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Thread: Calling my shots...David West is our..

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    Default Calling my shots...David West is our..

    David West will be our backup Center.

    Like many of you I didn't think he could play center at all but looking at how he played Noah I am convinced that Vogels experiment of playing West at Center worked and worked better than most had expected.

    First and foremost he held his ground and didn't give Noah and inch. This is no small feat and on a number of occasions albeit limited to 15 minutes he rooted Noah out of rebounding position and was able to score on him in the low post.

    You guys can call me crazy but last night even if it was only one preseason game proved to me that David West will get a large chunk of the back up center minutes.

    Even if you look at the starting centers in the East who will West not be able to defend? Howard... sure but no one can guard him and who else? Bogut? Those are the only two that come to mind and I am perfectly fine trotting out Foster for those two.

    The fact is Tyler and David are just too good not to play 30 minutes a piece and the only way that happens is if David plays some center along with Tyler at pf and from what I saw from last night that is very doable as long as everyone stays healthy and West gets back to game shape.

    I have to give thanks for Vogel for actually playing West last night and to Bird for being a good president and landing us a guy like West. Christmas came early for me..

    Predictions... 5th seed in the East and second round playoff team if everyone stays healthy.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-21-2011 at 10:51 AM.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    I disagree. I think you are forgetting about Amundson and Pendergraph.

    West will be starting at PF soon, with Hans backing him up. Do I think West will get some minutes at back C? Yes. But not as many as you do.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by HickeyS2000 View Post
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    I disagree. I think you are forgetting about Amundson and Pendergraph.

    West will be starting at PF soon, with Hans backing him up. Do I think West will get some minutes at back C? Yes. But not as many as you do.
    I didn't forget about them. I like those players but Amundson and Pendergraph all have very limited offensive games and thats why West will get the lions share of minutes at the backup Center position.

    You play the best players as long as they can handle the minutes and West is much better than those two.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    David West will be our backup Center.

    Like many of you I didn't think he could play center at all but looking at how he played Noah I am convinced that Vogels experiment of playing West at Center worked and worked better than most had expected.

    First and foremost he held his ground and didn't give Noah and inch. This is no small feat and on a number of occasions albeit limited to 15 minutes he rooted Noah out of rebounding position and was able to score on him in the low post.

    You guys can call me crazy but last night even if it was only one preseason game proved to me that David West will get a large chunk of the back up center minutes.

    Even if you look at the starting centers in the East who will West not be able to defend? Howard... sure but no one can guard him and who else? Bogut? Those are the only two that come to mind and I am perfectly fine trotting out Foster for those two.

    The fact is Tyler and David are just too good not to play 30 minutes a piece and the only way that happens is if David plays some center along with Tyler at pf and from what I saw from last night that is very doable as long as everyone stays healthy and West gets back to game shape.

    I have to give thanks for Vogel for actually playing West last night and to Bird for being a good president and landing us a guy like West. Christmas came early for me..

    Predictions... 5th seed in the East and second round playoff team if everyone stays healthy.
    I agree, I think there will be plenty of times that the pacers can have Hans and West at the same time. All depends on the other team, if the other team's center is not a huge offensive threat, then I think that David can be utilized effectively.
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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Center minutes: Hibbert 30, West 18

    Forward minutes: West 14, Hansbrough 28, Amundson 6

    Give or take

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  10. #6

    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    as long as west gets significant minutes.... I'm fine with wherever he plays

  11. #7

    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    David West will be our backup Center.

    Like many of you I didn't think he could play center at all but looking at how he played Noah I am convinced that Vogels experiment of playing West at Center worked and worked better than most had expected.

    First and foremost he held his ground and didn't give Noah and inch. This is no small feat and on a number of occasions albeit limited to 15 minutes he rooted Noah out of rebounding position and was able to score on him in the low post.

    You guys can call me crazy but last night even if it was only one preseason game proved to me that David West will get a large chunk of the back up center minutes.

