part of him coming out of UCLA because...he was all about his own dribble and not about running the court.

    He's better, yes, but his strongest passing is still working out of the PnR where he's leaning on his quickness with the ball to create a lane. If he has to spot a lane or make a tough feed with a clever pass, that's just not his thing.

    PnR with DC and West/Hans should be pretty reliable though.


    Hill isn't just rusty either, I think he's also still trying to feel out the roster and how he fits. He's younger than West and is coming off the bench with a less clear directive. West is the post scorer and stays out of the way on plays for Roy. Hill is being asked to be a PG dribble/attacker but also a true SG shooter and sometimes just a defender. He's got the classic "jack of all trades" type of bench role that can be tough for some players.

    As he learns the team and can identify what he needs to be on any given night I think we will see his game really step up. Right now it often feels like he's trying to stay out of the way.
    Please tell me though that his shooting is rusty, God I don't think I can take a season of his paint chipping shots.


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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Please tell me though that his shooting is rusty, God I don't think I can take a season of his paint chipping shots.
    Last year he was absolutely money from either corner from 3.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Please tell me though that his shooting is rusty, God I don't think I can take a season of his paint chipping shots.
    His shooting is rusty, happy now?






    In all seriousness as you might know I have been a Hill fan since his 1st day in the NBA, I love how he controls the game, plays D and how he can shoot the ball, everybody's shot right now is off, I would give it some time.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..... you're not supposed to mention Jones playing any form of positive role on the club. Don't you know that he is a black hole on offense and his defense has always been over rated?

    In all honesty though I agree that he has played fairly well when he is on the floor and I think everybody (including both his coach's and team mates) knows that he is never going to be confused with Steve Nash as an offensive facilitator. In fact it is one of the concerns that I have with the bench with Tyler being put there, neither of these guys are known for sharing the ball. Let's just hope that it works out in the long run.
    I'm fine with everything I've seen from DJ this season except 3 pt attempts. He's just a guy who should be banned from shooting beyond the arc unless the shot clock is expiring.

    EDIT: Well maybe that and an occasional corner 3 ball.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    I agree. I think he is a better passer than Collison.

    The scouting I did on him are long forgotten, but I wanted no part of him coming out of UCLA because...he was all about his own dribble and not about running the court.

    He's better, yes, but his strongest passing is still working out of the PnR where he's leaning on his quickness with the ball to create a lane. If he has to spot a lane or make a tough feed with a clever pass, that's just not his thing.

    PnR with DC and West/Hans should be pretty reliable though.


    Hill isn't just rusty either, I think he's also still trying to feel out the roster and how he fits. He's younger than West and is coming off the bench with a less clear directive. West is the post scorer and stays out of the way on plays for Roy. Hill is being asked to be a PG dribble/attacker but also a true SG shooter and sometimes just a defender. He's got the classic "jack of all trades" type of bench role that can be tough for some players.

    As he learns the team and can identify what he needs to be on any given night I think we will see his game really step up. Right now it often feels like he's trying to stay out of the way.
    I hope you are right about Hill just trying to stay out of the way.

    I am still reminded of the articles that were posted here that indicated the high level of frustration that Popovich had with respect to Hill being very passive offensively, and that he tended to drift to the corner and stay there. Sounds pretty much familiar, especially with his sharing the traits of being a good defender and passer.

    Hopefully, for the extra money, we upgraded the maturity level of Brandon with the added benefit of having another point guard at times when Collison can't handle the load. We will see.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Dgreenwell3 View Post
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    I have always liked DJ, he is a good ball player. He isn't an offensive machine by any estimation but his defense is great and having a guy like him never hurts. Just ask yourself: who would you rather have him or thabo sefolosha? Thabo starts for the thunder usually and is basically just a defender.
    Sefolosha easily he knows his role and doesn't take bad shots and isnt a black hole.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..... you're not supposed to mention Jones playing any form of positive role on the club. Don't you know that he is a black hole on offense and his defense has always been over rated?

    In all honesty though I agree that he has played fairly well when he is on the floor and I think everybody (including both his coach's and team mates) knows that he is never going to be confused with Steve Nash as an offensive facilitator. In fact it is one of the concerns that I have with the bench with Tyler being put there, neither of these guys are known for sharing the ball. Let's just hope that it works out in the long run.
    When he came down with that rebound and started bringing the ball up, everybody in the state knew he was going to try to take it all the way.

    The opposing team did, too, and when he went straight into the paint against three guys and got swatted, there's no way on earth you were surprised.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    When he came down with that rebound and started bringing the ball up, everybody in the state knew he was going to try to take it all the way.

    The opposing team did, too, and when he went straight into the paint against three guys and got swatted, there's no way on earth you were surprised.
    I was more peeved when he of all people got caught in the lane gazing at the ball in the corner, while Johnson was striding behind him for the pass and open dunk... my first reaction was 'who's man was that?!' The replay showed the whole thing.... ugly from a 'known for his defense' guy.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..... you're not supposed to mention Jones playing any form of positive role on the club. Don't you know that he is a black hole on offense and his defense has always been over rated?

    In all honesty though I agree that he has played fairly well when he is on the floor and I think everybody (including both his coach's and team mates) knows that he is never going to be confused with Steve Nash as an offensive facilitator. In fact it is one of the concerns that I have with the bench with Tyler being put there, neither of these guys are known for sharing the ball. Let's just hope that it works out in the long run.
    This is where I am with Inferno.....but I think that Vogel just needs to remind Inferno that he was brought in for a specific role and that if he sticks to that role and does very little else...that he'd be far more productive. IMHO...Bird brought him in to be a defensive Role Player and his veteran experience...not his offense. I would hope that there is one "go-to" move that Inferno can take on and simply stick to it if he ever finds himself in a situation that he can take advantage of on the offensive end. If he doesn't find himself in that situation where he can score using his "go-to" move...then he should simply pass the ball.

    I agree....I don't like his black hole tendencies....but I think that part of the blame should be put on Vogel himself for not reigning him in when he gets the ball on the offensive end and tries to do too much.

    Yes, Inferno should realize that he shouldn't try to do a very bad impression of LeDecision....but at the same time....Vogel shouldn't do his impression of Mike Brown ( a la his time with the Cavs ) and simply allow Inferno do whatever he wants on the offensive end ( such as his bad impression of LeDecision ) when it is clearly affecting the offense.

    The bottomline is that if a role player doesn't fulfill his role and tries to do more then what he was likely brought in to do...then it's part of the Coach's responsibility to tell him to stop doing it.
    Last edited by CableKC; 12-30-2011 at 01:14 PM.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Ruining the Raptors home debut

    Hansbrough has passed the ball well in the first 2 games.. had 3 assists the first game and a few nice passes against the Raptors that didnt result in anything. So he is definitely looking to give up the ball instead of forcing up a shot all the time.

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