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Thread: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

  1. #151
    Chairman of the Boards 90'sNBARocked's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    The Only true Max Players in the league are

    Kevin Durrant
    LeBron James
    Dwight Howard
    Dwayne Wade

    If not for their age I would add Dirk and Kobe
    Sittin on top of the world!

  2. #152
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by croz24 View Post
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    I truly hope the Pacers front office doesn't think like PD.
    Must of the people in PD agrees with you on this one

  3. #153
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    simon has shown willingness to spend big when we actually have a chance to win in the past, with the new LT, i'm not sure, but he'll spend to a reasonable extent imo.

    Pacers will go for someone in that price range or even higher imo. We have cap, we might as well put ourselves out there. We'll put the feelers out, probably won't happen fo course, but if we really could get EJ, you make the move and owrry about cutting costs after.
    Someone is going to have to answer this...but let's assume the following:

    1 ) The Pacers make a run at a Top Tier FA this season ( Nene, West, Tyson, whoever ) and end up paying between $9 to 14 mil a season ( depending on the Player ).
    2 ) The Pacers sign Foster to a 2 year deal for $2.5 mil a year
    3 ) There are no other major signings or trade of Draft Picks this season.

    In the 2012-2013 season, the Pacers salary Cap ( before re-signing Hibbert, BRush or GH ) would between $36 to 41 Mil that is tied to 9 Players ( including the 2012-2013 1st round pick ).

    I'm going to assume that Hibbert and GH are going to be the only ones that will be re-signed ( sorry, bye bye BRush ). Hibbert would likely command some contract offer that starts at $11 mil ( I will give Hibbert the benefit of the doubt and improves in his Contract year ) and GH tops off at $6.5 mil.

    If so and the FO convinces the Simon's that the Roster is the "real Deal" and can make it to the next level....I'm assuming that we could make a run for a 2nd Top Tier FA....but it would push the Pacers into LT territory AFTER we match/re-sign GH and Hibbert.

    Would we be able to make another Contract offer to a Starting Quality FA that tops off at $12-13 mil a year BEFORE we match or sign Hibbert and GH to their new contracts?
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  4. #154
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by 90'sNBARocked View Post
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    The Only true Max Players in the league are

    Kevin Durrant
    LeBron James
    Dwight Howard
    Dwayne Wade

    If not for their age I would add Dirk and Kobe
    Derrick Rose and many others Kobe and Dirk are maxs guys simply because they sell out arenas and jerseys this is a business. They make money off their names as much as their play. Melo may not play like a max guy but he sells like a max guy. There are way more max guys then what you mention imo.

  5. #155
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by 90'sNBARocked View Post
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    The Only true Max Players in the league are

    Kevin Durrant
    LeBron James
    Dwight Howard
    Dwayne Wade

    If not for their age I would add Dirk and Kobe
    I agree...but this goes back to the whole "overpaying for Players to come to Small Market Teams" argument.

    What's worse is that I know that it's not optimal and it sucks for Small Market Teams, but it is what it is.....these are the "unwritten rules" that we end up following. I know that there is no MAX Contract Offer Player that is currently on the FA Market and I don't want to overpay for a Player....but as long as you are convinced that a particular Player is a cornerstone piece that you want to have on your roster for the long term.....if you have to overpay for a Player like Nene or Tyson Chandler ...then you do it.
    Last edited by CableKC; 11-29-2011 at 07:34 PM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  6. #156

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    If you take the attitude that we should never (slightly) overpay for anyone, I doubt you'll see a Pacer championship in your lifetime. The key is to coordinate the timing of the overpaid/underpaid contracts.

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  8. #157
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by DrFife View Post
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    If you take the attitude that we should never (slightly) overpay for anyone, I doubt you'll see a Pacer championship in your lifetime. The key is to coordinate the timing of the overpaid/underpaid contracts.
    Exactly, championship teams are never under the cap.

  9. #158
    Chairman of the Boards 90'sNBARocked's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    Derrick Rose and many others Kobe and Dirk are maxs guys simply because they sell out arenas and jerseys this is a business. They make money off their names as much as their play. Melo may not play like a max guy but he sells like a max guy. There are way more max guys then what you mention imo.
    Thanks , I agree about Rose

    Knew I would leave someone off the list

    I meant MAX in terms of on court value not off court, sorry
    Sittin on top of the world!

