Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 29

Thread: Hibbert vs. Smits

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Member Wilk39's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Logansport, IN
    Posts
    70

    Default Hibbert vs. Smits

    I was just a little kid when the Pacers were title contenders in the mid 90s and I remember watching a lot of games but I didn't critique the players like I do so much today. Like all young Indiana kids, Reggie was my favorite and I depicted myself as number thirty-one numerous times in my driveway. I also know Mark Jackson was good, The Davis boys were good, and Smits was good. I don't remember a whole lot about their play, however.

    So, my question to those of you who can recall is, who was a better player? Who would win a matchup between the two today?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Being only 22 and knowing the difference between the today's game and the era before it, and watching Roy struggle mightily against mediocre at best centers I can't imagine Smits not having his way

  3. #3
    Member Pacergeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    3,462

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Smits was better. He was unguardable offensively

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Pacergeek For This Useful Post:

    owl

  5. #4
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Downtown baby
    Posts
    12,618

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Smits was better. He was unguardable offensively
    I agree.

    Roy is a little better as a shot blocker and rebounder, and more than a little better defending in the post.

    But Rik was an unstoppable scoring machine right out of the gate. Who's stopping a guy that tall on a turn around baseline jumper?

    Just go get the Pacers DVD and watch the 8 in 8.9 game. It's 47 minutes of the Rik Smits show followed by Reggie stealing the limelight with the only big scoring he did all game. They just let Rik punish Ewing all night.


    However Roy does have talent and could still be developing and finding his game. He does have hints of Rik-caliber to him where you'd count on 16-8 every night.

    The most remarkable remark that evening were Peck's words; "Smits sure played a hell of a lot tougher then i remember!"
    Peck has questionable memory on a lot of the good old days, at least when it comes to toughness. He was blinded by love.

  6. #5
    Feed the big fella. Infinite MAN_force's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Broadripple
    Age
    28
    Posts
    2,253

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by IUfan4life View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Being only 22 and knowing the difference between the today's game and the era before it, and watching Roy struggle mightily against mediocre at best centers I can't imagine Smits not having his way
    Smits was considered a huge disappointment for his first few years, he did not become the player he is remembered as until much later. Big men take time.

    Which is exactly why we need to give Roy more time, because I think he could be better than Smits. He's already a better rebounder and defensive presence... he'll probably never be quite as good offensively, but I think he could get close.
    "As a bearded man, i was very disappointed in Love. I am gathering other bearded men to discuss the status of Kevin Love's beard. I am motioning that it must be shaved."

    - ilive4sports

  7. The Following 17 Users Say Thank You to Infinite MAN_force For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  8. #6
    Feed the big fella. Infinite MAN_force's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Broadripple
    Age
    28
    Posts
    2,253

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Comparing Hibbert to Smits in his prime is the wrong approach, lets look at third year production. I'm gonna use PER36 stats to make up for the minutes disparity. (Smits averaged 22 MPG vs. Hibbert's 27 MPG)

    Rik Smits, 3rd year, PER36:

    PPG: 17.6
    RPG: 7.6
    ASSIST: 1.8
    BLK: 2.4
    FG%: 48%

    Roy Hibbert, 3rd year, PER36:

    PPG: 16.4
    RPG: 9.8
    ASSIST: 2.7
    BLK: 2.3
    FG% 46%

    Not surprisingly, Smits shows slightly better offensive numbers scoring an extra point per game and with slightly better FG% (yet both are under 50% at this point). Roy is the clearly superior Rebounder and Passer, and despite the fact that their shotblocking numbers are showing similar, I think we all know Roy is much more of a factor in this area that Smits ever was.

    In Rik Smits prime he was an 18/7 guy with 2 assists and 1 block per game, shooting about 52% from the field.

    I could see Roy hitting 17/9, 3 assists, 2 blocks, 50% type territory. If I'm projecting a guess. Slightly less on offense but a better overall defensive presence.
    "As a bearded man, i was very disappointed in Love. I am gathering other bearded men to discuss the status of Kevin Love's beard. I am motioning that it must be shaved."

    - ilive4sports

  9. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Infinite MAN_force For This Useful Post:


  10. #7
    Member Reginald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Fishers, IN
    Posts
    193

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Comparing Hibbert to Smits in his prime is the wrong approach...
    Actually, breaking it down into a simple statistical analysis is the wrong approach. Smits raised his game against the elite centers of his day. I'll eat my shirt if Roy is a career 17/9 guy versus the Dwight Howards of the league.
    "Reggie Miller is the hardest player to guard." --Kobe Bryant

    "Playing Reggie Miller drives me nuts. It's like chicken-fighting with a woman." --Michael Jordan

  11. #8
    pacer fan since 88-89 Mr_Smith's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Indianapolis/Noblesville
    Age
    34
    Posts
    2,504

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Smits was better by far. Better jump hook and shooting. Hibberts feet are obviously healthier though so far.
    And the walls came tumbling down.....