    Even if you look at the starting centers in the East who will West not be able to defend? Howard... sure but no one can guard him and who else? Bogut? Those are the only two that come to mind and I am perfectly fine trotting out Foster for those two.

    The fact is Tyler and David are just too good not to play 30 minutes a piece and the only way that happens is if David plays some center along with Tyler at pf and from what I saw from last night that is very doable as long as everyone stays healthy and West gets back to game shape.

    I have to give thanks for Vogel for actually playing West last night and to Bird for being a good president and landing us a guy like West. Christmas came early for me..

    Predictions... 5th seed in the East and second round playoff team if everyone stays healthy.
    I was just getting ready to start a thread entitled, "Did Bird Make a Mistake With West?" when I saw your thread and since we are covering much the same ground I will integrate my thoughts here rather than on another thread.


    Does anyone else see a problem developing like I do? I don't think there is anyone on this forum who would argue against the fact that Tyler was by far our best player in these 2 preseason games. He has shown tremendous improvement over last year. That spin move early in the first quarter where he ended up being fouled was a thing of beauty and the man can draw fouls and hit them. I do not see how this team is going to win unless Tyler is getting 30 to 36 minutes a game. Now we have West who is also going to need his minutes but they are playing the same position. How are you going to work that out?

    It is beginning to look to me like Bird made a mistake and upgraded maybe the strongest position on the team not realizing the kind of development Tyler was going to make over the summer and now it is too late. If Tyler plays like he has West is not a bit better than Tyler and right now not as good (yeah, I know injury). It is beginning to look to me like Tyler and McRoberts could have handled the power forward position just fine and if the preseason is any indication the upgrades were needed elsewhere far worse and the money could have been spent there with better results for the team. We have some guys on this team that need to get their act together fast. If I am Bird I am still shopping for some players but it is late, probably too late.

    Finally, if it is said it is preseason and guys don't get excited about putting out and winning games I say this was not a normal preseason and besides I don't want players on my team that are not trying with all their might to win preseason or on the playground.

    (I add I think West is going to do fine for us but that does not resolve the problem. Can you play them both at the same time? That is what is going to have to happen to get Tyler sufficient minutes or else we are going to have a problem. Just one man's opinion. You are entitled to yours so don't get mad.)

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerHound View Post
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    I was just getting ready to start a thread entitled, "Did Bird Make a Mistake With West?" when I saw your thread and since we are covering much the same ground I will integrate my thoughts here rather than on another thread.


    Does anyone else see a problem developing like I do? I don't think there is anyone on this forum who would argue against the fact that Tyler was by far our best player in these 2 preseason games. He has shown tremendous improvement over last year. That spin move early in the first quarter where he ended up being fouled was a thing of beauty and the man can draw fouls and hit them. I do not see how this team is going to win unless Tyler is getting 30 to 36 minutes a game. Now we have West who is also going to need his minutes but they are playing the same position. How are you going to work that out?

    It is beginning to look to me like Bird made a mistake and upgraded maybe the strongest position on the team not realizing the kind of development Tyler was going to make over the summer and now it is too late. If Tyler plays like he has West is not a bit better than Tyler and right now not as good (yeah, I know injury). It is beginning to look to me like Tyler and McRoberts could have handled the power forward position just fine and if the preseason is any indication the upgrades were needed elsewhere far worse and the money could have been spent there with better results for the team. We have some guys on this team that need to get their act together fast. If I am Bird I am still shopping for some players but it is late, probably too late.

    Finally, if it is said it is preseason and guys don't get excited about putting out and winning games I say this was not a normal preseason and besides I don't want players on my team that are not trying with all their might to win preseason or on the playground.

    (I add I think West is going to do fine for us but that does not resolve the problem. Can you play them both at the same time? That is what is going to have to happen to get Tyler sufficient minutes or else we are going to have a problem. Just one man's opinion. You are entitled to yours so don't get mad.)
    so ur basing ur decisions on 2 preseason games where david west has only played 15 minutes in one game against one of the best defenses in the league?