  10. #159

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by DrFife View Post
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    If you take the attitude that we should never (slightly) overpay for anyone, I doubt you'll see a Pacer championship in your lifetime. The key is to coordinate the timing of the overpaid/underpaid contracts.
    No one should ever overpay for any player. If you "overpay" a guy and he is the last piece of a title team and you wouldn't have won without him, guess what? You didn't overpay. You paid accurately.

    "Overpaying" means you paid too much for a player, and you don't have enough talent on the court. That's why they are overpaid.

    You can't pay too much for a title. You can only pay too much to make winning a title impossible.

    With that said, I believe that paying Nene 17.5 million a year is too much because it will prevent us from acquiring enough talent to truly have a good chance at a title.

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  12. #160
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    14mil/yr for 4 years is 56mil. Will he get offered more than that?
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  13. #161

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    If the Pacers do sign (and I hope they don't...save the money and spend it on a couple others) Nene or David West to a big contract I hope they front load it so the salary decreases each year. There are way too many key players still playing on their rookie contracts to be paying big money to players who are not even all-stars (although close).

  14. #162
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    I'd really like to see us land Nene but I can't see offering him a max contract which would start at 25% of our cap.
    A 4 year contract starting at 12 mil would be slightly overpaying but I could live with it. A contract starting at 14 would be too much.
    As bad as I want Nene being patient with to see who is waived via amnesty is a good idea. I think if a team wants to waive a player this year they might want to do it as soon as possible before teams that are under the cap and are willing to offer more spend their cap space on free agents.
    Signing Brand and Roy off amnesty waivers with front loaded contracts and going after a top tier pg next season might make the most sense.

  15. #163
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    One thing to note....Nene is supposed to be fairly quick and agile for a 6'11" Big Man. If you stick him on some athletic PF, he won't be as detrimental to the defensive end when defending them compared to other Big Men in the league. I'm not saying that he's Josh Smith super quick and athletic...I'm just saying that his quickness and agility is somewhat disguised by his size and is a plus IMHO.
    I agree. Watch Vnzla's clip. The guys has some athleticism, particularly for his frame. He's also a decent passer and I would guess some of his footwork goes back to some soccer in Brazil in his youth? I think he plays both 4/5 and fits with Roy and Tyler. Roy can work the key and is also a very accomplished passer.

    If we did spend max on Nene, I would be a bit nervous, naturally. At the same time, I would not be disappointed. I think for a 4 - year window we could make at least equally "big" miscalculations elsewhere on other players. There's some luck/chance involved in this gambit, too. I think I'd rather go Nene than West if those were the options.
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Couldn't the Pacers do a sign and trade with Denver for Nene?
    We could send 2 second round picks(what Miami send Cleveland for Lebron) + Posey expiring+ DJ and young player? And sign him for about 13mil for five years? That could give us the flexibility to get another big Player this or next year.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Sign and Trades aren't really useful for a player anymore since they don't transfer his birds rights. No team is going to give up assets when they can sign the player outright unless they are bad assets (like posey), who as an expiring is useless to denver since their even further under the cap than we are. We wouldn't give up a young player of any value for him since we can just sign him outright.

  18. #166

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Did you know.... that the avg's based on 36 minutes per game has Hansbrough ahead of both Nene and Marc Gasol. Psycho T has only 99 games under his belt. The other 2 have 575 and 250 respectively. So who's as good now and who is probably going to get better
    "He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"
    Darnell Hillman (Speaking of former teammate Roger Brown)

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    1. Tyler plays a very high energy game less likely to translate to large minutes over the course of an entire season.

    2. Tyler isn't the defender those two are.

    3. Tyler is not nearly as efficient as those two are.

    4. Tyler isn't half the passer as gasol, nor blocks shots as well as either, the list goes on.

    Tyler isn't near the player that either nene or gasol are at this point and time.

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  21. #168
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    Sign and Trades aren't really useful for a player anymore since they don't transfer his birds rights. No team is going to give up assets when they can sign the player outright unless they are bad assets (like posey), who as an expiring is useless to denver since their even further under the cap than we are. We wouldn't give up a young player of any value for him since we can just sign him outright.
    But by the time his S&T contract would be up(5yrs from now) then we would hold his Bird rights... A player must be under contract for 3 years with a team I believe...

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