  12. #9
    Member owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    4,234

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    In Rik Smits prime he was an 18/7 guy with 2 assists and 1 block per game, shooting about 52% from the field.

    1block??? Smits was a legit 7'4". With a wingspan to boot.
    {o,o}
    |)__)
    -"-"-

  13. #10
    Pacer Pride, Colts Strong Kid Minneapolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,476

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Hm.... I'm gonna say Roy is better defensively, better rebounder, but Smits was WAY better offensively. His post-game and mid-range shooting was smooth as hell.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to Kid Minneapolis For This Useful Post:


  15. #11

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    If we're talking about Smits in his prime vs. Hibbert now, Smits would destroy Hibs. Smits used to put up 15-20 on Hakeem, Shaq (in his prime), Ewing, etc. Hibbert is a better rebounder, and Smits almost never blocked a shot for as big as he was, but Smits was money from the high post. If his feet had been better, and if he'd been paired up with Bird or a coach who used the high post more, like Adelman, I think he'd be remembered a lot differently than he is today.

  16. #12
    Pacers fan in FL Deadshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    FLORIDA
    Posts
    1,936

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Eindar View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    If we're talking about Smits in his prime vs. Hibbert now, Smits would destroy Hibs. Smits used to put up 15-20 on Hakeem, Shaq (in his prime), Ewing, etc.
    Do we have access to any career statlines against specific players? I would love to check out his whole line against those three guys and Robinson.

  17. #13
    Member Drewtone's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Ottawa, CA
    Age
    45
    Posts
    508
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadshot View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Do we have access to any career statlines against specific players? I would love to check out his whole line against those three guys and Robinson.
    I don't have access, but check his games against Ewing in the 1994 and 1995 series against the Knicks... I remember some games he scored in the 20's.

    Also, his up and under against Tree Rollins with less than 2 seconds left to beat Orlando was the loudest I ever heard MSA.
    "I mean, you'd walk into our dressing room and run into Mel Daniels holding a .45 -- it makes you wonder."

    Bob Netolicky

  18. #14
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    3,656
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadshot View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Do we have access to any career statlines against specific players? I would love to check out his whole line against those three guys and Robinson.
    Head2Head Finder | Basketball-Reference.com

    Rik Smits vs. Patrick Ewing


    Rik Smits vs. Shaquille O'Neal


    Rik Smits vs. Hakeem Olajuwon


    Rik Smits vs. David Robinson


    Roy Hibbert vs. Dwight Howard



    Roy's only played 18.6 mpg versus Howard due to foul trouble, but he's been fairly productive relative to his playing time. He dropped 19/10/3 on him last season, and 26/8/3/4 the season-before-last, so we know he can produce against Dwight as long as he can stay on the court.

  19. #15
    STRAIGHT UP pizza guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Indiana
    Age
    26
    Posts
    4,011
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Right now, Smits wins this one. But I do think that David West's presence and leadership is going to really help Roy, and I think Roy's ceiling can be pretty high.

    Roy's work ethic + West's influence + time to grow = very bright future for Roy.

    It would not surprise me if we think of Roy as the better player when his career is over.
    BLUE COLLAR GOLD SWAGGER

    @The_Real_CJake

  20. #16
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    The Sprawl
    Age
    29
    Posts
    17,355

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Like others have said, if we closed the book on Roy right now, then Smits would easily be the better player. I think Roy could possibly get to Rik's level, but only time will tell.

  21. #17
    Member jeffg-body's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Anderson, IN
    Posts
    3,444
    Mood

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    At this time I'd say Smits was better but I would like to leave it open for the next few years to see how well Roy develops. I do think Smits would have been more dominant in this time because of his offensive prowless. Silky smooth shot and many post up moves. Centers these days are not what they used to be. He had to compete against much better centers in his days.

  22. #18
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    15,237

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    I watched many of the games Rik Smits played for the Pacers. Even as a younger player, Rik wasn't as physically weak in the paint. That is, he wasn't as easy to move and push around. Rik was also a better shooter and I don't think Roy will catch him in that department. Absolutely deadly from mid range. Also, while Smits improved I think I recall his issue being fouling too much and having major problems with his feet. Both of those issues kept him off the floor. While he certainly did improve, I think his talent was evident from the first couple years. Also, Rik was a capable passer unlike what some people might think here.