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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by Jose Slaughter View Post
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    Center minutes: Hibbert 30, West 18

    Forward minutes: West 14, Hansbrough 28, Amundson 6

    Give or take
    So Foster is not going to play at all? I'm going to have to go with a big disagree on that one.
    DG for 3

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    It seems like you're probably onto something with this. Tyler is a heckuva ball player, but West is too. Put them both out there together for significant minutes, and that's a tough frontcourt to defend.

    I do, however, feel like upgrading at the PF spot was not as imperative as the SG spot. Once Vogel took over last year, I thought Tyler really made a big jump and showed that he would be a capable, if not very good starting PF in the NBA.
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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerHound View Post
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    It is beginning to look to me like Bird made a mistake and upgraded maybe the strongest position on the team not realizing the kind of development Tyler was going to make over the summer and now it is too late.[/SIZE][/FONT]
    Might need to give Bird the benefit of the doubt that West was the only major acquisition he could legitimately pull off. And he did it with a great contract.

    If that's true, then he has put us in a great position: we either find a way to utilize both players on the floor or we trade one of them while their stock is way up for a more strategic piece.

    My personal beef is that we did not go after Billups. I would have thrown up to $10 million to get him. He is exactly what we need to play at the next level, even if just for a year or two.
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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    As of right now, after the last 2 preseason games if Tyler keeps playing like he did in those games, you can't keep Tyler off of the floor. I say Tyler gets around 30 minutes a game. If West play center or whatever we will have to wait and see.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    I'd still say the "wing position" is our strongest position.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    96 minutes a game for bigs...

    West 30
    Hansbrough 30
    Roy 24
    And the rest based on matchup for a 4th big. Foster when we need him, or he feels good. Lou or JP (when healthy) otherwise.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    who cares as long as we win?

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerHound View Post
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    Does anyone else see a problem developing like I do? I don't think there is anyone on this forum who would argue against the fact that Tyler was by far our best player in these 2 preseason games. He has shown tremendous improvement over last year. That spin move early in the first quarter where he ended up being fouled was a thing of beauty and the man can draw fouls and hit them. I do not see how this team is going to win unless Tyler is getting 30 to 36 minutes a game. Now we have West who is also going to need his minutes but they are playing the same position. How are you going to work that out?
    I don't see it as much of a problem as some for two reasons:

    1) Tyler is going to be exhausted for the postseason if he is playing 36 minutes a game at his tempo with little space between games.

    2) I'm still not convinced Tyler's play is going to be as effective as West's in the postseason. A lot of Tyler's offense comes from being able to draw awkward fouls from his defender and if you look at last postseason he wasn't given those fouls at the same rate as the regular season. People can guard him tougher in the playoffs without worrying about fouling.

    Tyler can still be effective with his midrange game but if his shot is off (like most of last year's playoffs) he will again disappear.

    West's game on the other hand rely's on solid fundamentals. He is a true veteran that shouldn't have a lot of change from the regular season to the playoffs.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    RE: Tyler/West potentially turning into a minutes problem

    Not sure, but I am concerned, unless West at C some works as well as some here think it will. If he can't, will we be second guessing not stepping up to the plate for Nene? He would have given us the option to move Roy if need be. I still think he could have played some PF, too. Too early for those considerations. Let's see how West/Tyler pans out.
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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Foster's minutes in the regular season will be reduced, but let's not act like he won't play at all.

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  30. #19

    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerHound View Post
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    I was just getting ready to start a thread entitled, "Did Bird Make a Mistake With West?" when I saw your thread and since we are covering much the same ground I will integrate my thoughts here rather than on another thread.


    Does anyone else see a problem developing like I do? I don't think there is anyone on this forum who would argue against the fact that Tyler was by far our best player in these 2 preseason games. He has shown tremendous improvement over last year. That spin move early in the first quarter where he ended up being fouled was a thing of beauty and the man can draw fouls and hit them. I do not see how this team is going to win unless Tyler is getting 30 to 36 minutes a game. Now we have West who is also going to need his minutes but they are playing the same position. How are you going to work that out?

    It is beginning to look to me like Bird made a mistake and upgraded maybe the strongest position on the team not realizing the kind of development Tyler was going to make over the summer and now it is too late. If Tyler plays like he has West is not a bit better than Tyler and right now not as good (yeah, I know injury). It is beginning to look to me like Tyler and McRoberts could have handled the power forward position just fine and if the preseason is any indication the upgrades were needed elsewhere far worse and the money could have been spent there with better results for the team. We have some guys on this team that need to get their act together fast. If I am Bird I am still shopping for some players but it is late, probably too late.

    (I add I think West is going to do fine for us but that does not resolve the problem. Can you play them both at the same time? That is what is going to have to happen to get Tyler sufficient minutes or else we are going to have a problem. Just one man's opinion. You are entitled to yours so don't get mad.)
    I understand the concern but this year is different than most. Tyler and West playing 30 minutes is going to take its toll on them and we don't want to play them to much or else they'll be burned out by the post season.

    Obtaining West isn't a mistake if he can play some backup center minutes and its lookinig like he can especially in the East. West is a clear upgrade from McBob and thats important. No matter who is on the court we should be able to rely on West and Hans being able to score in the low post and off the pnr. Thats the difference from last year when the Pacers had McBob and Tyler.

    Teams in the East will have a handful with Tyler and West and just like last night I expect a lot of teams bigs to get into foul trouble trying to guard the Tyler West combo.

    Was the West signing a mistake? Not to me but I am biased..

    I also think we had very limited options at sg that would have actually upgraded that position.

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    My personal beef is that we did not go after Billups. I would have thrown up to $10 million to get him. He is exactly what we need to play at the next level, even if just for a year or two.
    Totally agree but maybe Billups wouldn't have wanted to come here and on top of that he isn't a long term fix being in his mid 30's. I really hope Collison gets his act together offensively.

    On a side note I though Collsion played much better D on Rose than he did during the playoffs.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-21-2011 at 12:32 PM.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    I totally agree that West can play center against all but a couple centers in the East, but even if that doesn't work out this is the best kind of issue to have. West and Hans are both very professional. This won't be a problem, and if Tyler and one of the back-up bigs turn out to develop into something great it will be extremely easy to trade one of the pfs. West has the perfect contract to trade if it came to that...which I don't think it will.

    Our cap space is going to be a huge asset in a couple months.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Calling my shots...David West is our.. back up power forward, yes if Tyler keeps playing the way he is playing there is not reason for him not to be the starter, I am really hoping that Hill starts playing better so we can send DC to the bench with West making our second unit one of the strongest second units in the NBA.


    1st unit: Hill,PG,DG,Tyler,Roy

    2nd unit: DC,Lance,DJ,West and Foster.

  33. #22

    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
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    Foster's minutes in the regular season will be reduced, but let's not act like he won't play at all.
    I am not expecting Foster to get more than 8-10 minutes on average this year.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    I am not expecting Foster to get more than 8-10 minutes on average this year.
    You may be right, but two of the minute projections above didn't have him playing at all.

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    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Why not Hansbrough have Hansbrough play some Backup Center minutes?

    He appears to be built much stronger, has a much better low-post "bang inside" scoring game and the hustle to match up against the smaller Big Men that we would be going up against that will be going Small Ball.

    West appears to be more of a finesse scorer that has a WAY better Mid-Range game.
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  37. #25

    Default Re: Calling my shots...David West is our..

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    Why not Hansbrough have Hansbrough play some Backup Center minutes?

    He appears to be built much stronger, has a much better low-post "bang inside" scoring game and the hustle to match up against the smaller Big Men that we would be going up against that will be going Small Ball.

    West appears to be more of a finesse scorer that has a WAY better Mid-Range game.
    Watching both of them play against Boozer last night I would say West was better against Boozer. Again I know this is a small sample size but I think West gives us a better chance against defending centers. I looked at how he muscled Noah a couple of times and it clearly bothered him.

    West has a finesse game but he can play strong as well. He gave Noah a shoulder to the chest that was brutal and lead to a easy layup.

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