    As for defense, rebounds and shot-blocking, Roy has him beat hands down. Especially being a defensive presence and changing shots. I think Roy has shown a better capability to defend than score so far, which is the opposite of what I expected from him.

  23. #19

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    This is a tough comparison to make due to the fact that the centers Smits was going up against on a nightly basis were VASTLY better than what Roy is facing now. I mean, it's not even close.

  24. The Following User Says Thank You to bphil For This Useful Post:


  25. #20
    Member PR07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    4,959

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Going off memory, I'd say Smits was the superior midrange player, but I think Hibbert is a stronger interior presence in terms of inside scoring, rebounding, and shotblocking. All around, I'd say Smits may have him beat at this time, but that could certainly change if Roy can get more consistent.

  26. #21

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Smits took a looooooong time to assert himself. He finally stepped up in his 6th year. Until then, he was a bit of a wash. The Pacers were running the offense through him, but he was a real minus defensively and played only about 25 mpg.

    As others have mentioned, Rik is hard to compare. When healthy, in his prime, there wasn't much you could do to stop him. But that period was only about 3 years. Before then, he held promise but the reality was frustrating. He was a lousy rebounder, too. Then he was in his prime for 3 years, and just when you thought that might last for 10 years, the foot problems struck. He was still pretty good, but not quite the same.

    It's possible for Roy to have a better career. He's slow, but he moves better than Rik. A somewhat more active defender and rebounder. But offensively, Roy isn't there yet and he's certainly not the option #1 that Rik usually was. We shall see.

  27. The Following User Says Thank You to danman For This Useful Post:


  28. #22
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Dillon, Co
    Posts
    3,940

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by danman View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Smits took a looooooong time to assert himself. He finally stepped up in his 6th year. Until then, he was a bit of a wash. The Pacers were running the offense through him, but he was a real minus defensively and played only about 25 mpg.

    As others have mentioned, Rik is hard to compare. When healthy, in his prime, there wasn't much you could do to stop him. But that period was only about 3 years. Before then, he held promise but the reality was frustrating. He was a lousy rebounder, too. Then he was in his prime for 3 years, and just when you thought that might last for 10 years, the foot problems struck. He was still pretty good, but not quite the same.

    It's possible for Roy to have a better career. He's slow, but he moves better than Rik. A somewhat more active defender and rebounder. But offensively, Roy isn't there yet and he's certainly not the option #1 that Rik usually was. We shall see.
    Well put, he was really frustrating for the first several years and his prime was short lived. He drew a lot more attention then Roy does from opposing defenses and I don't think Roy is a better defender yet either. They're both poor rebounders for their size, Roy is a better shot blocker. However to be fair, comparing Roy to Smits for their first few years alone Rik only has a small edge. We'll see if Roy continues to improve to reach the level that Rik did.

  29. #23
    thx4tehmRys Danny! daschysta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Geist, Indianapolis
    Posts
    1,952
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Well put, he was really frustrating for the first several years and his prime was short lived. He drew a lot more attention then Roy does from opposing defenses and I don't think Roy is a better defender yet either. They're both poor rebounders for their size, Roy is a better shot blocker. However to be fair, comparing Roy to Smits for their first few years alone Rik only has a small edge. We'll see if Roy continues to improve to reach the level that Rik did.
    Super duper tall players are never great rebounders, that said Roy isn't a bad rebounder. per 36 he averaged about 10 RPG, plus he's pulled down 14 an 10 rebounds already this season. He's already a significantly better rebounder than Smits, and a better defender as well.

  30. #24
    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Age
    36
    Posts
    44,268

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    I've been saying for a while now that Smits is Hibbert's ceiling, and I still believe that.

  31. #25
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    London UK
    Posts
    8,699

    Default Re: Hibbert vs. Smits

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I've been saying for a while now that Smits is Hibbert's ceiling, and I still believe that.
    If he reaches that, we are very blessed
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

    If you've done 6 impossible things today?
    Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!


Similar Threads

  1. Roy Hibbert Seems to Be Adding to His Game
    By Hibbert in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 11-04-2010, 01:04 PM
  2. IndyStar: Offense running through Hibbert
    By Doddage in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 11-01-2010, 10:07 AM
  3. Hibbert Could Be Elite Center
    By 90'sNBARocked in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 10-13-2010, 10:10 PM
  4. Roy Hibbert is refreshing.
    By Hicks in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 76
    Last Post: 07-20-2008, 02:31 AM
  5. Smits in Charity Game!
    By Hoop in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-25-2004, 10:34 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •